SMY: Pats, Lloyd close to deal

[Ring 6]

Nice if this can be done. However I hope people understand that Lloyd coming to the Pats doesn't mean the Pats will suddenly pass for 6000 yds next season. Lloyd's yds will just mean fewer yds for Gronk, Hernandez, and Welker, etc. The plus will be that, hopefully, the reduced yards will be easier to get and result in more points

Don't get me wrong. I'm not down on Lloyd. I'm sure he'll be a fine addition. My concern is that because of his signing, we might lose Anderson and/or Carter. Don't forget these are the guys who provided HALF our sack total, and likely half the pressures and QB hits. I just hope that by signing a marque player who can make a great passing attack slightly better, might cause us to lose a player or two who are critical to a defense that....lets say....isn't "great".

Agree with your points, but I think the concept here is that some teams, with some style of play can make it harder for us without someone outside.
We don't need to throw for more in games we already win 35-14, but if we create better matchups, needing to pick your poison gives us more options on days we struggle.
Now we don't 'struggle against good Ds' any more than any other team, as many claim, but if you have more weapons than anyone, struggling down from a higher level the same amount still adds up to more.

As far as Anderson and Carter, I think we may need to replace them rather than resign them.
I am very concerned about Carter being able to recover from a severe leg inury at his age and get close to what he was. Anderson is an incomplete player who struggled for years despite obvious pass rushing skills, put up a big number and now wants to be paid for it. That smacks of a guy who will revert to the play that got him on the street before we resurrected him.

 

[patsinthesnow]

Nice if this can be done. However I hope people understand that Lloyd coming to the Pats doesn't mean the Pats will suddenly pass for 6000 yds next season. Lloyd's yds will just mean fewer yds for Gronk, Hernandez, and Welker, etc. The plus will be that, hopefully, the reduced yards will be easier to get and result in more points

Don't get me wrong. I'm not down on Lloyd. I'm sure he'll be a fine addition. My concern is that because of his signing, we might lose Anderson and/or Carter. Don't forget these are the guys who provided HALF our sack total, and likely half the pressures and QB hits. I just hope that by signing a marque player who can make a great passing attack slightly better, might cause us to lose a player or two who are critical to a defense that....lets say....isn't "great".

I'm just asking, you would rather Deion's corpse, Ochostinko, or a rookie be our #2 WR? I think #2 WR is equally or more important than signing Anderson.

 

[signbabybrady]

Nice if this can be done. However I hope people understand that Lloyd coming to the Pats doesn't mean the Pats will suddenly pass for 6000 yds next season. Lloyd's yds will just mean fewer yds for Gronk, Hernandez, and Welker, etc. The plus will be that, hopefully, the reduced yards will be easier to get and result in more points

Don't get me wrong. I'm not down on Lloyd. I'm sure he'll be a fine addition. My concern is that because of his signing, we might lose Anderson and/or Carter. Don't forget these are the guys who provided HALF our sack total, and likely half the pressures and QB hits. I just hope that by signing a marque player who can make a great passing attack slightly better, might cause us to lose a player or two who are critical to a defense that....lets say....isn't "great".

I dont see what Lloyd has to do with resigning defenders? The patriots will allocate a certain amount of money to each position. If Anderson and/or Carter don't come back its because they got more then pats budget for those players at their position.

 

[West Philly Patriot]

I am on the Lloyd train 100%. We need a sure handed Vet who can get free on the outside who also understands and executes the system. It's not even about the regular season numbers or putting up more yards, who cares. This signing helps us in the postseason when the really good defenses take away the middle like they've been doing the last 3 years.

We need to be able to counter the Ravens, Texans, and Steelers of the world when it really matters. Tired of seeing welker and AH fight though layers of defenders with no repercussions for the opposing D

 

[FreeTedWilliams]

I think that Lloyd is an upgrade over both Dieon and Ocho. I would still like to see the Pats garb Steven Hill in the draft. He has Megatron like size and speed. and that could really open up the middle for the TEs and WWW.

 

[Mossachusetts]

I think that Lloyd is an upgrade over both Dieon and Ocho. I would still like to see the Pats garb Steven Hill in the draft. He has Megatron like size and speed. and that could really open up the middle for the TEs and WWW.

Actually Calvin Johnson is a lot bigger lol, but Brandon does have good hands.

 

[HowardRoark]

Actually Calvin Johnson is a lot bigger lol, but Brandon does have good hands.

I think he meant Stephen Hill with the Megatron comment.

 

[patfanken]

Agree with your points, but I think the concept here is that some teams, with some style of play can make it harder for us without someone outside.
We don't need to throw for more in games we already win 35-14, but if we create better matchups, needing to pick your poison gives us more options on days we struggle.
Now we don't 'struggle against good Ds' any more than any other team, as many claim, but if you have more weapons than anyone, struggling down from a higher level the same amount still adds up to more.

As far as Anderson and Carter, I think we may need to replace them rather than resign them.
I am very concerned about Carter being able to recover from a severe leg inury at his age and get close to what he was. Anderson is an incomplete player who struggled for years despite obvious pass rushing skills, put up a big number and now wants to be paid for it. That smacks of a guy who will revert to the play that got him on the street before we resurrected him.

Well if have have to chose one, I'd bring back Anderson who is younger and by the end of the year was playing the run better than most people were giving him credit for. There's some upside for him in that area. BTW- its not easy to simply "replace" what was literally HALF our effective pass rush last season.

 

[Ring 6]

I dont see what Lloyd has to do with resigning defenders? The patriots will allocate a certain amount of money to each position. If Anderson and/or Carter don't come back its because they got more then pats budget for those players at their position.

??????????
The cap is for the team, not by position. If Lloyd gets a 6mill cap # that is 6mill that can't be spent elsewhere.

 

[patfanken]

I'm just asking, you would rather Deion's corpse, Ochostinko, or a rookie be our #2 WR? I think #2 WR is equally or more important than signing Anderson.

No its a matter of allocating resources. BTW- in the Pats offense, the #2 WR is the FOURTH option on most plays. And the #1 WR is usually in the slot, so your smarmy depiction of needing a "#2 WR" is a gross exaggeration.

BTW- let me ask you a question. What needs improving the most, our top 3 offense, or our bottom 3 defense. So in that vein, which is more important, adding a WR or the guys who accounted for 50% of our sack total last season

 

[Deus Irae]

Get Lloyd

Re-sign Branch if he'll take a low end deal

Draft a WR with one of the top 3 picks

Bring in camp bodies to compete with the low end (Branch/Johnson/Edelman) guys

Call the wide receiver search over for the year (barring injury, of course)

 

[Patspsycho]

The one good thing is that the longer this drags out, the lower the numbers are going to be on the contract that gets inked. More value for us.

 

[Ring 6]

Well if have have to chose one, I'd bring back Anderson who is younger and by the end of the year was playing the run better than most people were giving him credit for. There's some upside for him in that area. BTW- its not easy to simply "replace" what was literally HALF our effective pass rush last season.

What I am saying is I want NEXT YEARS Carter and Anderson, not LAST YEARS.
If we try to make them the same, we will be very disappointed.
Also, I am more concerned with improving the interior pass rush which was very lacking last year. That will make whoever is outside more effective.

 

[Deus Irae]

No its a matter of allocating resources. BTW- in the Pats offense, the #2 WR is the FOURTH option on most plays.

People keep making this claim, but it's not true. We've seen the Pats offense change over the years, and it's based upon the personnel, not positional slotting. If Lloyd earns the throws, he'll get the throws.

 

[Marqui]

No its a matter of allocating resources. BTW- in the Pats offense, the #2 WR is the FOURTH option on most plays.

The Patriots offense has no numbered "options". They just throw to whoevers open.

 

[Tunescribe]

He's also rumored to be a bit of a malcontent if things don't go his way.
Christian Fauria, who played with Lloyd while with the Redskins, had little if any praise for him.

-Jamman

McDaniels never coached with the Redskins and Lloyd hasn't played with Brady or for BB. So far your "point" is irrelevant.

 

[JMC00]

When a position is deep in a draft, it means we are less likely to draft it early, and wait for the value to fall into later rounds.

I think if someone like Brian Quick, Nick Toon or Tommy Streeter is there when there 3rd round pick comes up.

4 picks in the first 63 picks, gotta think Belichick is maybe looking at Safety, a OLB/DE, a CB and maybe an O-Lineman.

 

[Deus Irae]

He's also rumored to be a bit of a malcontent if things don't go his way.
Christian Fauria, who played with Lloyd while with the Redskins, had little if any praise for him.

-Jamman

Given how obsessive BB seems to have gotten about clearing out the so-called malcontents, I would imagine that any contract will be set up with Mr. Lloyd's attitude/behavior having been addressed.

 

[FirstAndGoal]

The Patriots offense has no numbered "options". They just throw to whoevers open.

You're actually both incorrect. Every play has a series of progressions that depend upon the play, and the defense but there are progressions. It's not a free-for-all. In terms of who is #1, #2, etc for reads, again, that depends on the play.

What I also don't believe is that the Patriots view a receiver as a #1, #2, etc where teams traditionally use those numbers to declare an x,y,z receiver. The most productive receivers whill get the most plays where they are the primary receiver. That's it. One year it's Moss. Another year it's Welker, another year, it could be whoever has the hot hand.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

The Patriots offense has no numbered "options". They just throw to whoevers open.

Fun fact: in 2007, Brady targeted Moss more than he targeted Welker. The targets actually went Moss > Welker > Stallworth > Faulk > Gaffney > Watson.