Some Reality Regarding Our Defense

[everlong]

The defense is poor at best right now but I believe they'll improve. Enough to win a Super Bowl is the question. The disconcerting part for me is the D-Line. They don't excel in rush or push defense and seemed to get pushed around a lot. I don't think that has a lot to do with a new scheme.

 

[Ring 6]

Ryan Kerrigan, Clay Matthews, Jabaal Sheard, Carlos Dunlap, Conor Barwin, I mean Aaron Maybin, who the Jets got for nothing was healthy.

Also James Sanders and Brandon Meriweather were healthy too. As was Page. Injuries are the call of the loser - See Red Sox.

Wait, so since there are other players in the NFL who aren't injured the fact that some of our players are injured is irrelevant to a discussion about the quality of our defense? Really?

 

[nabwong]

For me, the defense has improved in one MAJOR category: Red Zone. If the D can keep the opponent to field goals, we'll be fine.

 

[PatsBoy12]

The only way to go is up at this point. I think it's mostly an issue of new guys and lack of playing time together in a new defense. I expect the defense to play well in the second half.

I'll get worried if the defense is costing us games in week 10. As of now, it's hard to watch, but that's generally been the trend with our defenses, they almost always play much better in the second half.

I'll add, we definitely have the personnel to be a top 10 defense. I think as the season wears on they'll start throwing more wrinkles in and things will look much better. They seem to be playing extremely vanilla right now. I think BB is worried about unleashing them until everyone is up to speed.

While I really do respect your opinion and want to agree with the message, I just feel like it's wishful thinking. We've said the same thing for the past few years and, while the small improvement did materialize, it just wasn't enough overall at the end of the season and playoff time. A lot of the players on the team, while young, have been in the system for a few years now. That means that even though it was a short offseason and all that, it still shouldn't look this bad.

With all that said, I want to share your optimism for our young defense. I will also say that drastic improvement as the safety position is so necessary right now. I feel the pass rush will get better, but I am not so sure about the secondary.

 

[shmessy]

While I really do respect your opinion and want to agree with the message, I just feel like it's wishful thinking. We've said the same thing for the past few years and, while the small improvement did materialize, it just wasn't enough overall at the end of the season and playoff time. A lot of the players on the team, while young, have been in the system for a few years now. That means that even though it was a short offseason and all that, it still shouldn't look this bad.

With all that said, I want to share your optimism for our young defense. I will also say that drastic improvement as the safety position is so necessary right now. I feel the pass rush will get better, but I am not so sure about the secondary.

I don't see the safety position getting any better. They are stuck with what they have unless something drastic happens (the Ed Reed for Jeff Tarpinian trade?).

I think the best we can hope for is what we saw on Sunday. A limited secondary playing zone and the DL eating up the opponents running game (other than 2 big runs).

Sunday, this group optimized its performance. They played as well as can be expected.

The Ali rope-a-dope was hard to watch, but strategically effective. This is hard to watch also. Personally, I hate it, entertainment-wise.

 

[E Belichick Unum]

How many of our top 15 defensive players were out injured on Sunday?
How many of those playing were wearing casts or braces?

We have a bunch of injured and new players trying to learn a new defense, after having a much shortened off-season. They will improve. For example, the stopping of the best rushing offense in the nfl was indeed impressive. Would last year's defense be expected to do as well?

Excuses about injuries are just excuses to lie down like dogs, and the perfect example was Ellis Hobbs. Every time he got burnt he was injured, which means he was injured every game he played.

Belichick brought in a Hanesworth and Carter to play a 4/3 and then he let all of his experienced safeties go. The one thing that made the defense better last year was that nobody wanted to hit the deep middle seam, because Merriweather would lay some hurt on them, and now we have nobodies who are making the minimum and are afraid to hit anybody for fear of getting fined by the league.

There might be some hope, if Ron Brace can be considered hope. Our linebackers are just OK, our secondary gets fried every f'ing game, our d-line makes Jason Cambell look like Ken Stabler, and our nose tackle is second on the team in ints. This defense is in serious trouble and there is nothing on the horizon that I can see that will help it get any better. There isn't a magic wand out there to turn chicken sh!t into chicken pie, and right now this defense is chicken sh!t, and that might be insulting chicken sh!t.

 

[E Belichick Unum]

For me, the defense has improved in one MAJOR category: Red Zone. If the D can keep the opponent to field goals, we'll be fine.

The opposing offense is just tuckered out by the time they get into the red zone, those long completions make the whole team run to beat the 40 second clock,

 

[Observer]

The opposing offense is just tuckered out by the time they get into the red zone, those long completions make the whole team run to beat the 40 second clock,

Brilliant!

 

[TB=TD]

Ryan Kerrigan, Clay Matthews, Jabaal Sheard, Carlos Dunlap, Conor Barwin, I mean Aaron Maybin, who the Jets got for nothing was healthy.

Also James Sanders and Brandon Meriweather were healthy too. As was Page. Injuries are the call of the loser - See Red Sox.

Your team is 2-2 fu.k off Jet fan.

 

[alvinnf]

While I really do respect your opinion and want to agree with the message, I just feel like it's wishful thinking. We've said the same thing for the past few years and, while the small improvement did materialize, it just wasn't enough overall at the end of the season and playoff time. A lot of the players on the team, while young, have been in the system for a few years now. That means that even though it was a short offseason and all that, it still shouldn't look this bad.

With all that said, I want to share your optimism for our young defense. I will also say that drastic improvement as the safety position is so necessary right now. I feel the pass rush will get better, but I am not so sure about the secondary.

What part of last years post season exit is on the D. If they get to where they were at the end of last year, I'm ok with that....

 

[E Belichick Unum]

What part of last years post season exit is on the D. If they get to where they were at the end of last year, I'm ok with that....

Here is the stat of last season's Patriots playoff game 0-0-0.
0 QB pressures
0 QB hits
0 QB Sacks

You cannot win games by throwing an effort like that at the opposing team. Look at the Buffalo game, look at last week's Raiders game, no pressure equals 100+ QB ratings.

 

[Boston Tim]

I thought Pepper Johnson's comments were enlightening, in regards to the defense surpassing the coaches' expectations a little bit at this point in the season. At first, I thought it was a BS statement but then I wondered if he really meant it. If so, the coaches' expectations for the Defense are pretty low (even at this early stage).

Also, it seems like the front 7 is supposed to contain the run and consistently generate some sort of pressure, with the quality of the CB play dictating whether or not this pressure turns into sacks. You usually think of the d-line getting pressure/sacks to help the secondary, not the reverse. You might even say its a 50-50 effort, if you've got the personnel to pull it off. BB's draft and free agency strategy seems to indicate that the key to getting to the QB rests mostly on the cornerbacks. Now that I think about it, its always been that way. BB is just going after higher quality cornerbacks now that he can't instruct them to make contact downfield (hello, Ty Law).

 

[Darolyn72]

Jet fan. Jet fan!!! Listen you bottom dweller, I was watching this team, when you were home playing your little Nintendo games. You're sports knowledge is most likely tied to you fantasy league and Madden experience. This message boards is 40% fanboys who thinks everyone who criticizes the team is a Jet fan. Come up with something a little more original. You sound like a 8 year old arguing with his friends on a playground. Is Jet fan the best you can come up with you uninformed, obtuse little clown.

 

[JackBauer]

Jet fan. Jet fan!!! Listen you bottom dweller, I was watching this team, when you were home playing your little Nintendo games. You're sports knowledge is most likely tied to you fantasy league and Madden experience. This message boards is 40% fanboys who thinks everyone who criticizes the team is a Jet fan. Come up with something a little more original. You sound like a 8 year old arguing with his friends on a playground. Is Jet fan the best you can come up with you uninformed, obtuse little clown.

No. In your case, Jets fan would be a charitable designation. If what you say is true, that's even worse.

 

[MassPats38]

Jet fan. Jet fan!!! Listen you bottom dweller, I was watching this team, when you were home playing your little Nintendo games. You're sports knowledge is most likely tied to you fantasy league and Madden experience. This message boards is 40% fanboys who thinks everyone who criticizes the team is a Jet fan. Come up with something a little more original. You sound like a 8 year old arguing with his friends on a playground. Is Jet fan the best you can come up with you uninformed, obtuse little clown.

Solid rant. You throw accolades at a Jets player and call the Red Sox losers when the Yankees are still in the playoffs - I have no idea how other posters might confuse you with a Jets fan.

Andy asked a good question of your post on page 2 of this thread that you apparently declined to answer. Use your extensive football knowledge to clarify the point you believe you are making, and also explain how injuries to new players when you are trying to indoctrinate those players into one of the more complex defenses in the NFL would not create real problems in the development of that defense at the beginning of the season.

And injuries in the team concept of football are not the same as injuries to a baseball team - the two sports are fundamentally different.

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

Jet fan. Jet fan!!! Listen you bottom dweller, I was watching this team, when you were home playing your little Nintendo games. You're sports knowledge is most likely tied to you fantasy league and Madden experience. This message boards is 40% fanboys who thinks everyone who criticizes the team is a Jet fan. Come up with something a little more original. You sound like a 8 year old arguing with his friends on a playground. Is Jet fan the best you can come up with you uninformed, obtuse little clown.

tell me WHYYYYYY are weeee so BLIIIIIIIIND to seee that the OOOOOOONES we hurt are YOUUUUUUUUUUU and meeee

 

[shmessy]

Jet fan. Jet fan!!! Listen you bottom dweller, I was watching this team, when you were home playing your little Nintendo games. You're sports knowledge is most likely tied to you fantasy league and Madden experience. This message boards is 40% fanboys who thinks everyone who criticizes the team is a Jet fan. Come up with something a little more original. You sound like a 8 year old arguing with his friends on a playground. Is Jet fan the best you can come up with you uninformed, obtuse little clown.

Sorry, Carolyn.

 

[Shelterdog]

Here is the stat of last season's Patriots playoff game 0-0-0.
0 QB pressures
0 QB hits
0 QB Sacks

You cannot win games by throwing an effort like that at the opposing team. Look at the Buffalo game, look at last week's Raiders game, no pressure equals 100+ QB ratings.

They actually got pressure against the Raiders (2 hits, 14 pressures according to pro football focus; Bedard had similar numbers) but your point is valid; the secondary isn't good enough to stop a passing attack unless they get a ton of pressure up front.

 

[BSR]

Jet fan. Jet fan!!! Listen you bottom dweller, I was watching this team, when you were home playing your little Nintendo games. You're sports knowledge is most likely tied to you fantasy league and Madden experience. This message boards is 40% fanboys who thinks everyone who criticizes the team is a Jet fan. Come up with something a little more original. You sound like a 8 year old arguing with his friends on a playground. Is Jet fan the best you can come up with you uninformed, obtuse little clown.

No where in there is there a denial at being a Jets fan. Its been pretty clear for some time now.

 

[condon84]

For me, the defense has improved in one MAJOR category: Red Zone. If the D can keep the opponent to field goals, we'll be fine.

I guess this is the silver lining. Our goal line D has been pretty good too.

Carter has been coming close and has been applying decent pressure. He's getting held a lot, but I see OLs holding DL/DEs on every game. We need push up the middle to take advantage of Carter's outside rush. Haynesworth out there would help us tremendously. It's too bad Pryor got hurt, he was applying pressure up the middle.

Don't know how BB's gonna fix our Safety issue. Asking Chung to cover for Barrett or Brown's mistakes is unreasonable. He doesn't have the speed to do it. Maybe we can clone Wilfork's brain and stick in Barrett's body. Wilfork has more instinct than Barrett does.