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Strength and Cond. Staff Must Go!!!

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by Bostonian1962, Jan 20, 2006.

  1. Bostonian1962

    Bostonian1962 Rookie

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    I see where the Pats just made Josh McDaniels the offensive coordinator. Well, the team has been decimated with injuries for each of the last three years, so I hope their next move is to get rid of the strength and conditioning staff, and go in a new direction.

    Has there been any word on that? Any other thoughts on the subject?
  2. Willie55

    Willie55 Rookie

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    Is it strength and conditioning or is it the team doctor? Everybody has injuries, but it just seems like it takes so long for guys to come back. Ty Law complained about it, so did somebody else (I can't remember who).

    Also, a couple months after Matt Light had surgery on his leg fluid appeared in it and was put on IR. What is that all about.

    Who is the team doctor? Does anybody know?
  3. Phokus

    Phokus Rookie

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    Since when are injuries the fault of the strength and conditioning coach? Isn't that the guy who also was the strength coach of the cowboy dynasties?
  4. ctpatsfan77

    ctpatsfan77 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I believe that's what they said about him. Then again, Woicik reminds me of a caveman for some reason. :)
  5. marty

    marty Rookie

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    I've heard nothing but good things about the conditioning coaches from the players and HC. I do believe that the Pats as a rule give their players more time to recover from injury than a lot of other clubs, and I applaud that mindset. I think our injuries of the past few seasons are more a result of other teams bringing their "A" game to beat the Champs, than poor conditioning.
  6. SVN

    SVN Rookie

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    from what i read the strength coach is the best in the nfl - he was with the cowboys during their 3 SB wins.injuries and the way its handled by the pats is unique in itself
  7. Bostonian1962

    Bostonian1962 Rookie

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    It isn't always their fault. It depends on the situation/types of injuries etc. But, one of the most important parts of the S&C coach's job is to help prevent injuries.

    If you have a player that is always out with hamstring injury, the S&C coach will tailor that person's program to limit such injuries. Muscle pulls are prevented by stretching, yoga, and other methods. Chronic back problems will require concentrating on that area, and the abs, for example.

    No, I'm not a doctor, but I was delivered by one, and use to watch alot of Marcus Welby.:)

    It hard to know the nature of most of the Pats injuries, because they're all simply described as "leg tightened up".:) However, three years of leading the NFL in injuries means they should AT LEAST look at it.

    As for Willie55's comment on the team doctor! Great point! There seems to be an issue there as well.

    As for whether the current S&C coach was the S&C coach of Dallas when they were winning Super Bowls, so what?! The Patriots won the last two Super Bowls, and while guys like Hank Poteat did an admirable job filling in for guys like Ty Law, I'd rather do without the injuries thank you.
  8. miamipat

    miamipat Rookie

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    Hate to say this but maybe if we didn't have all those injuries we wouldn't of won the 3 super bowls.
  9. marty

    marty Rookie

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    I guess there's some twisted logic to the fact that the amount of injuries relates to quality in your depth!
  10. ch3oh

    ch3oh Rookie

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  11. Brownfan80

    Brownfan80 Rookie

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    Not only the quality of depth, but the quality of our starting QB position would certainly have been effected by the 'no injury' hypothesis.
  12. Patsguy05

    Patsguy05 Rookie

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    The stronger we are and better shape we are in the less likely we are to suffer injuries. Having said that, you cannot prevent all injuries. Conditioning coaches condition their players to minimize injuries. Doctors oversee the healing process and then the trainers/doctors decide when it is safe to return to action. Its worth taking a look at but I don't think it is something that we should get all excited about. Maybe we just play harder that everyone else.
  13. DaBruinz

    DaBruinz Pats, B's, Sox PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #50 Jersey

    I do not understand why this is being talked about. Its not like the Patriots have had numerous players out with muscle strains or muscle pulls. If that was the case, then you might have a point. But its not.

    Most of the Patriots injuries the last 3 years are considered to be of the "CATASTROPHIC" nature. Ones that require surgery to fix.

    Tom Brady - Shoulder - required surgery after 2002
    Ty Law - Ankle - Required 2 surgeries
    Matt Light - Broken Leg - require 2 surgeries
    Eugene Wilson - Torn Groin and Broken Arm -
    Rodney Harrison - Broken arm and torn ligaments in his knee
    Duane Starks - Shoulder Surgery
    Dan Koppen - Shoulder Injury
    Damian Woody - Knee Injury
    Mike Compton - Foot injury
    Rosie Colvin - Broken hip
    Sean McDermott - Knee Injury
    Fred McCrary - Knee Injury
    Stephen Neal - Shoulder Surgery
    David Patten - Leg Injury
    Daniel Graham - Shoulder Injury
    Bethel Johnson - Ankle/Foot Surgery
    Dan Klecko - Torn ACL
    Guss Scott - Torn ACL /
    Zeron Fleminster - Torn ACL
    Ben Watson - Torn ACL


    I am not sure what the strength and conditioning coach can do about all the catastrophic injuries. Muscle pulls and strains, I can agree with. Everything else, not really.
  14. patriotsrule

    patriotsrule Rookie

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    Mike Woicik is the only player or coach in NFL history to have 6 Super Bowl rings. He is known throughout the league as one of the best at his his profession. Seriously, some of you guys either need jobs or girlfriends. Where do you come up with this stuff? What could Woicik do about Harrison's injury? Light's injury? Poole's injury? Faulk's injury? When a player gets rolled up on and tears a knee ligament or breaks a bone in his foot, we are now blaming the strength and conditioning coach? And we sit here and complain when outsiders make fun of us as fans. We have one of the best strength coaches in the NFL and some people are blaming him because Cedric Wilson rolled up on Rodney Harrison and made him tear three knee ligaments. The Patriots have been one of the toughest, most physical teams since Woicik has been here and they are traditionally strong in the fourth quarter while other teams are tiring out so I would say he is doing his job pretty well. But we have to blame someone because we didn't win the Super Bowl this year. Might as well be the strength coach. Astonishing.
  15. PATSNUTme

    PATSNUTme Paranoid Homer Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    It would be really nice if you had some idea of what you are talking about before start a thread trashing someone.

    I happen to know a Strength & Conditioning coach in the NFL. He has been with 2 NFL teams, and currently with an NFC team that was in the playoffs.

    This person told me a couple of months ago the the Patriots coach is considered one of the best in the business.
  16. Ochmed Jones

    Ochmed Jones Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    Woicik is considered one of the best in the NFL. Even former WR Crackhead Irvin praises the man.
    I know BB says "his leg tightened up on him a bit". But that could be anything. Heck the leg could have fallen off and that's just tightening up to BB.

    However I really would like to know who handles the surgery for the Patriots. Your talking about million dollar athletes. You would hope they get the best medical treatment and not some mail order degreed doctor. Although Law, Light, Poole and several others have mumbled about the medical staff.

    Maybe BB needs to quit messing with the groundskeepers, peanut vendors and parking lot attendents and first thing request from teh NFL that Triplet and his gang of ghouls never referee another Patriots game and second thing start interviewing doctors. A professional background check should be the first order of business in that regard.
  17. Mike the Brit

    Mike the Brit Minuteman Target PatsFans.com Supporter

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    :agree: ..........
  18. Box_O_Rocks

    Box_O_Rocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I'm afraid I am also worried about strength and conditioning after the Denver game. Watson barely made it the length and width of the field in a stern chase, Ashworth needed CPR or something between plays, there is no way around the fact that Tommy's arm is in the same league as Penningtons, it's even the same division! :nono:
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2006
  19. marty

    marty Rookie

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    :bricks: Good one!
  20. texpat

    texpat Rookie

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    For about a half second, I thought you were serious!. LOL
  21. ch3oh

    ch3oh Rookie

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    Bingo.

    (7 8 9 10)
  22. frazpt

    frazpt Rookie

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    I agree with patsrule. I am a physical therapist and a strength and conditioning coach. Injuries, no matter how well you prepare an athlete will happen, especially in football. Woicik is the best in the business. Look at Big Willie. Before Woicik got here, he was always out with a hamstring strain. He has been on the field the last four years, same as Woicik has been here. Was injured this year with a broken thumb. How is strength and conditioning prevent that! If you know, please inform me because I've pissed away alot of money on a education.
  23. Bostonian1962

    Bostonian1962 Rookie

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    What are you talking about? You know a coach so that makes you some kind of expert on whether the Patriots injuries are related to their workout regimen? You know nothing! My brother is an MD, and my grandfather was the top heart surgeon on Long Island when he was alive. I'm not going to claim I know how to do a triple bypass.

    I do know I've been working out at the gym for 25 years. I do know I was a personal trainer for three years in college. I know I tore my ACL wrestling, and injured it again in a basketball league, so have had to rehab it twice. Don't presume to know what I know about injuries! Some coach told you the Pats S&C coach is one of the best in the business so the case is closed! What a crock! Everybody knows he's had a good rep. If you read the Dallas link somebody posted, there are plenty who don't think alot of him.

    I'll say it one more time, the Pats have lead the league in the injuries for three years. If they are the type that would have happened regardless of who the S&C coach was fine, but if not, then he's part of the problem, and this needs to be addressed.
  24. PATSNUTme

    PATSNUTme Paranoid Homer Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    This was not just "a coach". This is a guy who has acutally been a S&C coach for 18 years in the NFL, and still is. He had no reason to tell me that the Patriots S&C was one of the best in the business. He has been publicly thanked by one of the best NFL QB's and one of the best NFL's LB's for his work.

    If he thought the Patriots S&C coach was lousy, he would have said that. If I could say who this person is I would. I don't want to bring his name into this.

    I'll take the word of someone who has direct knowledge of the person and the job rather than some "link". And, all that other bull**** you stated is just a rant.

    The title of your thread is what I have a problem with.
    Last edited: Jan 21, 2006
  25. ch3oh

    ch3oh Rookie

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    Apparently more than just one S&C coach thinks he is good.

    "Woicik is a two-time winner of the Professional Football Strength and Conditioning Society's Coach of the Year Award, earning the honor in 1992 and 2004.
    Woicik's year-round conditioning program has proven to be a significant factor in the Patriots' Super Bowl runs, as the team has remained fresh and saved its best football for the end of the season. Since 2001, New England has compiled a 39-5 (.886) record in games played after November 1, a record that exemplifies the solid conditioning approach employed by Woicik. Additionally, New England has been able to sustain lengthy winning streaks during Woicik's tenure, compiling an NFL-record 21-game winning streak from 2003-04 and also achieving a 12-game winning streak from 2001-02."

    http://www.patriots.com/team/index.cfm?ac=coachbio&bio=532
  26. PATSNUTme

    PATSNUTme Paranoid Homer Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    I just think that before advocating the firing of someone, you need to give more facts.

    Maybe list the injuries that we had and which ones were a results of the "poor work" done by the S&C staff.

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