Super Bowl 51 - Illegitimate*

[SteveGrogan]

What are you talking about? Are you going by semantics?

Brady didn't provide the required evidence. I couldn't tell you when the phone was destroyed or not but Brady never provided the phone and now states it is destroyed. Whatever.

enjoy your sundays, everyone gets a trophy these days, I'm sure you will too!

 

[ReverendMaynard]

That's nonsense and I'm assuming you haven't read the rest of my posts in this thread.

Are your posts explaining how we can go back in time and make that draft pick? No? Then they are nonsense.

 

[Clonamery]

I wonder when the troll will catch on to the fact that Brady's phone, or any of the court ruling crap, had nothing to do with the loss of draft picks.

vancan'tpatsfan is a better name for a troll.

 

[RayClay]

How do you know it was "fabricated"? The reality is that we can never know because Tom wrecked his phone. And when he wrecked his phone he sealed his fate and not only does the league rule against him because of it, but his action ensures that we can't even reasonably argue his innocence either because he destroyed evidence.

Screw, troll.

 

[SteveGrogan]

The NFL ownership = Randolph & Mortimer Duke.

 

[Ross12]

He's been removed from this thread for the time being. Thanks for the reports, although using the @ feature to mention myself or another mod in a post will get my/our attention a bit faster.

 

[ViperGTS]

He's been removed from this thread for the time being. Thanks for the reports, although using the @ feature to mention myself or another mod in a post will get my/our attention a bit faster.

I'd watch for more trolls like this. The Boston.com forums are being shut down so be prepared for a wave of trolls trying to peddle their wares here.

 

[Ross12]

I'd watch for more trolls like this. The Boston.com forums are being shut down so be prepared for a wave of trolls trying to peddle their wares here.

Didn't know that. Good info, thank you.

 

[letekro]

Was the phone required to be turned over per the CBA?
Did they offer to give the emails and texts?
Is he a famous person with a famous wife?
Did his private emails (answer number 2 first) get leaked?

Answer those and then get back to me.

I dont think they offered to turn over texts and emails. They offered to give a list of everyone that Tom texted and emailed.

 

[SteveGrogan]

I dont think they offered to turn over texts and emails. They offered to give a list of everyone that Tom texted and emailed.

The irony here is they had the phones from the other two guys, so what would it be that they were looking for?

My guess is they were looking for him to deny the phone so they could try to insinuate that into circumstantial guilt they couldn't otherwise prove.

Then people figured out no air ever came out of the footballs in the first place and the months that languished did so with the intent of letting those phony leaks stand as fact to a public that never wanted to believe the truth in the first place.

They just wanted to burn anything patriots at the stake, for being good and making them unhappy I guess.

 

[sb1]

There were two 2nd US Circuit Appeals Court judges who stated that its well established to assume someone's guilt when they destroy evidence that has been ordered to be produced:

"Finally, any reasonable litigant would understand that the destruction of evidence, revealed just days before the start of the arbitration proceedings, would be an important issue. It is well established that the law permits a trier of fact to infer that a party who deliberately destroys relevant evidence the party had an obligation to produce did so in order to conceal damaging information from the adjudicator."

It's too bad that Tom didn't allow all the evidence to be reviewed because I suppose your 12 year old's experiment might have possibly been considered then.

Except that part of ruling is false, there was no such "obligation" as per the Collective Bargaining Agreement, this is not a criminal trial, there is no standard of "evidence" in this context, and Brady was told by the lead investigator that he did not need his phone. He did a big service to his fellow players to not establish that precedent.

Judges are not infallible, the two of them who voted for the league clearly disregarded the important facts to zero in on their conclusion (this has been parsed and documented, google it) and came to the scary conclusion that the arbitrator has the right to break the law. It's not even arguable.

All you need to know about this case is Brady was the only one who was willing to and actually did testify under oath and the dorito dinks were told by Goodell to stay away from the appeal hearing despite the fact they could have shed a lot of light on their activities that night.There is no sensible reason to keep them away other than the obvious.

There really isn't anything more that needs to be said than that. The end.

 

[ViperGTS]

Except that part of ruling is false, there was no such "obligation" as per the Collective Bargaining Agreement, this is not a criminal trial, there is no standard of "evidence" in this context, and Brady was told by the lead investigator that he did not need his phone. He did a big service to his fellow players to not establish that precedent.

Judges are not infallible, the two of them who voted for the league clearly disregarded the important facts to zero in on their conclusion (this has been parsed and documented, google it) and came to the scary conclusion that the arbitrator has the right to break the law. It's not even arguable.

All you need to know about this case is Brady was the only one who was willing to and actually did testify under oath and the dorito dinks were told by Goodell to stay away from the appeal hearing despite the fact they could have shed a lot of light on their activities that night.There is no sensible reason to keep them away other than the obvious.

There really isn't anything more that needs to be said than that. The end.

Yes. That's completely correct. I've been banging that drum.

 

[RecoveringCowboy]

I have a story, but you have to read it all to see it's spot on with DeflateGate.

A little town in Missouri was a notorious speed trap - it was their biggest source of income. You know - a compressed set of speed limit signs to keep cops from that legal fig leaf to cite you. This town had one of the signs obscured by a tree.

One day, an officer of that town ticketed a driver. Not just any driver, but a state senator. So that state senator went to Springfield (Missouri) and sponsored a bill that traffic tickets in excess of the norm for Missouri so to the state instead of the town. That town has shut down. /story

Imagine Tom Brady touring that town and getting four months in jail for a traffic ticket.

I hope a US Senator or someone takes on the NFL and addresses this and other issues.

 

[sb1]

Yes. That's completely correct. I've been banging that drum.

And that cannot be allowed to stand in this country.

Perhaps that little brown nugget will be a motivating factor for the whole court to agree to re-hear the case en banc.

 

[letekro]

The irony here is they had the phones from the other two guys, so what would it be that they were looking for?

My guess is they were looking for him to deny the phone so they could try to insinuate that into circumstantial guilt they couldn't otherwise prove.

Then people figured out no air ever came out of the footballs in the first place and the months that languished did so with the intent of letting those phony leaks stand as fact to a public that never wanted to believe the truth in the first place.

They just wanted to burn anything patriots at the stake, for being good and making them unhappy I guess.

According to Wells:

We wanted two buckets of information. We wanted him to take the phone, look at the text messages, e-mails, run the search terms that we set forth and give us any communications with anybody about deflation or inflation. So if Mr. Brady had talked to an assistant coach or talked to the second-team quarterback about these issues, we would get that material.

We then asked him for all communications regardless of subject matter, I think, between Mr. Jastremski and McNally, regardless of — and Schoenfeld, regardless of the search terms. So we wanted two buckets of information. And I know, I didn’t get — okay, I will stop.

All of this seems reasonable. I understand Brady's decision not to provide it--I wouldn't have either. His mistake was not failing to provide this information but rather disposing of the phone. Whether the CBA required him to turn it over or not is an irrelevant technicality. In law, there is something called the clean hands doctrine. Basically, when you are seeking that equity be done, you better be clean yourself. This is not quite on point to the Brady case, but if you are going to argue to a court that you were the victim of an unfair investigation, like Brady has, it looks terrible to dispose of evidence potentially relevant to the investigation you are claiming was unfair.

 

[Danger Zone]

How do you know it was "fabricated"? The reality is that we can never know because Tom wrecked his phone. And when he wrecked his phone he sealed his fate and not only does the league rule against him because of it, but his action ensures that we can't even reasonably argue his innocence either because he destroyed evidence.

So the email leaks that tried putting Brady in a bad light was just.. meh? Just on that one example alone, Brady had every right not to trust the NFL with his physical cell phone. The man is a megastar and hangs out with the mega-elite. I have no doubt that destroying cell phones is something he does with some regularity.

So what do you expect was on that phone that couldn't have been recovered from phone records? Why would an honest investigation even want the physical phone? Texts can get deleted all the time. A REAL investigation would ONLY ever want an official transcript of said text messages from the phone company (redacted or not by the lawyers). They would never trust the contents of a physical phone.

The NFL then refusing to accept a transcript from the phone company is just sophistry of the basest kind.

 

[SteveGrogan]

According to Wells:

We wanted two buckets of information. We wanted him to take the phone, look at the text messages, e-mails, run the search terms that we set forth and give us any communications with anybody about deflation or inflation. So if Mr. Brady had talked to an assistant coach or talked to the second-team quarterback about these issues, we would get that material.

We then asked him for all communications regardless of subject matter, I think, between Mr. Jastremski and McNally, regardless of — and Schoenfeld, regardless of the search terms. So we wanted two buckets of information. And I know, I didn’t get — okay, I will stop.

All of this seems reasonable. I understand Brady's decision not to provide it--I wouldn't have either. His mistake was not failing to provide this information but rather disposing of the phone. Whether the CBA required him to turn it over or not is an irrelevant technicality. In law, there is something called the clean hands doctrine. Basically, when you are seeking that equity be done, you better be clean yourself. This is not quite on point to the Brady case, but if you are going to argue to a court that you were the victim of an unfair investigation, like Brady has, it looks terrible to dispose of evidence potentially relevant to the investigation you are claiming was unfair.

Dude, if someone is charged with murder based on a body... and then it turns out the dead body was just a drunk who passed out and pissed themselves and eventually got back up and walked in the bar for a drink - is an investigation even needed? And if it's not needed, can you obstruct it?

I feel like I'm taking crazy pills. There was no air taken out of the ****in' footballs and every science experiment run in the last 2 years proves that.

I'm not sure how anything matters after that at all? Who needs an investigation if there's no crime. Maybe Tom likes to **** goats? Maybe Giselle is a ****oldress? Maybe there's a text on there where the QB of another team admits to a drug problem.

Who the hell cares, all that matters is those footballs were never deflated.

 

[IllegalContact]

Per Brady's request, the boys did deflate the balls......to 12.5psi

The whole balm pressure thing was the inert ingredient used to pass along the active ingredient ..... In the form of an impediment

This whole thing is mind bogglingly simple......which is why you have goodell farting out of his mouth now

 

[TheFlyingWedge]

To win so much that the other league owners go full Randolph and Mortimer Duke on you to try and hamstring your team - makes you the greatest, without dispute.

LMFAO - Love the Dukes comparison and such a classic! We know what happened to the Duke's dirty hatchet man Clarence Beaks:

Hopefully Goodell will get raped by a gorilla too!

 

[SteveGrogan]

LMFAO - Love the Dukes comparison and such a classic! We know what happened to the Duke's dirty hatchet man Clarence Beaks:

Hopefully Goodell will get raped by a gorilla too!

Hahahahahaha, I forgot about the gorilla rape. That would be amazing. All we need is a swedish chick and a priest.