Sounding like a broken record: # i don't even know anymore

[VectorPrime]

I don't care. I can't stand it.

Because of that stupid thread from 1 and a half years ago now no one can dare criticize personell decisions without that being brought up. All season long, time and time again, people on this forum brought up legitimate concerns about the team and we were always met with a reference to that thread or being labeled as chicken littles. Hell last week as I, and some others, kept on saying that it was a BAD thing that we had to go into Denver all we got in return were people rolling their eyes at us.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Because of that stupid thread from 1 and a half years ago now no one can dare criticize personnel decisions without that being brought up. All season long, time and time again, people on this forum brought up legitimate concerns about the team and we were always met with a reference to that thread or being labeled as chicken littles. Hell last week as I, and some others, kept on saying that it was a BAD thing that we had to go into Denver all we got in return were people rolling their eyes at us.

When the OP talks about getting a deep threat they deserve the "I can't stand it" moniker.

If fans want to complain about the oline or lament about HFA that is a reasonable thing to do.

 

[Canuck]

2014 Receivers Edelman, Gronk, LaFell, Vereen, Amendola
2015 Receivers Gronk, Amendola, Edelman, White, LaFell

So basically the same receivers as 2014 except we have White instead of Vereen. A PAT from having a chance to go to back to back SB.

So what went wrong? It kind of reminds me of the two losses to the Giants in the SB where we scored 14 and then 17 points. When the defense can get pressure with 3 or 4 players without having to blitz, Brady has trouble finding an open receiver.

The whole OL was in shambles this year. I have a hard time remembering when the Belichick fired one of his coaches and when he did it so quickly was a telling tale. We have had issues in the past with injuries to the OL and Scar always seemed to be able to work things out. DeGuglielmo seemed like a pretty decent coach though.

Mostly the difference between this year and last year was the health of our OL and Receivers. LaFell fell off the Planet. That was a huge drop in production from last year. Still Brady managed to put up over 310 yards passing to Mannings 176. So the receivers were not the problem.

With shaky pass protection Brady was under constant pressure which resulted in two Ints. With a shaky OL there was no threat of a run game. With the pass rush getting to Brady so fast and no run game, it restricted what plays Josh could call.

Questions for 2016.

LaFell and what happens to him. Who is going to be the new OL coach. Who is going to be the lead back and who is his back-up. Is Blount and Jackson going to be the 1-2 punch? Who is going to be the 3rd down back? Lewis or White. Is Jackson and Mason talented enough to keep improving and make the OL better. Do we address the OL concerns through the Draft or FA or is there enough talent already on the roster, may be they just need to get healthy.

What happens to Mayo who has a hard time getting through a season and is getting paid way to much for his current production. Do we get rid of Mayo and try and get another stud LB. Not a lot of problems with the defense. It was the most solid part of the team.

 

[pheenix11]

I'd rather get a 2nd TE who can actually play. Bring back the Two TE set and insurance for Gronk. I thought Chandler was it but apparently not.

 

[VectorPrime]

Aaron Hernandez was an all pro talent. We won't be getting anything like him again, the 2 TE offense is dead.

 

[convertedpatsfan]

? Denver doesn't have one? They have 2. Both Thomas and especially Sanders are deep threats. Both can beat 1 on 1 coverage deep and Sanders is one of the best deep receivers in the league. When the Ravens won they had T. Smith who was known for being a deep receiver.

I think we need to define what we're talking about. By definition, Ted Ginn Jr. could be classified as a deep threat. Same with Darrius Heyward-Bey. Neither of them are worth throwing to. But the OP is talking about the classic #1 outside WR, the freakish big WR justifying $10M+. No Torrey Smith, no Sanders.

As for Thomas, as I mentioned, he hasn't been utilized that way. Brandon LaFell averaged more yards per catch (13.9) than Thomas this year (12.4), who was just a bit ahead of Edelman (11.3). A huge part of that is the QB obviously, but the point is that the team succeeded based on other factors, not a huge #1 outside deep threat, but by utilizing him as a possession receiver.

The OP mentions the following (not Torrey Smith, not Sanders):

Julio Jones/AJ Green/Megatron, or a deep speed guy like DeSean/Odell/Allen Robinson or even a guy with sick hands like Larry

There are a few HOFers in that group, and potential HOFers as well. Of course not even half of them even made the playoffs, with only one making it to the final 4. It's not a prerequisite as the OP claims. Plenty of teams do fine without that freak.

Also, just because he's not classified as a WR, people overlook the fact that we do have a freak. His name is Rob Gronkowski. He averaged over 16 yards a catch, more than big-play explosive receivers like Green and Jones. He's a TD machine as well, and virtually uncoverable in the redzone.

I just don't see why people keep wanting to drop $10M on an outside guy we won't utilize much. Everyone points to Megatron...yes, let's follow the Lions. Or the Falcons. I want to emulate that franchise.

 

[supafly]

It seems to be widely believed that Jeffery is going to get in the range of $12 to 14 million per year. Do people actually want the Pats to be the team that pays that?

It's pretty well known that the Bears are going to tag Jeffrey, and why wouldn't they? They usually have a good amount of cap space, and he's their top weapon, especially since Langford will be taking over for Forte, as Forte is likely to leave in FA.

I certainly agree that these high priced WRs aren't coming here, as our offense is built on taking advantages of underneath route mismatches and quick timing. It would be great to have a physical WR, but a guy like Jeffrey would be used differently here, in my opinion.

 

[supafly]

I think we need to define what we're talking about. By definition, Ted Ginn Jr. could be classified as a deep threat. Same with Darrius Heyward-Bey. Neither of them are worth throwing to. But the OP is talking about the classic #1 outside WR, the freakish big WR justifying $10M+. No Torrey Smith, no Sanders.

As for Thomas, as I mentioned, he hasn't been utilized that way. Brandon LaFell averaged more yards per catch (13.9) than Thomas this year (12.4), who was just a bit ahead of Edelman (11.3). A huge part of that is the QB obviously, but the point is that the team succeeded based on other factors, not a huge #1 outside deep threat, but by utilizing him as a possession receiver.

The OP mentions the following (not Torrey Smith, not Sanders):



There are a few HOFers in that group, and potential HOFers as well. Of course not even half of them even made the playoffs, with only one making it to the final 4. It's not a prerequisite as the OP claims. Plenty of teams do fine without that freak.

Also, just because he's not classified as a WR, people overlook the fact that we do have a freak. His name is Rob Gronkowski. He averaged over 16 yards a catch, more than big-play explosive receivers like Green and Jones. He's a TD machine as well, and virtually uncoverable in the redzone.

I just don't see why people keep wanting to drop $10M on an outside guy we won't utilize much. Everyone points to Megatron...yes, let's follow the Lions. Or the Falcons. I want to emulate that franchise.

10 million a year? Hell, both Thomas and Bryant are averaging 14 million per year, and the same will go for Jones and Green. Megaton may be right around the same, as I believe he was somewhere in the mid teens.

The market has been on the rise for these types of receivers. Hopkins and Jeffrey may beat them all when they sign new pacts. It could be as high as 15-16 million dollars for one of them.

 

[Froob]

Where is this cap room coming from ti sign Jefferies? Pats are like four mill over the cap for next season.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

We need 2014 Lafell. Find someone who can give us that and we are good at WR.

Lafell wasn't right ever since his offseason surgery

 

[SHOWTIME15]

and how is Alshon Jeffrey going to give Brady extra time to throw the ball?

First and foremost, fix the Oline. Second, fix the running game. Third, maybe get a WR.

 

[1960Pats]

Brady's 39 next year. I agree somewat about getting him an outside wr. Lafell was awful. Gronk only showed up. This team just needs to stay healthy. Sucks not having that first round pick this year

After giving it some thought I don't see the loss of that pick being a big deal. With the money they save on a 1st round pick they can find a FA who won't be as much as a gamble.

 

[reflexblue]

WR's like Megatron, Jones, Green etc. are bright shiny objects that dazzle and mesmerize, they seem to be the answer to a passing game that will be unstoppable, but they are not. What good are they if the qb doesn't have more than two seconds to get rid of the ball because the offensive line is terrible. If a qb has a line that will give him 4,5,6 seconds than you don't need one of these high priced cap clogging shiny objects. What we have will do.

 

[PatriotsPimp136]

WR's like Megatron, Jones, Green etc. are bright shiny objects that dazzle and mesmerize, they seem to be the answer to a passing game that will be unstoppable, but they are not. What good are they if the qb doesn't have more than two seconds to get rid of the ball because the offensive line is terrible. If a qb has a line that will give him 4,5,6 seconds than you don't need one of these high priced cap clogging shiny objects. What we have will do.

True but it makes brady's life a little easier. He doesn't have to fit balls in certain spots.

 

[reflexblue]

True but it makes brady's life a little easier. He doesn't have to fit balls in certain spots.

those shiny objects cost a lot of money, one way to bankrupt your team is by paying large sums of money on a few high priced players, such as megatron, green jones etc.

 

[Boomer B]

True but it makes brady's life a little easier. He doesn't have to fit balls in certain spots.

Yup. That's the frustrating thing with Lafell. He gets 1 on 1 coverage deep and he gets no separation. Brady has no room for error to hit the deep ball. Always tight coverage.

 

[PatriotsPimp136]

those shiny objects cost a lot of money, one way to bankrupt your team is by paying large sums of money on a few high priced players, such as megatron, green jones etc.

Well it depends. A young wr is worth that
money. They haven't doned a good job finding that x receiver throughout the years in the draft. I was never a dobson guy even in college. The guy plays small. Not physical. People on this board still have hope. I don't what they been watching.

 

[Kontradiction]

It's not a true fire deep threat per se that they need (although one would be nice). They just need a bigger wideout who can threaten outside the numbers. Lafell gave the team that in 2014 and the offense was nearly unstoppable through the air. He couldn't give us that in 2015 and the offense was decidedly average throughout parts of the season once defenses figured that out (although that wasn't the only reason). I, personally, don't think he recovered properly from the foot injury. He was never the same guy this season. If the team thinks he can recover, they should keep him. If not, try to replace him and at least let him compete in camp. If they can find a burner that can beat press, then that's even better.

 

[Kontradiction]

And, also, a deep threat means nothing when the OL can't protect the passer for the two seconds necessary to get the ball deep.

 

[hellolin]

I posted this in another thread

We don't need an 80 catch, 1000 yds, 10 Td outside WR. We just need someone who can keep the D honest and who would require safety help on deep routes. Safety's don't respect guys like Lafell and he always gets 1 on 1 deep coverage, and rarely beats it. If we get a guy who requires safety help it will open up routes for Gronk and others.

And that's exactly what Lafell did last year, just good enough and that was all we needed. This year he regressed and look at what got us.