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Thank God For Laurence Maroney


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I am neither a Maroney basher or apologist. Realistically , I think there was some stuff to build on tonight, nothing more.

He showed improvement ( not excellence, like someone said) in one of the most important jobs for the RB in this offense, pass blocking and blitz pick up. He's not at Faulks level yet, nor Sammi Morris's .

He was good catching the ball, not excellent. Honestly, my grandmother could have taken that second swing pass for 40+ yards with no defenders within 20 yards and Welker blocking. Elite RB's take that to the house.

Faulk still brings more to the running game in between the tackles.

But it is something to build on. I'll be rooting hard for Maroney against Pittsburgh


I like your first two sentences. Let his play speak for itself. He has been working hard to improve his overall game, as he will need to continue to do. It is good to see him block well. He has obviously worked hard in that area.

Hopefully he will be leaned on in every game from now on. That would be terrific by me. It would show that the coaches have confidence in him.
 
Re: Than God For Laurence Maroney

I really didn't mean to be negative.... That was my honest assessment and I think it was pretty unbiased. Maroney is still a talent but he is RAW. And I agree with your points on Faulk -- he's a high standard to be comparing to in the passing game. Not many are better (he's Westbrook-like out there).

In a somewhat ironic twist, Maroney got his big yards because the Ravens didn't respect him on those passes / check downs. If that had been Faulk out there, he might have been covered.

And when Maroney is in the open field.... LOOK OUT. (Although I still think he could have taken that second play to the end zone. :D)

You made some good points, which can best be summed up as Maroney is very talented but still has work to do.

I can't help but find it amusing that we have the over-eager, jump to conclusions crowd battling it out with the 'chicken littles' once again. That is the history of this website. Screw being objective, just pick a side. :D
 
Maroney had one run that could be considered "indecisive" in the entire game. One. The 3rd and one where he was stopped. And even on that play, the replay showed that he was trying to go behind Mankins who didn't get any push whatsoever. Despite that, I do believe that an elite RB gets that first down.

No RB is taking the long reception to the house, that is completely wrong. And Maroney got good seperation from Lewis on the first reception, so I don't see the big deal there. Besides, I think that those criticizing his route running are comparing him to Faulk, who is probably the best receiving back in the entire league. LdT would look like an average receiver next to Faulk.[/QUOTE]

Now that's just dumb.
 
Maroney had one run that could be considered "indecisive" in the entire game. One. The 3rd and one where he was stopped. And even on that play, the replay showed that he was trying to go behind Mankins who didn't get any push whatsoever. Despite that, I do believe that an elite RB gets that first down.

No RB is taking the long reception to the house, that is completely wrong. And Maroney got good seperation from Lewis on the first reception, so I don't see the big deal there. Besides, I think that those criticizing his route running are comparing him to Faulk, who is probably the best receiving back in the entire league. LdT would look like an average receiver next to Faulk.[/QUOTE]

Now that's just dumb.

Great analysis. :rolleyes:

Faulk is the best receiving back in the league. If you feel differently, come with more than an insult.

Edit: Let me add this, LdT is a fine receiving back, but all he does is run screens and dump offs. And that is fine. But Faulk runs actual routes and NE will also regularly split him out wide. You will not find many other RBs in the league that are the first option (like Faulk is if he gets LB coverage) when they are split out wide.

This has nothing to do with how the run once the ball is in their hands. Faulk is the best route running and catching back in the league.

Edit again: Second best. Brian Westbrook is best.
 
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Perhaps the receiving performance you reluctantly laud Maroney for would be more apparent on his rushing attempts if *GASP* Brady didn't telegraph his handoffs so much!

Brady hands off to Faulk seemlessly. When he hands off to Maroney, it looks like August on a high school field. Hand off initiated...One, two...hand off completed. Defense already dialed in and attacking.

(Although, admittedly, this also works to open up play-action passing better...)

ALSO: Maroney was EXCELLENT in pass blocking.

Excellent points. These draw-action handoffs are painful to watch. Give the ball to a LaMa running with a head of steam, and let's see what happens.

And his pass-blocking was faultless, IIRC.
 
I want to reiterate, again, a point that some of the zero sum homers on here seem to be missing:

Many of the Maroney "detractors" think he has a spot on the team, myself included. I like him. When his hands get better he's going to be an incredible recieving threat. I do not, however, think he can get 2 yards when they're needed, nor do I see him breaking tackles or bullrushing people the way you want your feature back to do. Remember Dillon and his stiff arm? Lowering that shoulder and hurting people?

I'd like, in an ideal world, to see McFadden drafted and the Patriots have the best 1-2 rushing punch in the league to back up their incredible pass offense. Maroney could succeed in his role in that situation, and excel. I understand we have Morris, but he's getting older and I think a young stud would be a great addition. If we don't have a shot at him in the draft, fine, make do with what we have. But I don't think Maroney is a feature back in this league. That's not an anti-Pats sentiment.
 
I want to reiterate, again, a point that some of the zero sum homers on here seem to be missing:

Many of the Maroney "detractors" think he has a spot on the team, myself included. I like him. When his hands get better he's going to be an incredible recieving threat. I do not, however, think he can get 2 yards when they're needed, nor do I see him breaking tackles or bullrushing people the way you want your feature back to do. Remember Dillon and his stiff arm? Lowering that shoulder and hurting people?

I'd like, in an ideal world, to see McFadden drafted and the Patriots have the best 1-2 rushing punch in the league to back up their incredible pass offense. Maroney could succeed in his role in that situation, and excel. I understand we have Morris, but he's getting older and I think a young stud would be a great addition. If we don't have a shot at him in the draft, fine, make do with what we have. But I don't think Maroney is a feature back in this league. That's not an anti-Pats sentiment.

How bad did Maroney's hands look last night?

In an "ideal" world, the Patriots will draft a monster tackle with that draft pick from San Francisco, and find a linebacker in free agency. This team is fine at running back.
 
another congrats to maroney, and hopefully he can keep it up, i hope we keep seeing him play liek that the rest of the season...improving only...
 
I love how people attribute this to a deficiency in LoMar's game but fail to acknowledge the TERRIBLE performance of the OL run-blocking last night. Maroney did all that he could with that ridiculous jumble of OL and DL last night. But you guys want to blame HIM for that mess.

He had nowhere to run, but he did what you guys are CONSTANTLY wailing at him to do - he hit the hole and got what he could. Unbelievable how disingenuous some people can be. None of us is arguing that LoMar's perfect or that he hasn't been disappointing, but the vitriol directed at him is so deeply overstated and unbalanced - and TOTALLY unrealistic. He was a big reason we won last night. I don't see why it's such a tough thing for the haters to at least give him some credit for that obvious fact.

Herein lies one of the big reasons for the underwhelming performance of LaMa, so far. He simply has nowhere to run. I cannot recall one time last night during which LaMa failed to run through a hole that was visible to me. Now, perhaps Faulk is better able at this time to find the smallest space and somehow wiggle through it. I believe that, in time, LaMa will be able to do the same thing, given more snaps and experience.

The OL's run-blocking assignments need to be adjusted. When was the last time anyone saw either OG pull on a power sweep? I don't know if Minny's Adrian Peterson could do that much better with this offense's pass-blocking modus operandi.
 
All these Anti LOMO sentiments remind of the the steven king Novella "the misy" where one relgious zealot (NSA) starts with like one or two followers but since they necver shut up more an more people started to follow them and then they becam a majority. well i a firmly staying away from that group.

I believe that LoMo will be great i have seen flashes of it when her gets some holes to run through other wise he wouldn't average 4 yards a carry. And for the record I was aganst drafting him at the time that they did.
 
On two passing plays, he made the defender look like a blocking dummy.

He also looked natural catching the ball on the play action pass.

This is actually what's going to start getting Maroney on the field more often. If he can become consistantly good at pass pro than BB will start using him more often out of the spread. This would be nice, since I believe the spread offense would present him with a lot of space to work with if the Patriots send him out to the flat.

Watching that game I noticed (during live play) at least three nice blocks on Maroney's part.
 
You're right, he didn't drop two catchable balls.

Wait...
 
How bad did Maroney's hands look last night?

In an "ideal" world, the Patriots will draft a monster tackle with that draft pick from San Francisco, and find a linebacker in free agency. This team is fine at running back.

Fine at running back? A team that has to give the ball to Heath Evans on a 4th and 1 with the GAME ON THE LINE is fine at running back and couldn't use an upgrade?:rolleyes:
 
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Some possible Maroney scenarios, ranked worst to best:

1. His hands get no better, yesterday was a fluke and from now on he can't catch a cold. He regresses in all blocking assignments and blitz pickup, and his YPC dips under 4.

This is the opposite of the current trend. Given a cheap multiyear contract and no evidence or indication that this has happened or is likely to happen, this is not actionable speculation. Were we to see any signs of this, then it might be worth thinking about addressing it.

2. His hands are okay, but not spectacular. His ability to pick up blitzes and block are okay but not spectacular. He runs right at the league average of (I believe) 3.9 ypc.

This is still beneath his current level of performance, and the trend line is all wrong. But were this to occur, or were the trend line to run in this direction, it would be worth watching, and if we truly believe McFadden is a blue-chip can't-miss guy, maybe it's worth investigating the McFadden option. Probably not, given what that pick could be worth in depth. It may mean however reversion to an Antoine-Smithian level of production... something that might not be a season killer, given the receiving options

3. His hands are actually pretty good and getting better, and he's great "in space." He has goal line issues and still dances a bit too much. ("dance" = When he shifts foot to foot it's in the absence of a simultaneous forward lunge.) It's his style and cannot be corrected, so he will always get above average YPC, and is developing into a real sweet threat when used in space, but untrustworthy for short yardage.

Perhaps this is too much of a reaction to how he was used last night, but it's a credible possibility. Let's say this becomes the pattern for LoMo - a few catches in space, increasingly by design rather than checkdown. Some pitches. A little work between the tackles. Use Eckel and Evans as the battering rams. What does that make him? It makes him Kevin Faulk, but with years more tread left and the size to shoulder the load when it's required. Just as LoMo isn't the change-of-pace, quick shifty sure-handed 3rd down guy KF is, KF couldn't play game after game carrying 15 - 25 times like LoMo can (yes he's been injured, but the point is he has not been in a role, he's been the main guy on 1st and 2nd downs.) He brings enough that it makes no sense to go for a chance that you'll get that one stud that has it all in one package. We had Morris earlier this year, and if he comes all the way back the combination is great as far as a NE running threat goes. Again, very difficult to justify the argument that we "need" to change the tune.

4. His hands improve. His running in space continues to excel. His blitz pickup and blocking improves. The first few games of 07 in which he is TD-free are looked at as a puzzling fluke/sophomore slump. He hits the hole harder as time goes by, and all that tread we've saved by platooning him gives him a nice long career in NE. He's never a top 10 pick in your fantasy league but ends up as a lock for your #2 back year after year. You get the idea: he gets to the 1000 yard/10TD plateau, stays there. He gets the featured back job done, no ifs ands or buts, and you can count on him on 3rd and short and at the goal line, thanks to ongoing improvement on that fine line between "patience" a la the old Priest Holmes, and "dancing."

I actually see this as the positive version of the "most likely" scenarios. No, I do not mean to imply his production will ever rival Holmes in his prime, by the way, I was referencing the fact that patience is indeed a virtue, whereas too much patience, as it were, is a vice. It's all very Aristotle. Anyway... in this scenario there's no need for another RB. So before you tout this year's flavor of the year running back, you need to make sure you're getting that one stud running back, in any given draft, that's one for the ages. Remember that was supposed to be Reggie Bush? Well, he'll fill the stands. But right now, I'm taking LoMo at exactly the level we have him now. Why isn't anybody making that comparison, by the way? Bush was picked at the very top of the round LoMo was picked at the bottom of.... why hasn't anybody here mentioned how the "mighty" have fallen, in terms of Bush? Anyway, I do see scenario 4 as likely, with LoMo developing into a guy with a legit presence in the world of feature backs, not in that "elite" category we're always (unrealistically) hankering after. But a guy who can do many roles, who we would still back up with perhaps a Morris and an Eckel and an Evans, but who would make many of the skill sets represented there redundant (that's also called depth.) Again, I put this possibility as very likely, with "3" being the pessimistic outlook in which we need to shore up roles to complement LoMo, and "4" being the optimistic (yet just as likely) outlook.

5. The dream scenario: BB really does "love" Laurence Maroney, and we find out why in a very big way. Within a year, 100 yard rushing/100 yard receiving games become frequent events, and one or the other is virtually guaranteed. His total TDs plateau in the high teens every year. He becomes an elite running back. It's just a matter of coaching out some bad habits, using him correctly, etc. The presence of the receiving corps we have now is in large part retained, keeping extra men out of the box on opposing defenses. After this down patch, he becomes scarier and scarier, starting with the 07 playoffs and blooming into an LT-like threat in 2008.

Uh yeah. Well anyway, I'd put this scenario as just as likely as scenario (1) easily. From our amateur perches we can ask -- what's his problem getting into space? And we can answer, he shifts too much when he should attack. What if we're right, and the progress we demand is actually happening before our eyes? So you take that 4.2 YPC and it turns into 5.0, a Clinton Portisesque number (it's been close to that for long stretches already). You take that bleak role-only future and turn it into a complete back future. And along the way all these other optimizations happen - and suddenly he's a multidimensional threat, and no slouch at the stripe. In short, the "elite back" scenario. I don't put this as outside the spectrum of possibilities, I just see it as very unlikely.


Here's the news flash: you take any given strategy to optimize the chance of producing "that" back, and your odds are low. To me, it seems as likely that we've got "that guy," as it is that we'll get "that guy." A second realization we all need to get, is that if you start drafting attempts at "that guy" every year or two, you end up just burning high picks out of unsubstantiated hope.

I hope some of this hits home with you guys - we're dealing with a risk/reward world here. These aren't certainties that any of us can prove, they are possible futures and evaluations of what we perceive at present.

To compare the outcome of a chance we took in drafting Maroney, against the outcome of the chance Minnesota took in drafting Peterson (a good deal higher I might add) or for that matter, the outcome the Colts are getting out of Addai, is silly at this stage in the game.

Right now we need to say: is his position a problem? What is the trend line? Do we have to abandon the Maroney experiment?

I say the data don't suggest that, any more than the data suggest that Reggie Bush be ditched from the Saints, based on the fact that Peterson is excelling for the Vikings.

And never, ever make the mistake of thinking that a few months tells you all you need to know about your running back. If he's a scrub in the first place, maybe. But the exact same argument -- "what you expect out of a 1st round pick" -- has to be taken into account when deciding to "cut bait."

Now is too early.

PFnV
 
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Fine at running back? A team that has to give the ball to Heath Evans on a 4th and 1 with the GAME ON THE LINE is fine at running back and couldn't use an upgrade?:rolleyes:

National Patriots Troll and Danny are the only two who can still say Maroney sucks after he gains 123 yards of offense.
 
Some possible Maroney scenarios, ranked worst to best:
.....

And never, ever make the mistake of thinking that a few months tells you all you need to know about your running back. If he's a scrub in the first place, maybe. But the exact same argument -- "what you expect out of a 1st round pick" -- has to be taken into account when deciding to "cut bait."

Now is too early.

PFnV

Very insightful, objective post. Thanks for providing one of the rare nuggets of truth on this board today that will prevent me from yanking the hair out of my head.
 
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