Sirius Radio says Bodden still in Houston, could sign a deal later today

[Sleeping King]

Butler-Wilhite may be a risky choice, but I could see BB taking it.

Butler- has potential to be the best corner since Ty Law, you can see the potential.

Wilhite- The talent is there, he needs to be coached. He is right near receivers, just is dumb by never looking towards the ball.

It would be a very young duo that could be here for 4 years straight, something the pats haven't had.

EDIT: To the OP, I classify Wheatley as a bust and shouldn't step on the field, but I think Wilhite can be coached up to be a good #2 CB.
He did start 8 games last season.

If Wilhite or Wheatley are the starting CB opposite Butler the ground crew better add a third digit to the opponent's scoreboard. :bricks:

 

[patsinthesnow]

Wilhite will absolutely step on the field and could be the #2 CB or, at worst, the #3.

I really don't get all this venom for Wilhite. I don't know how you can say that about Wheatley, either, since none of us know what his situation is.

Finally, someone who doesn't think Wilhite sucks. I think he has the talent, he just needs to be coached. Butler-Wilhite '10.

 

[paradox]

Butler-Wilhite may be a risky choice, but I could see BB taking it.

Butler- has potential to be the best corner since Ty Law, you can see the potential.

Wilhite- The talent is there, he needs to be coached. He is right near receivers, just is dumb by never looking towards the ball.

It would be a very young duo that could be here for 4 years straight, something the pats haven't had.

EDIT: To the OP, I classify Wheatley as a bust and shouldn't step on the field, but I think Wilhite can be coached up to be a good #2 CB.
He did start 8 games last season.

Wilhite was absolutely terrible when he played. He got beat constantly and never saw him make a play. How some of you think he could be a #2 is beyond me. He has shown nothing to think that of him.

The kid has the CB fundamentals of a freshman in high school. Run with the WR, you look when he does skippy. We lost at least 2 games at the end because of his piss poor coverage.

Butler is a huge bright spot. We are currently screwed at the moment if we lose Bodden

 

[patsinthesnow]

If Wilhite or Wheatley are the starting CB opposite Butler the ground crew better add a third digit to the opponent's scoreboard. :bricks:

Do people forget wilhite DID start 8 games last season? I'm pretty sure the scoreboards were only lit up twice in that span (IND, NO), and Wilhite was at some fault in both. But, It's Peyton Manning and Drew Brees.

 

[paradox]

Do people forget wilhite DID start 8 games last season? I'm pretty sure the scoreboards were only lit up twice in that span (IND, NO), and Wilhite was at some fault in both. But, It's Peyton Manning and Drew Brees.

You act like he beat out some good talent to start. Who? Wheatley and Springs?

He was in by default and it showed. Him starting 8 games doesnt mean he should have.

 

[JackBauer]

Re: Sirius Radio says Bodden still in Houston,could sign a deal later today

Oh, yippie, another forum for DW Toys' perpetual jihad against Maroney and Sanders!

1-Matt Light (I love this guy but you have Volmer and LeVoir and Kaczur who just signed an extension) and a $4.5m Salary with not CAP punishment.

Matt Light will not be traded and is currently the putative starter at LT. I'm not sure why you would have any confidence whatsoever in an OT rotation of Vollmer, Kaczur, and LeVoir, but there you have it.

Light-Mankins-Koppen-Neal-Vollmer is by far and away the strongest OL permutation.

2-Ron Brace(or Pryor) Signed in somewhat of a case as a fallback in case VW did not sign yet a good young player to dangle for need DT teams.

Why on earth would you trade a guy when you don't even know how good he is?

3-Maroney-Have to get what you can get.

I know you hate Maroney so I'm not going to argue with you on this. Personally, I think the best solution would be to draft a Dwyer-type to pair with Maroney and keep Taylor for another season. If Maroney does OK again, re-sign him for relatively cheap next year.

4-Sanders-A good safety but we have 4. He is not the long term solution.

We should have four safeties, because we don't know how Chung is going to progress and, in case you hadn't noticed, McGowan didn't exactly acquit himself well over the second half of last season.

We need a CB. Richard Marshall has as much talent as Bodden and 25 years old. He is a good tackling CB. He has a second round tender. Do we throw a second rounder to a prover young NFL CB or hope a drafted rookie can come through? I would rather dangle one of the above and a lower picks to conserve our 4 in the top 53 but we seem to have another hole perhaps today.

I would consider the 2nd round tender if Bodden signs elsewhere.

 

[emoney_33]

Re: Sirius Radio says Bodden still in Houston,could sign a deal later today

OMG! You're seriously going to compare running an NFL team to running some kind of packaging company, payroll-wise??? You're willing to compare the NFLPA to your Plumbers and Fitters Local?" The costs inherent to paying employees of Patriot Place to those of paying iconic national superstar athletes? Unfreakinbelievable. Yes the NFL is a "business." It is also a "game/sport" (even moreso than it is a business, according to the Supreme Court).

Robert, you're one of the most level-headed posters here, but I am so tired of people justifying the Patriots' approach to "value" in it's players by using a standard business model you might use for starting up a Subway franchise. Sorry that's just me.
:bricks:

I "get" the whole "value" argument, I really do. Just DON"T use it to justify every move or non-move the Pats make. Do you think when they signed Adalius Thomas they might have been thinking, "this is what he is going to be worth on the open market--which is more than the value we assign him, however we have a huge glaring hole at the LB position, and we need to do something about it."

It's a business. It IS a business. The main goal is to profit. One way to profit is providing your customers with a good product. Teams are not trying to build winning teams just because they want to win, they are trying to build winning teams to entice their customers (fans) to spend money on their product.

 

[Kontradiction]

Well, I don't think that BB is going to be comfortable going into the season with a Butler - Wilhite - Wheatley/Springs combination, so my guess is that we're drafting another CB this season. HOPEFULLY, either one of Wilhite or Wheatley proves us wrong this season and takes the leap along with Butler, who I'm pretty confident will make the leap this season, if healthy.

 

[patsinthesnow]

You act like he beat out some good talent to start. Who? Wheatley and Springs?

He was in by default and it showed. Him starting 8 games doesnt mean he should have.

My point to all of this is, If Bodden leaves (most likely is), do you want to spend one of the 2nds on a CB? I think it would be a waste. Those picks need to go to the pass rush and a receiver. A better pass rush would make Wilhite look better. Wilhite wasn't the defensive problem. In fact, the defense was 5th in PPG (17.8).

So, I'm asking, when Bodden leaves? What do you do for #2 CB

1. Draft one with one of the three second rounders.
2. The trash left on the market.
3. Start one of Wilhite, Wheatley, Springs.

 

[JackBauer]

Finally, someone who doesn't think Wilhite sucks. I think he has the talent, he just needs to be coached. Butler-Wilhite '10.

Wilhite is not nearly as bad as the usual suspects here paint him out to be. He's raw, needs more time in the system, but as far as his coverage skills are concerned, I have reason to believe he'll continue to improve. He's almost always in position, fluid in the hips; he just needs to get his technique down.

Just remember, these are the same types of people who were wont to throw Samuel under the bus when he struggled early on in his career.

Whether or not he's starting caliber, I'm still not sure. But to act like he doesn't even deserve to be on the field is foolish.

 

[Synovia]

Wilhite was absolutely terrible when he played. He got beat constantly and never saw him make a play. How some of you think he could be a #2 is beyond me. He has shown nothing to think that of him.

If you think Butler was better than Wilhite, you have no idea how to evaluate cornerback play. Wilhite got significantly more playing time than Butler because right now, hes a significantly better player.


This Butler-as-Ty-Law is nothing but wishcasting.

 

[emoney_33]

ya i think i could live a pretty good life for 900k a year. lol some footballs players say they can't feed there kids for 5 million a year.


i don't make half of 900k a year and my kids have everything they want. what i would like to know what are they feeding there kids. lol

The only difference, where it starts to become understandable, is that professional football players have a marketable skill with a very small window for income opportunity. Making $10M in 5 years may seem like a great salary that any of us could live on, but if their career ends after 5 years they don't have the same foundation to earn money in other careers. so $10M over 40 years becomes $250K a year. Definitely good money but not nearly the absurd levels we see. Not to mention that a good chunk of that money is spent during their careers, from charities to luxuries.

 

[Bring Back Antowain!]

Yes, Jonathan Wilhite struggled at times last season. He's a young cornerback. Young cornerbacks often struggle in this league.

Athletically, he's a freak. He can stay stride for stride with any wide receiver in this league. He also is very fluid in the hips, he can turn and jump on a ball easily. Has excellent closing speed. He is improving as a tackler, he can come up and make a tackle against the run. Something Butler needs to work on. Wilhite is surprisingly physical, but is athletically gifted.

So what creates the impression that Wilhite "was terrible" (as one poster claimed) last year? It's the fact that he seriously needs to work on his ball skills. This was the knock on him coming out of Auburn. Yeah, he's athletic, but he doesn't make enough plays on the ball. He's constantly in the right position, but his receivers tend to make catches on him. However, this is something that can be coached up, something he can improve on. If he can learn to consistently make plays on the ball and break up passes, he will a very adequate #2.

 

[paradox]

My point to all of this is, If Bodden leaves (most likely is), do you want to spend one of the 2nds on a CB? I think it would be a waste. Those picks need to go to the pass rush and a receiver. A better pass rush would make Wilhite look better. Wilhite wasn't the defensive problem. In fact, the defense was 5th in PPG (17.8).

So, I'm asking, when Bodden leaves? What do you do for #2 CB

1. Draft one with one of the three second rounders.
2. The trash left on the market.
3. Start one of Wilhite, Wheatley, Springs.

There is talent for CB in this draft. If Bodden goes then I think we have to draft one. That or make a trade for a CB, I don't know who. The bold with a rookie pass rush makes we want to puke.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Re: Sirius Radio says Bodden still in Houston,could sign a deal later today

I'm taking $4 million more than what the Patriots might have offered not $4 million contract.

Might have offered when? 2009 off-season? This year? AAV?

The 2010 Patriots are a fence team. Meaning they are close to being a contender and close to not making the playoffs. Their record has been progressively worse for three straight seasons. Despite what the homers may want to think the team has a plenty of holes to fill. They can absolutely get started on those with the top 4 picks. They can fill a few (WR2, P, Vet LB) all with reasonable free agents like usual but they need to keep the good players that were on the team that went 10-6. They did that so far with TBC, Neal and Wilfork. Losing Bodden opens up a massive hole.

The Pats squeezed all they could out of the 03-07 core. They need to upgrade the talent in a number of areas. There is no doubting this.

Losing Wilfork, 05 Harrison and Brady are massive losses. Bodden is a nice player, but massive loss? That's a stretch.

I hate being negative but if the starting corners are Butler/Whilhite it's going to be a long season.

Butler is your next #1 CB. The kid is damn good. he had some rough patches last year, but as a rookie he performed as expected. No question that keeping Bodden and improving the pass rush makes the team better. Having someone from the Willhite/Wheatley 08 draft emerge would help ease the loss.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

IF Bodden signs with the Texans, you can expect Asante Samuel to speak to the media regarding the Pats losing Bodden in
3......2....1... following the news

 

[paradox]

Yes, Jonathan Wilhite struggled at times last season. He's a young cornerback. Young cornerbacks often struggle in this league.

Athletically, he's a freak. He can stay stride for stride with any wide receiver in this league. He also is very fluid in the hips, he can turn and jump on a ball easily. Has excellent closing speed. He is improving as a tackler, he can come up and make a tackle against the run. Something Butler needs to work on. Wilhite is surprisingly physical, but is athletically gifted.

So what creates the impression that Wilhite "was terrible" (as one poster claimed) last year? It's the fact that he seriously needs to work on his ball skills. This was the knock on him coming out of Auburn. Yeah, he's athletic, but he doesn't make enough plays on the ball. He's constantly in the right position, but his receivers tend to make catches on him. However, this is something that can be coached up, something he can improve on. If he can learn to consistently make plays on the ball and break up passes, he will a very adequate #2.

And Mayo has the "potential" to be the next Lewis. Some of you think Wilhite is going to magically improve because he needs to be coached up. Doesnt always work that way. He hasnt shown me anything to think that way.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

If you think Butler was better than Wilhite, you have no idea how to evaluate cornerback play. Wilhite got significantly more playing time than Butler because right now, hes a significantly better player.


This Butler-as-Ty-Law is nothing but wishcasting.

If I were to place a bet on which of the two will be better between Wilhite and Butler,I bet on Butler without a second to think about it. - Wilhite can only improve as he gets more involved in the secondary and he WILL if Bodden says bye-bye

 

[signbabybrady]

If Wilhite or Wheatley are the starting CB opposite Butler the ground crew better add a third digit to the opponent's scoreboard. :bricks:

Is a player allowed more than 25 games before he is listed as a bust?

If you were coaching Asmougha you would have given up on him to quickly I see.

While I am not sure what we will ever get out of Wheatly I think it is unfair to not at least give him one more TC before you say he is a bust.

And Whilhite has shown more than enough through 2 seasons to think he could be a pretty good CB.

Do I think we need another CB if Bodden is gone yes especially since the one Vet we have missed significant time last year but I think people are greatly overexagerating the need here with or without Bodden.

There IMO is only one NEED on this team and that is pass rush. There are some other holes but NEED to me says without filling it we wont win a SB and really pass rush is the only thing that falls in that category for me.

 

[RobertWeathers]

If you think Butler was better than Wilhite, you have no idea how to evaluate cornerback play. Wilhite got significantly more playing time than Butler because right now, hes a significantly better player.


This Butler-as-Ty-Law is nothing but wishcasting.

Butler was a rook last year. Little too rugged on the kid. No?

Every rookie CB gets torched his 1st year. The key is the 2nd.