Terrence Wheately & Deltha O'Neal - As HC who would you start opposite Hobbs?

[Sicilian]

I think it's clear that Hobbs and Wheatley will be the starters Week 1 - the bigger question to me is when we play against 3 WR, who comes in this week - O'Neal, Sanders, Wilhite are the options. Probably O'Neal and I'm thinking he would play the outside WR - and I'm thinking the faster, quicker, smaller Wheatley would take the inside slot guy.

Probably depends on the situation too. A 3rd and short with 3 wide and a bigger back in the backfield, I'm guessing they go with the extra safety in Sanders. 3rd and long with a Kevin Faulk type draw play threat, I agree with you, probably O'Neil on the outside and Wheatley covering the slot.

 

[WhiZa]

Wheatly's fine. I mean he has to cover Devard Darling this week who with 1 start in his career is bit of a newb himself.

If Wheatley starts making mistakes O'Neal would be a good fallback.

 

[broadwayjoe]

Wheatly's fine. I mean he has to cover Devard Darling this week who with 1 start in his career is bit of a newb himself.

If Wheatley starts making mistakes O'Neal would be a good fallback.

Good Point. I would start Wheatley also if I was the coach Delta O'Neal needs more reps in the Pats system at this time.

 

[emoney_33]

BB has made up his decision and announced that Wheately,the rookie second round draft pick will start and play opposite Hobbs on Sunday and the fact that O'Neal a veteran recent CB signing did not change his decision.

While Wheately has more knowledge of the Patriots complicated defensive schemes since learning them in camp and preseason,O'Neal has veteran presence and have seen the likes of KC and their receivers several times before in his years in the NFL and in the regular season where it counts now.

With that being said,If you were head coach would you go with the young unproven rookie and take your chances he will handle the likes of Gonzalez and Bowe that will come by his way sunday or do you go with the veteran who has not played with this defense yet but knows KC better and played in many meaningful games.

What would be your choice?

Pretty simply I'd go with what gave the team the better chance. Ya know team football not "hey you cover guy A, you cover guy B and you cover guy C ok bye".

 

[PatsFan37]

A number of things factor into this: O'Neal's familiarity (or lack), how he's done in practice, and the matchup -- who he'd be covering.

O'Neal is probably better at jamming a receiver off the line than Wheatley -- he has the size and he knows the game.

Wheatley has a better knowledge of where everyone else is going to be and he has better speed to cover for his mistakes.

Since blown coverages are probably the biggest single problem in a game against a weak opponent, you want the CB least likely to blow a coverage. At this point, that would be Wheatley since he knows the schemes.

[Disclaimer: I have my junior coaches hat on for this discussion. It gives me the power to pretend. ]

 

[Ring 6]

Wheatley is a 2nd round pick. Rookie corners play and succeed in the NFL.
Unless Wheatley has been a disappointment to the coaching staff he shuold be out there playing every down.
There seems to be a sentiment on this board that a rookie by definition is incompetant, doesnt understand the defense, is prone ot mistake, and will just do stupid things.
I do not know where that comes from.
We have had rookies play huge roles on this team, Seymour, Warren, Samuel, Wilson, Wilfork, Hobbs, Mankins, Graham, Branch, Light, etc etc in the BB era.
While NOT ALL rookies adjust their game to the NFL in their first camp and SOME lag behind, the Patriots in the BB era are living proof that rookies can contribute, play important roles, start from week one and be part of a Championship team.

Maybe the better example would be rookies BB put on the field in a big role that failed, because I'm not seeing any, but I see a ton of successes.

 

[Urgent]

Re: Terrence Wheatley & Deltha O'Neal - As HC who would you start opposite Hobbs?

Forget getting experience for Wheatley, so he is better down the road.
Forget the fact that O'Neal used to be a pro-bowl corner.

The current situation is that:
Wheatley has worked in this defense all training camp.
O'Neal has zero experience in this system.
O'Neal was cut by the Bengals, where he couldn't even make the nickel spot.

It has to be Wheatley.

Presumably Sanders is the nickel right now.

 

[mavfan2390]

Unless you plan on being a Raiders or Bengals fan shortly then that signature picture gotta go

But I have to admit,it was a nice picture of that one pass Jackson actually CAUGHT from Brady - so rare it should be on ebay

Sigh, done. But I'm still not happy about it!!

 

[Bostonian1962]

Whichever one of them looks more ready now to the coaching staff.

Maybe Wheatley has the advantage now, as he's been practicing in this D. Maybe O'Neil, once he learns the D, will be better due to his experience. We're going to find out soon enough.

We have a potentially stud rookie, and a seasoned vet, so we've had worse problems.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Wheatley. Our offense can carry us against KC, it's important to get Wheatley lot of reps when it matters now, we can rely on him in the playoffs.

I agree with mavfan.

More importantly, I agree with his sig. Could you imagine this lead-in to an article: "Peyton Manning never expected to be sacked five times by a fellow Tennessee alum"?

 

[jays52]

Wheatley and it's a no-brainer. Not just for the reasons listed previously, but because I believe Wheatey is a better player than O'Neal. A handful of points to justify my stance.

1) How often are you seeing the pats play true head-up press outside of blitzing situations? Sure, they are getting in the way of a clean release, but seldom mugging recievers like they used to. This effectivey negates O'Neal's experience in the Bengal's system.

2) Because of the nature of the coverages, a higher priority is placed on the agility and leg drive of the player. Look at the way Wheatley plays. His hips stay low, his body over his legs, his balance centered. He cuts cleanly, his hips swing around quickly and his leg drive is exceptional. If a play is in front of him, he quickly digs his cleat in and drives hard off of his plant foot. He's legit.

3) Not just snaps against top tier competition are important. Now is his time to develop continuity with the rest of the starting DB's. Let the vets come to trust him, let him learn the nuiances of his teamate's game.

Wheatley's going to be a player in this league for a long time. The pats have something special on their hands in him. I'm expecting a season from him on par with that of Wilson's first year here.

 

[BPF]

I'd go with Wheathley personally but size would worry since he and Hobbs are both 5'9" but they can overcome that with quickness and anticipation.

Here's Lombardi's take on O'Neal from today:
http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/2008/09/national-football-post-diner-news-10/

FROM STEPHEN HARRIS OF THE BOSTON HERALD… O’Neal has been, of course, a legitimate star - a two-time Pro Bowler who had 10 interceptions for the Bengals in 2005, and 31 picks in his eight NFL seasons. When the Pats released veteran corner Fernando Bryant and added O’Neal, they obviously believed he still had something left as a corner and/or kick returner. “I’m so happy to be here, I’m happy to be a part of something like this,” O’Neal said yesterday. “I’ve been excited since Sunday. If you’d seen me at home, I was walking around with a big cheesy grin on my face because I’m so happy to be here. I can’t explain my words right now.” He never saw the axe coming when he was cut by the Bengals. “Not at all, it was a shock to me,” said O’Neal, the 15th-overall pick in 2000 (Cal-Berkeley) by Denver, where he played his first four seasons. The hard part, he said, is the impact on his family. “It was like Hurricane Katrina, because I had family out there,” he said. “I wasn’t expecting this. Had I been expecting it, I would have been more prepared. I found out on the fly I was released, and right then and there I had to fly out. If he had to go, there was no better place to land than New England. “I just saw an opportunity,” he said. “I spoke to Rodney Harrison a couple of times, but it really wasn’t Rodney’s pitch. This is a great team and a great defense and I’d love to be a part of it.” O’Neal, who said he has known Tom Brady [stats] since they were in high school, doesn’t know if he’ll see action in the opener Sunday against Kansas City, but he will prepare as though he will. “It’s the coach’s decision. I’m still preparing. I’m just trying to learn the stuff that’s going on,” he said. “I’m just anxious to put on this jersey and this helmet and get out there and be a Patriot.”

O’Neal is very similar to Asante Samuel in his style of play. He is a guy that has very good hands and will take chances on the ball. When he is prepared, he can make plays and create turnovers. This is a very good signing for the Patriots, as he can come in and adapt to their style of play. He has the skill level to make their secondary affective. It helped the Patriots that Rodney Harrison and O’Neal have the same agent, Steve Feldman. When O’Neal plays for a team that can apply pressure, his skills as a gambler and his ability to catch the ball make him a very valuable commodity.

 

[Zeke_Mowatt]

Wheatley, and I'm guessing week 1-the end of the season. I will hedge my bet a hair and say, if he's supplanted, it's by Wilhite, not O'Neal. For no reason I can quantify, Wilhite is my new binky and I predict he will be a starter on this team either this year or next (and before anyone asks, I have ZERO evidence of this, just a guess/gut with nothing to back it up...fire away)

 

[BionicPatriot]

It's obvious you start the kid who knows the system so far. Worse case, he gets burned you bring in O'neal.

 

[DocE]

I start Wheatley week 1 with the goal being to put the possible team on the field in week 18 and beyond as opposed to week 1. It's possible that O'Neal is the better player now, but the experience Wheatley can gain playing against the Chiefs is very valuable in the long term. What better way to break in a rookie corner than at home against a team with a below average starting QB and 1 WR of note?

I really hope that the Patriots can be an ascending team as the season goes on and I believe that happens with younger, fresher legs on defense.

 

[PATRIOT64]

Wheatley and it's a no-brainer. Not just for the reasons listed previously, but because I believe Wheatey is a better player than O'Neal. A handful of points to justify my stance.

1) How often are you seeing the pats play true head-up press outside of blitzing situations? Sure, they are getting in the way of a clean release, but seldom mugging recievers like they used to. This effectivey negates O'Neal's experience in the Bengal's system.

2) Because of the nature of the coverages, a higher priority is placed on the agility and leg drive of the player. Look at the way Wheatley plays. His hips stay low, his body over his legs, his balance centered. He cuts cleanly, his hips swing around quickly and his leg drive is exceptional. If a play is in front of him, he quickly digs his cleat in and drives hard off of his plant foot. He's legit.

3) Not just snaps against top tier competition are important. Now is his time to develop continuity with the rest of the starting DB's. Let the vets come to trust him, let him learn the nuiances of his teamate's game.

Wheatley's going to be a player in this league for a long time. The pats have something special on their hands in him. I'm expecting a season from him on par with that of Wilson's first year here.

You are expecting a Wilson type 1st season from Wheately and expect him in the league for a long time? - Those 2 don't mix right now - Wilson has been pretty much a non factor after his first year and has been bounced around the past month - Hardly a guy you want to compare any rookie to who you expect to be in the league awhile

 

[modman]

I think that whats really important here is this is positive proof that the team is impressed with what they got in Wheately. Unlike other recently departed second round draftee's who never even smelled a starting role in the team, Wheatley has landed a starting job, and done so in his very first NFL game. Assuming that Mayo will also be starting that means our two top picks will be starting on defense. This is great news for the team and a strong indication that they hit gold in this last draft.

 

[PATRIOT64]

I think that whats really important here is this is positive proof that the team is impressed with what they got in Wheately. Unlike other recently departed second round draftee's who never even smelled a starting role in the team, Wheatley has landed a starting job, and done so in his very first NFL game. Assuming that Mayo will also be starting that means our two top picks will be starting on defense. This is great news for the team and a strong indication that they hit gold in this last draft.

Lets face it,the minute Mayo was selected we all knew he would be a starting ILB unless Hobson turned out to be another Ted Johnson

BB does not like LBs early as we know but he knew whoever he picked was going to play a BIG part in the front 7 the moment he chose him - Even if Mayo stunk up the presaeason,which he did not

 

[SammyBlueCat]

Well for what it is worth last Year Asante Samuel sat out all summer so Randal Gay was named the starter for game #1. He played a few minutes and was replaced by Samuel.

Wheatley may start and O'Neill will see some time as well.

 

[Lansdowne]

I like O'Neal and think he could be the starter before long, but you definitely have to go with Wheatley for Week 1.