So, are we looking for cornerbacks?

[KevinFaulk-33]

http://mmqb.si.com/2015/03/19/nfl-draft-cornerbacks-trae-waynes-marcus-peters/

Nice article about Waynes and Peters. The more I read about Peters the more I like him. I don't think the Patriots will gamble with him, maybe if he slides...

 

[manxman2601]

http://mmqb.si.com/2015/03/19/nfl-draft-cornerbacks-trae-waynes-marcus-peters/

Nice article about Waynes and Peters. The more I read about Peters the more I like him. I don't think the Patriots will gamble with him, maybe if he slides...

I watched one game of his last night and came away thinking that he's a bit of a freelancer - nothing concrete, it was just an impression I got from watching him. That would explain his difficulties with his coaching staff. If so, I very much doubt we'd draft him.

 

[BelichickFan]

Peters is also unremarkable as an athlete. Look up his combine numbers and is spits out . . . Bradley Fletcher. Other than Peters clearly doing better in the Shuttle, their numbers are incredibly similar.

 

[manxman2601]

Peters is also unremarkable as an athlete. Look up his combine numbers and is spits out . . . Bradley Fletcher. Other than Peters clearly doing better in the Shuttle, their numbers are incredibly similar.

I will say this in his defence though, he's damn combative. No WR will be given an easy ride when faced with Peters. Having said that though I'd rather have Byron Jones and Kevin Johnson who are lesser risks.

 

[BelichickFan]

I will say this in his defence though, he's damn combative. No WR will be given an easy ride when faced with Peters.

There's things to like for sure. But if I'm taking a first round CB with his issues, for a good sized (but not huge) CB (6'0", 197) I expect better than a 4.53 40, 1.60 10 yard split and 7.08 3 cone. Not to say they're the same player but we already have those numbers in Fletcher, 6'0", 196, 4.54, 1.58, 7.04.

 

[mayoclinic]

I will say this in his defence though, he's damn combative. No WR will be given an easy ride when faced with Peters. Having said that though I'd rather have Byron Jones and Kevin Johnson who are lesser risks.

I'm definitely in the "CBs are not choirboys" camp. I like CBs who are very physical, even with the new rules. I loved Browner, and I was never a big fan of finesse CBs like Asante Samuel and Darius Butler. Obviously, physical guys who "freelance" too much or are out of control are a problem (Brandon Meriweather).

Peters is very aggressive and physical, and I like that. I don't know if he has the mental discipline to fit with the Pats. That's something to be sorted out. He took responsibility for his behavior and admitted that he acted immaturely, so that's something:

“I just embarrassed the whole University of Washington program on live television – me throwing, as my mama would say, a hissy fit,” Peters said. “I threw a hissy fit, man. I embarrassed my teammates, the coaching staff, the program, man. I wouldn’t have let me back on after that.”

“I don’t blame [Washington head coach Chris] (Petersen) for anything,” Peters said. “All I can blame is myself, because I made those decisions and I have to live with them. Now I’ll have to man up and I’ve got to answer these questions in interviews, and all I can do is sit there and answer truthfully and honestly.”

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.co...deserved-to-be-kicked-off-team-at-washington/

That may all be damage control spin, but it sounds fairly authentic. If it's a case of Peters having had to grow up a bit, that's manageable. If it's likely to be an ongoing issue, it's not. I agree that Byron Jones and Kevin Johnson are "lesser risks" in terms of their maturity and character, but Peters still has the best press-man skill set of any CB in the past several drafts, so I'd definitely take a hard look before ruling him out.

Peters, Jones and Johnson are my top 3 CBs at the moment. Come away with any of those 3, plus Eric Rowe or Josh Shaw, and I'm very happy with the long term direction at the position.

 

[mayoclinic]

Nice read by Robert Klemho at the MMQB on Marcus Peters and Trae Waynes:

http://mmqb.si.com/2015/03/19/nfl-draft-cornerbacks-trae-waynes-marcus-peters/

 

[midwestpatsfan]

I agree with alot Mayo just said above.
I like my corners to have a bit of an attitude and swagger. It is one position on the field that overconfidence is almost a must. These guys are put in positions to fail and without an an oversized sense of self worth, they will fail.
Byron Jones is so athletically gifted, but I don't think he maximizes it on the field. He looks a little mechanical. He has the biggest upside, but he doesn't feel like a guy you can throw out there day 1 and think he is going to be successful.
Kevin Johnson may be the realistic pick for the Patriots. His floor is as high as any CB in this class. He could stand to be more physical and he needs to bulk up, but I like him too.

 

[mayoclinic]

I agree with alot Mayo just said above.
I like my corners to have a bit of an attitude and swagger. It is one position on the field that overconfidence is almost a must. These guys are put in positions to fail and without an an oversized sense of self worth, they will fail.
Byron Jones is so athletically gifted, but I don't think he maximizes it on the field. He looks a little mechanical. He has the biggest upside, but he doesn't feel like a guy you can throw out there day 1 and think he is going to be successful.
Kevin Johnson may be the realistic pick for the Patriots. His floor is as high as any CB in this class. He could stand to be more physical and he needs to bulk up, but I like him too.

I want Peters IF the Pats' evaluate him personally and believe that he can fit within their structured system. I like his brashness and swagger:

http://www.philadelphiaeagles.com/n...s-Peters/d1f46628-aadb-4b0e-8754-3af41d43863b

Like Todd Gurley, he's a top 10 prospect IMO who will go later in the draft than his on-field play warrants. Whether he's in reach is another matter altogether, but he wouldn't even be a consideration if not for (1) the off-field issues and (2) his timed speed.

I personally don't care at all about Peters' Combine numbers. Joe Haden ran a 4.64 at the Combine, and had similar agility numbers to Peters (6.94 3C slightly faster, 4.34 SS slightly slower; he improved his 40 time to 4.43 and his SS to 4.08 at his Pro Day, the same as Peters). Richard Sherman ran a 4.6 40 at the Combine and 4.53 at his Pro Day. I ignore Peters' numbers and look at his tape, and he's a #1 CB. If the brashness and aggressiveness can be controlled, he'll be a top 5 CB by his 3rd season in the NFL, possibly sooner.

Eric Rowe is probably my #2 press-man CB prospect in this draft. As Brian Kronsky at BuffaloBillsDraft noted:

Because of his size, Rowe employs a physical style of play and sets a tone every time the ball is snapped. He excels in press coverage, and keeps contact prevalent within the first five yards of his opponent’s route. Rowe jams his opposing receiver immediately, manipulates him to change how he will run the route and ultimately controls the play from the beginning.

With the skills that Rowe possesses, he can win on both short and long routes because he can dominate from the snap.

http://www.buffalobillsdraft.com/2015/01/2015-nfl-draft-prospect-to-watch-eric-rowe-cb-utah/

That's what I want from my CBs. Aggressive, physical play to re-direct receivers and make them fight for everything. That style fits perfectly with Devin McCourty as the single high FS, with Pat Chung as a star/stud hybrid safety, and with the front 6/7.

 

[manxman2601]

I agree with alot Mayo just said above.
I like my corners to have a bit of an attitude and swagger. It is one position on the field that overconfidence is almost a must. These guys are put in positions to fail and without an an oversized sense of self worth, they will fail.
Byron Jones is so athletically gifted, but I don't think he maximizes it on the field. He looks a little mechanical. He has the biggest upside, but he doesn't feel like a guy you can throw out there day 1 and think he is going to be successful.
Kevin Johnson may be the realistic pick for the Patriots. His floor is as high as any CB in this class. He could stand to be more physical and he needs to bulk up, but I like him too.

From what little I've seen of him, I'm impressed with Jones' ball skills - he was a WR in college. His interception against Michigan was Sherman-esque. For now I have Peters behind Jones and Johnson. He might be the better press corner out of the box but his character scares me, I'm not sure he's coach-friendly which is pretty much a pre-requisite for the Patriots.

 

[kennyb]

There's things to like for sure. But if I'm taking a first round CB with his issues, for a good sized (but not huge) CB (6'0", 197) I expect better than a 4.53 40, 1.60 10 yard split and 7.08 3 cone. Not to say they're the same player but we already have those numbers in Fletcher, 6'0", 196, 4.54, 1.58, 7.04.

You can't really go by just the numbers, Fletcher when he came out was said to have tight hips and wasn't going to be able to play man to man as I recall. Peters is more a natural man to man guy.

 

[mayoclinic]

From what little I've seen of him, I'm impressed with Jones' ball skills - he was a WR in college. His interception against Michigan was Sherman-esque. For now I have Peters behind Jones and Johnson. He might be the better press corner out of the box but his character scares me, I'm not sure he's coach-friendly which is pretty much a pre-requisite for the Patriots.

I think he has to be coachable, not necessarily "coach-friendly". But I agree that is a significant issue to be addressed. I have Peters as my clear #1, but with a major asterix depending on how the Pats evaluate that particular issue.

 

[mayoclinic]

Peters, Jones and Johnson are my top 3 CBs at the moment. Come away with any of those 3, plus Eric Rowe or Josh Shaw, and I'm very happy with the long term direction at the position.

Thinking about this some more, I may end up having Eric Rowe rated 2nd after Marcus Peters, because of his physicality, length, and suitability to press-man coverage. I'm hoping Rowe lasts to the late 3rd, but I'd take him earlier if necessary.

 

[mayoclinic]

A very nice breakdown on Eric Rowe:

http://titletownsoundoff.com/uncategorized/scouting-report-eric-rowe-cb-utah/

 

[manxman2601]

I think he has to be coachable, not necessarily "coach-friendly". But I agree that is a significant issue to be addressed. I have Peters as my clear #1, but with a major asterix depending on how the Pats evaluate that particular issue.

My other issue with Peters is that I think he's limited as a man-press corner. Judging by Browner's release, I wonder if BB wants more flexibility from his secondary and I wonder whether Peters is too scheme specific.

 

[mayoclinic]

My other issue with Peters is that I think he's limited as a man-press corner. Judging by Browner's release, I wonder if BB wants more flexibility from his secondary and I wonder whether Peters is too scheme specific.

That's a valid consideration. I've committed pretty strongly to the press-man approach in my blueprint, both last year and for the future. I never would expect it to be the sole scheme, but I think it should the dominant one, so I've strongly favored guys like Peters and Eric Rowe. Obviously, if BB feels differently it would have an impact.

I want Peters and Rowe. I'd settle for Jones or Johnson and Josh Shaw. It will be interesting to see what the Pats actually do, especially if multiple options are available.

 

[manxman2601]

My other question is whether we actually do need a second corner. If you assume that we get a #1 in the first round, whomever that may be, we've got 6 other corners battling for the #2 and slot corner position.

I'm fine drafting a good value and high upside corner like Nick Marshall but I don't think a double-dip is necessarily a requirement.

 

[BobDigital]

My other question is whether we actually do need a second corner. If you assume that we get a #1 in the first round, whomever that may be, we've got 6 other corners battling for the #2 and slot corner position.

I'm fine drafting a good value and high upside corner like Nick Marshall but I don't think a double-dip is necessarily a requirement.

I am not against the idea of 2 CBs or 2 OGs or 2 DL but I don't think it is strictly needed.

I think a drafted G that boots Devey is really all you need for this year. Kline saw some snaps in the playoffs and did well. I am happy with him as the emergency Guard.

DL is the same. The guys who are questionable to me are Chris Jones and Zach Moore (Buchanan in my mind is an after thought till proven otherwise). If you feel comfortable with those 2 you have 8 guys. Draft one of course but do you really need to worry about a 10th guy? Maybe they only go with 9.

CB is interesting cause you have 6 players right now and could use in injection of front line talent. However every rookie you carry bumps someone off. If the rookie CBs take time (which is not unheard of as we all know) are we going to only carry 3-4 guys that can actually play at this level for part of the season?

Not saying don't do it. Just I think it is not automatic.

 

[mayoclinic]

My other question is whether we actually do need a second corner. If you assume that we get a #1 in the first round, whomever that may be, we've got 6 other corners battling for the #2 and slot corner position.

I'm fine drafting a good value and high upside corner like Nick Marshall but I don't think a double-dip is necessarily a requirement.

I don't know if it's a requirement, but I'd like to see it if the right prospects are available. Peters and Rowe are my guys.

As you noted elsewhere, Alfonzo Dennard could return to form as a #2 CB. Or Malcolm Butler could step into that role. Both are a bit undersized for what I would prefer out of starting press-man CBs. That's also why I'm not so high on Steve Nelson.

If the Pats feel that they have a viable option at #2 - at least for 2015, and probably for 2016 - then I'm much more open to guys like Nick Marshall or Chris Conley, who I think have a ton of upside at the position but who will likely need more development time.

 

[mayoclinic]

Current big board status of some CB prospects of interest, FWIW:

- Marcus Peters: 29 CBS Sports; 21 ESPN; 28 The Huddle Report; 27 GBN
- Byron Jones: 55 CBS Sports; 48 ESPN; 171 The Huddle Report; 41 GBN
- Kevin Johnson: 26 CBS Sports; 26 ESPN; 33 The Huddle Report; 33 GBN
- Jalen Collins: 55 CBS Sports; 28 ESPN; 35 The Huddle Report; 24 GBN
- PJ Williams: 37 CBS Sports; 50 ESPN; 25 The Huddle Report; 50 GBN
- Quentin Rollins: 42 CBS Sports; 69 ESPN; 46 The Huddle Report; 38 GBN
- Eric Rowe: 118 CBS Sports; 98 ESPN; 155 The Huddle Report; 164 GBN
- Josh Shaw: 87 CBS Sports; 150 ESPN; 118 The Huddle Report; 75 GBN
- Alex Carter: 76 CBS Sports; 117 ESPN; 86 The Huddle Report; 71 GBN
- Jacoby Glenn: 132 CBS Sports; 274 ESPN; 121 The Huddle Report; 133 GBN
- LaDarius Gunter: 181 CBS Sports; 155 ESPN; 144 The Huddle Report; 154 GBN
- Nick Marshall: 176 CBS Sports; 285 ESPN; 190 The Huddle Report; 169 GBN
- Damian Swann: 229 CBS Sports; 261 ESPN; NR The Huddle Report (> 200); 185 GBN

That leaves out shorter guys like Steve Nelson, Ifo Ekpre-Olomu, Doran Grant, D'Joun Smith, Senquez Gholson, Lorenzo Doss, Charles Gaines and Kevin White. I've left off Ronald Darby and Justin Cox for now because I'm not sure how they fit.