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Tesla Motors fully repays $465 million federal loan nine years early

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by Patters, May 22, 2013.

  1. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Like the internet and space technology, government investment provides the seed money in highly speculative areas that eventually attract venture capital. While the same policies led to Solyndra, the fact is that Tesla's technology probably has a far greater upside potential for our economy than Solyndra's downside, which is a fixed amount. By the way, I saw the Tesla in a mall in White Plains. It's pricey, but it's quite a beautiful auto.

    Tesla Motors fully repays $465 million federal loan nine years early - San Jose Mercury News

    PALO ALTO -- In a huge boost for the Obama Administration and clean-energy firms, electric vehicle maker Tesla Motors (TSLA) announced Wednesday that it has paid back its $465 million government loan in full and nine years early.

    The Department of Energy oversees $34 billion in taxpayer-funded loans for clean energy and other projects, but Tesla is the only United States car company in the vast portfolio of 33 projects to pay back its loan so far. The loan program faced fierce partisan fire in the wake of the high-profile 2011 bankruptcy of Fremont solar manufacturer Solyndra, and Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney called Tesla a "loser" in a presidential debate last fall.

    ...

    "Federal investment in any innovative clean energy application carries risk, but, as Tesla has demonstrated, it can also create jobs, keep us a world leader in clean energy development, and provide a return on investment to taxpayers," Eshoo said. "As America faces spiking gas prices and extreme weather conditions, clean energy projects continue to be vital to our nation's economic and environmental future."
  2. Real World

    Real World Rookie

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    Great. So when are all the other hundreds of billions going to be paid back? Oh, they aren't....doh.
  3. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

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    1 out of 33 so far not a great track record.

    Funny seeing the touting of corporate welfare for a company that makes care for the 1%'ers. :D
  4. IcyPatriot

    IcyPatriot ---- JAG ----- PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #87 Jersey

    Ummmmm..

    Tesla makes cars for the 1%'ers .....
  5. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Unfortunately, until we have a liberal government, our economy will remain geared towards the 1%ers. If you ever read Obama's books, you'd realize he's a moderate, but perhaps because he's black and from Chicago most conservatives see him as liberal. Also, compared with Tea Partiers, Reagan would be considered a moderate.

    As far as Tesla goes, if the technology pays off than the long-term economic potential will easily cover the cost of all the government loans, even if the other projects fail. Look at the internet. Our tax dollars got that underway, and frankly I think it was a terrific investment for the US economy.
  6. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Tesla integrates bit from the big players they don't innovate.
  7. IcyPatriot

    IcyPatriot ---- JAG ----- PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #87 Jersey

    It is great ... but I would like it better when we have a massed produced electric car that can be sold for less than $18,000 or so.
  8. Drewski

    Drewski Rookie

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    #87 Jersey

    Apple hasn't really innovated their iPhones since the the first one**....and it is still a fantastic, widely popular and financially successful product offering...

    I agree with your point that the price of the vehicle is certainly up there; base model is $60-70K roughly???

    If the technology works and is a stepping stone to our species ultimate desires...can't be a bad thing.

    ** The iPhone (and most of Apple's products) are awesome. Some of, which I include the iPhone, are just not for me for preference reasons.
  9. Drewski

    Drewski Rookie

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    #87 Jersey

    That is my gripe too Icy.
  10. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Ford is selling hybrids in the 25-25k area, others the same, Tesla is a boutique brand they started redoing Mercedes SL's and BMW 650's they don't being any more to the market than Barbus.

  11. Triumph

    Triumph Rookie

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    #32 Jersey

    Yeah, those Tesla dealerships are popping up everywhere.

    Look out Ford Motor Company. :rolleyes:
  12. IcyPatriot

    IcyPatriot ---- JAG ----- PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #87 Jersey

    Could you expand upon that ... seriously ... why is it necessary.

    How about saying "but perhaps because he's a democrat from Chicago"

    Or .... "but perhaps because he is a community organizer from Chicago"

    Or ... "but perhaps because he's a ___________ from Chicago"

    Your including the "black" part also means that you see him as a "black" politician as opposed to an American politician.

    Just think about it a bit ... you may see it.

    Now suppose a conservative here said ... "Obama, the black democrat from Chicago"

    Is that any different than what you said or is the person saying it the difference?

    Just saying ... if the myth is to go away then it's mention by all must go away. I have no problem with Obama giving a black man speech to a black audience if he feels the need. But what if he gave a speech to America tonight and said 'Hello fellow Americans - I am your black President Barack Obama" ... :bricks:.

    He doesn't do it ... nor should anyone else do it ... he is an American politician. His heritage is African ... not his politics - they are American.
  13. Real World

    Real World Rookie

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    You do realize who you're talking to....
  14. IcyPatriot

    IcyPatriot ---- JAG ----- PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #87 Jersey

    Ehhhh ... I figured I would give him a ... :boink:
  15. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Icy, I think a lot conservatives have implied or stated that blacks vote for liberals because they want handouts. They see a relationship between race and liberalism. I can document that if I need to.
  16. IcyPatriot

    IcyPatriot ---- JAG ----- PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #87 Jersey

    I know you can ... but i expect you to be above it ... :halo:

    Let the neanderthals die off on their own without recognition.

    maybe with a little luck their last gasp is closer rather than afar.
    Last edited: May 22, 2013
  17. Drewski

    Drewski Rookie

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    #87 Jersey

    13 - I agree with you (and Icy) that the price point certainly leaves much to be desired.

    My post was more focused on your point about them not innovating.

    There are scores of examples of products (and companies) who remain successful absent true innovation.

    Now, I would say that you can only not innovate for so long before it bites you in a butt....but I dont think they're at that point yet.
  18. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

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    My point is not using taxpayer $$$ loan or not (especially with the numbers that are defaulting) government has no business underwriting companies. When it is a boutique company that isn't innovating.
  19. everlong

    everlong Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    I'm generally against corporate welfare which is an even bigger drain on the country than individual welfare but Tesla is a great company and a huge win. Compare that with bailing out GM which will never show an ROI. They should have let them fail so that other companies get the message that there is no safety net.

    As far as it being for the 1%ers that true for now but if they keep advancing the technology they would be for the 25%ers in a decade. An electric motor after 100,000 miles will still be mint vs a gas powered engine will be at half life if you're lucky. For the average person who drives 20-25K per year you'll also save $2600-3500 per year making up for the cost that you would have spent.
  20. IllegalContact

    IllegalContact Rookie

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    not just conservatives.......there are plenty of people in the middle who see the truth ...... that a large majority of blacks do vote liberal for the handouts.......that is not to say that many whites don't vote liberal for the handouts, also........lots of people do

    bribing the constituency has been around since the beginning of modern liberalism

    feel free to document the truth
  21. Drewski

    Drewski Rookie

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    #87 Jersey

    Where is the average miles driven in a year 20-25K?

    The US average is closer to 12-15K.
  22. everlong

    everlong Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    If you're including stay at home mom's and senior citizens maybe but I personally don't know anybody who works who's under 20K.
  23. Drewski

    Drewski Rookie

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    #87 Jersey

    See attached....broken down by gender and age group:

    Average Annual Miles per Driver by Age Group

    No group (as of 2011) even averaged 20K.

    EDIT to ADD - Please note I am not poo-poo'ing the general theme of your previous post as I agree with it.
    My only quibble is we, as a country, on average don't drive that many miles.
  24. everlong

    everlong Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    No worries on the poo-poo it's just a friendly discussion.

    I had looked it up too but needed to attend to something so couldn't reply back right away. The numbers are lower than I would have thought. Maybe it's a northeast thing where everybody commutes further to work then because I actually had this discussion about miles per year with parents on my daughter's soccer team and even a couple of the stay at home moms were doing over 15K/year just driving the kids around to all their activities.
  25. PatsFanInVa

    PatsFanInVa PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    We're running at about 8k/year, but that's because I take metro and the bus to and from work, and we use the jeep for errands or trips.

    Once again, when you look at averages, realize that includes commuters like me for whom public transportation costs out better -- anybody who pays for parking is in the same boat, by the way.
  26. Drewski

    Drewski Rookie

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    #87 Jersey

    Wowza!! I can't imagine spending that much time in a car (my adolescence in Jakarta; one of the worst traffic cities in the world) has killed my enjoyment of driving.

    My commute is 42 Miles roundtrip...say I work 224 days a year = 9,408 miles commuting... I can't imagine 50% more just for part of my driving miles.
  27. everlong

    everlong Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    I really don't enjoy driving for the most part any longer so I'm with you. My commute is 52 round trip but it's never just round trip. Then all the kids activities, my wife is an attorney who has to drive a lot.......
  28. everlong

    everlong Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    True but then you have people who do sales or service work who do nothing but drive from site to site all day. Obviously the numbers aren't wrong I just think they're probably higher hear in MA or in CA than other parts of the country. There's probably some people who live in cities who only drive on the weekends as well.
  29. Ilikehappyppl

    Ilikehappyppl Rookie

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    Bailout Scorecard | Eye on the Bailout | ProPublica


    GM says HI! Oh so do that Banks that paid back their bailout money! Oh and Tesla that just paid back its loan EARLY.


    Don't need to lie to kick it, you don't have to fudge the numbers to fit your ideology....
  30. IcyPatriot

    IcyPatriot ---- JAG ----- PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #87 Jersey

    I'm around 30K ...

    My wife does not understand why I like to stay home and work whenever I can.

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