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Stat I hadn't seen before - Changing Offense

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by patriotscpfc, Jul 10, 2011.

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  1. patriotscpfc

    patriotscpfc Rookie

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    Unless i'm reading it wrong, when Rodak reviews Sidney Rice as a potential Patriot on ESPNBoston
    Sudden impact: Sidney Rice - New England Patriots Blog - ESPN Boston

    He gives this stat.

    When you look at the teams with terrible QBs or poor Receivers, they all used more 3+ Wide Receivers sets (i'm thinking Browns here) on plays than the Patriots.

    When you look at 07-09, does anyone know what the amount was then. I'm guessing it really shows what a difference that Gronk, Hernandez and Crumpler made to the team.
  2. Patsfanin Philly

    Patsfanin Philly Rookie

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    #95 Jersey

    And he probably had the most dropbacks with 2 TEs. With the Pats shifting to a 2 TE set most of the time,they (Gronk, Hernandez and Crumpler) assumed the role at the expense of the extra WR. Let's see a stat for the number of dropbacks with 4 or 5 WR/TE set. IIRC the Pats had the highest number of empty backfield sets in the league which obviously means they led the league ( if true) in the number of 5 WR/TE sets......
    Stats........love em, hate em,manipulate em.


    ***You can debate a lot of things here. If a RB lines up wide and there's an empty backfield, is he still a running back or do you count him as a wide receiver?
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2011
  3. ctpatsfan77

    ctpatsfan77 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Near the top, but not at the top.

    According to Football Outsiders, the Pats went with an empty backfield 9.9% of the time, the third highest total.

    The two teams that used it more? GB, at 11%, and BUF, at 15%(!). OTOH, by DVOA, the Pats were the most successful team running the empty backfield.
  4. cupofjoe1962

    cupofjoe1962 Rookie

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    I would love to see Rice on the Patriots.

    Tate seemed to be invisible at times on the field.....

    After looking at these stats..... why not go get Rice?


    • Patriots receivers had 38 drops in 2010, second-most in the NFL (Lions, 38).

    • Patriots wide receivers dropped 10 percent of their end-zone targets, sixth-highest percentage in the NFL.
  5. FirstAndGoal

    FirstAndGoal Rookie

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    The Patriots haven't changed offenses in a very long time now. They might add some twists and turns as well as emphasize different parts of the playbook based on personnel but it's still the same system with different wrinkles.

    The numbers, names, and the basics are all the same.

    The fact that we're using more tight end sets now just goes to show where they believe the strength of their personnel give them the best shot at winning. Put someone like Andre Johnson in at WR and you'd see more spread again but maybe with more tight end mismatches in the middle... who knows but the Patriots do not depend on one super star to generate offense for them like some other teams have to do.
  6. Sicilian

    Sicilian On the Roster

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    I wonder how they classify a wide receiver. Do they mean with 3+ players who are LISTED as wide receivers? Or when Hernandez lines up in the slot is he considered a WR for that play? When Faulk/Woodhead motions out to the slot, are they still considered a RB?

    What really matters isn't what designation a player has on the roster, but what his role is for the play.
  7. DarrylS

    DarrylS PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Good idea, but the problem of having a very short time to implement a new Offense may prove difficult.

    They can make some subtle changes, but doubt if you will see anything major.
  8. ctpatsfan77

    ctpatsfan77 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Yes, FO considers a RB to be a RB no matter what he does, etc.

    This particular stat is dependent on simply an empty backfield, not having 5 WRs/TEs.
  9. BlueThunder

    BlueThunder PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    I. for one, will be interested to see how they use their newly acquired RB's in the offense......BJGE,Woody,Vereen and Ridley should be faster than the old war horses that probably won't make the cut......having a running game that is explosive should open up other areas in the passing game, and vise-versa.

    Let's get this CBA signed and play some ball ! :rocker:
  10. townes

    townes Rookie

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    Wow, provided these stats don't come from PFF they demonstrate even more just how sick Brady's performance was last season.
  11. supafly

    supafly PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Extreme cost, some possible durability issues moving forward, and the lack of developing reps for Tate and Price (although we aren't exactly 'confident' with these 2, we still need to see just what they can offer).

    Don't get me wrong, I would be psyched at the idea of Sidney Rice, I just don't see it as a very practical idea at the present time.

    There's also the thinking that he could be actually be somewhat of a wasted prospect, seeing as how we utilize a short to intermediate passing game with Welker/Branch as the primary targets, the recent implimentation of the TE's more, and now have also providing some youth, bulk, and speed to the running game and offensive line. Since we plan on using the TE's and running game more, plus are likely to still have Welker as the go-to guy, a high-priced guy like Sidney Rice may be an asset that is relatively wasted in this system.

    A guy such as Tate/Price (not too many receptions expected--40 or so would be ideal) can provide the smaller amount of receptions this offense needs now.

    Who knows though? Anything is surely possible--here's hoping you are right! I'd love to see some fresh yet experienced talent added, I just think if it happens, it will be a guy at a lessened cost due to his specific role here.

    Depending on many variables, next yr may be the yr that this would be appropriate.
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2011
  12. Don Kipines

    Don Kipines Rookie

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    I think if you're going to spend a lot of money this offseason, you're better served extending Mankins or even guys like Mayo or Welker, instead of throwing cash at an oft-injured receiver.

    I like Sidney Rice, but the Pats have depth at receiver, they scored a ton of points last year, and they have needs elsewhere. That said, BB tends to make big moves in just the place you don't expect, so maybe we will see him here. They'd score 35 points a game with a legit outside threat.
  13. supafly

    supafly PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    Mayo is 3 yrs into a 5 yr deal. He is not getting extended any time soon, at least not for another yr--minimum. He's nowhere near a priority.

    I would agree 100% that I hope that Wes Welker gets extended/re upped, and stays as a NE Pat for yrs to come. I just don't think you can create the chemistry with Edelman/Brady that you can with Welker/Brady, and I still think that Welker is terribly important to our success.

    I agree that you are much better off addressing other needs such as Mankins etc, and I also wonder about Rice's stability/consistency moving forward--especially with the money he will demand.

    With the offense already averaging about 32 pts a game last yr, do we really need a high-priced outside threat (besides Tate/Price) to add that extra 3 pts that you are talking about? Maybe we'll get lucky, and one of those 2 can provide what seemingly 'little' production that we'll need. I see about 40 catches being a great role here as a downfield threat, as the use of Welker/Branch, the TE's, and the rejuvenated running game being the high majority of the options.
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