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Situational Head Scratchers: Poor Clock Management

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by nabwong, Nov 19, 2012.

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  1. nabwong

    nabwong PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    So we had the ball just before half time. I think it was 2nd & 7. The clock was running down 2:30-ish. I remembered we could have run it down to the 2 minute warning. The colts had 3 timeouts left. Instead, we ran a play and it was incomplete, stopping the clock before the 2 min warning. So fast forward, the colts get the ball back with 1:55+ and 3 time outs.

    My question is this:

    Why not run the clock down to 2 min warning and we have 2nd and 3rd downs to potentially run the clock down to 1 min or slightly less? Or if the colts wanted more time, they would have been forced to burn some timeouts. I know the colts didn't score but we could have reduced the possibility even further. This comes after last week's quick snap against buffalo.

    Am I off base?
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2012
  2. SacPete1

    SacPete1 Practice Squad Player

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    I was thinking the same thing but since they weren't showing the playclock, I figured it was going to run out before the 2 minute warning.
     
  3. coolguy

    coolguy Banned

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    The patriots simply have more confidence getting first downs through the air than they do running it.
     
  4. nabwong

    nabwong PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #12 Jersey

    It's not about getting the first down. It's about why we did not let the clock go to the 2 min warning. Unless I am wrong about the play clock.
     
  5. The Gr8est

    The Gr8est In the Starting Line-Up

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    Well considering the defensive and special teams scores, the offense had spent a lot of time on the sidelines and needed the work and BB was trying to preserve clock.

    Yeah, that's the ticket.

    :rolleyes:
     
  6. Joker

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    I was in the stands and not looking at the clock...but I knew it was winding down...during halftime shooting the shiz with other fans is when I found out...immediately thought of the exact same ploy last week...I guess McD just doesn't care enough
     
  7. tombonneau

    tombonneau In the Starting Line-Up

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    I was thinking same thing but swear I saw the play clock and there was too much of a discrepancy to run it down.
     
  8. DaBruinz

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    I went and looked at the play-by-play and they should have had enough time since the play clock should have been reset to 40 seconds (not 25) since the 1st down play occurred at (2:41) remaining and took more than 1 second off the clock.. So, yes, they should have let the clock continue to run since it looked like the Colts weren't going to use their timeouts on that side of the 2 minute warning.

    I'll be honest. I think that sometimes Brady just gets caught up in the moment and forgets about the clock management. Either that, or it's McDaniels. Either way, it's not a good thing.
     
  9. VrabelJr

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    This hurts to say but our defense has been more situationally aware this year than the offense has at times. Especially in the two minute areas. We used to be known as that team whose offense was going to kill you in the two minute area but that hasn't been as apparent this year.
     
  10. Gumby

    Gumby 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

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    #11 Jersey

    McD is setting everybody up.

    The entire season long he is going to run this HAND0FF to RIDLEY quick snap on the goal line until everyone sees it coming a mile away. Then in the playoffs he is going to do the play action and TB will throw it to Gronk.
    .....


    oh wait, :bricks: ([please dont beat me up for blackhumor, sometimes if you dont laugh you will cry] god, I hope he heals up quick at least for first playoff game)


    or else McC will just keep on having TB hand off to ridley over and over again using these single back formation, quick snap no huddle plays. :bricks::bricks:
     
  11. Gumby

    Gumby 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

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    #11 Jersey

    McD is setting everybody up.

    The entire season long he is going to run this HAND0FF to RIDLEY quick snap on the goal line until everyone sees it coming a mile away. Then in the playoffs he is going to do the play action and TB will throw it to Gronk.
    .....


    oh wait, :bricks: ([please dont beat me up for blackhumor, sometimes if you dont laugh you will cry] god, I hope he heals up quick at least for first playoff game)


    or else McD will just keep on having TB hand off to ridley over and over again using these single back formation, quick snap no huddle plays. Because SOME DAY IT IS GOING TO WORK. :bricks::bricks:
     
  12. abdul7

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    #12 Jersey

    You know what ? I am going to show this thread to my son later,,becoz i screamed out when they Threw on 2nd and goal with 2m. 4secs i think on the clock,,leaving 3rd down with 2m.2secs. When my son asked me why i hated the call,,i explained they should have let the clock run down to the 2m warning,,,or call a run play on second down. After kicking the FG ,,we did leave them enough time to go down and get something,,,so yes i agree with you.
     
  13. DarrylS

    DarrylS PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Do not want to sound facetious, but is this a really big complaint??

    Sounds somewhat "Borgesesque".....
     
  14. smg93

    smg93 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

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    I don't think its "Borgesesque" at all. This is a team that prides itself in situational football. It's always been said that one should play complimentary football. Had the offense been able to not run a play till the two minute warning or at the very least ran the ball it would have made the defense's job easier because time would have been their ally.

    For a team that prides itself on smart plays, this one should definitely be reviewed. With that said, I agree with another poster who believes that TB is so intense sometimes or is so in the flow that he forgets these things. All in all, I would rather they used the clock more wisely on this play but I still love TB no matter what. :D
     
  15. 1960Pats

    1960Pats 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

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    And for those who want to lay this at the feet of McDaniels or say it's no big deal, that same clock mismanagement was behind the 4th and 2 fiasco at Indy a few years ago. Had the Pats run it on either 3rd and 1 or 4th and 1, the clock would have gone below the 2 minute mark and a replay would have been automatic. Instead the Pats wasted a TO on 3rd and couldn't ask for a replay on 4th.

    I also noticed the same stupidity yesterday when they had a three score lead at the 12 minute mark and went pass happy. When they did run the ball Vereen went OOB. No way Kevin Faulk taught any of the RBs that move. Those are the kind of things that has led to some rallies by the opposing teams.
     
  16. BSR

    BSR In the Starting Line-Up

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    No because it gave Indy too much time. I rarely have a problem with their end of half management but this one was a head scratcher.

    It started at about the 3 and a half minute mark. They were at about the Indy 29. They weren't in the no huddle but weren't using all of the clock. They could have easily left less than a minute on the clock if they wanted. It was really strange.
     
  17. PatsWickedPissah

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    Disable Jersey

    It seems to be a new thing this year so I'm attributing it mostly to Josh who makes the pass vs run calls. Hard to rationalize this un-Patslike behavior since BB is supposed to be famous for analyzing everything post game, including coaching decisions. You'd think that there'd be emphasis on clock management.

    It's like we've morphed into an alternative Herm Edwards universe. :)
     
  18. nabwong

    nabwong PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #12 Jersey

    Up to that point, I think the colts had twice or more the offensive time. We could have helped our D a little bit more as well as reduce the risk of a fight back. It would also have been a bigger psychological scar had we eliminate their "hope".

    I sent this to mike Reiss. Will be interested to see what he will say.
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2012
  19. PatsFaninAZ

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    It was bad situational football. There's really no other way to put it. The only way that it's defensible is if you imagine that, since the Patriots had time outs, their plan was to score as fast as they could to get the ball back after stopping the Colts 3 and out. Given our defense, that would have been stupid strategy. But at least it would have been a strategy.

    The answer to the question whether they needed to run a play is definitely no. There was an 8 second difference between the play clock and the 2:00 warning. I posted about it live in the gameday thread.

    The only rational basis for running the play on the plus side of the 2:00 warning, other than the one above, is if they liked the defensive grouping on the field and didn't want to give the Colts a free time out to sub. But barring that, it was terrible clock management.

    It never ceases to amaze me how bad teams are at clock management. They just don't understand the nuances. Perhaps the saving grace yesterday was that the Colts screwed it up even worse when they got the ball back.

    But perhaps the worst clock decision of the day yesterday had to be the Steelers. Ravens had just run a play on second down and the clock was winding down to 2:00. Tomlin called a time out -- his last -- at 2:04. The announcers were actually praising the call -- get the time out in before the 2:00 warning. It is an absolutely idiotic call. If there is 2:10 or more left, perhaps, but even then it's stupid.

    Why? Well you get virtually nothing out of it. If you let the clock tick down to the 2:00 warning, instead of stopping it at 2:04, you can just use your last time out after the Ravens run their next play. The only difference in that circumstance is that you have about 1:55 instead of 2:00 on the clock. Either way if they get the first down, the game is over.

    So, what is the downside of what Tomlin did? Well, here's the big one -- you give the Ravens a free chance to throw a pass. There is no downside now to a pass play on third down, because the clock is going to stop either way. If, instead, you let the clock run to 2:00 and keep your time out, then you virtually force the Ravens to run, so they make you use that last time out. And, if they do pass, and it's incomplete, you have saved a time out instead of using it just for a whopping 4 seconds.

    The other down side is exactly the one that played out. The Ravens ran a play. The defense was offside. It wasn't enough for a first down, but since the play ran 4 seconds off the clock and replayed the down, the Ravens got to run on third down and use up 40 seconds. Just absolutely idiotic time management.

    Here's another potential downside. Suppose, on the third down play, the Steelers commit a defensive penalty that leads to an automatic first down. If you call the time out before the 2:00 warning, the game is now over. You have the 2:00 warning, and the Ravens kneel on the ball 3 times. But if you wait for the 2:00 warning, now you still have a chance. With a time out left, you can get the ball back with 30 seconds left, even with the automatic first down. Just a really terrible terrible call, that people actually think is the smart call.

    Given how much parity there is in the NFL, I would think a team could justify paying a coach to do nothing other than be aware of clock situational play. It really used to be a Patriots strength, and they are still better than most of the league, but this year they have shown some poor clock decisions -- the Jets game was particularly bad.
     
    Last edited: Nov 19, 2012
  20. nabwong

    nabwong PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #12 Jersey

    I thought someone like Ernie would be all over clock management. But then again, I have no idea what he does. lol.

    I think one reason why clock management has been so bad is because of lack of practice maybe. We almost have the same core personnel.
     
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