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Should we have made a push to bring in Sharper or Dawkins?


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That 1st game against Cinci was a GIFT for a king, they had no business winning that 1.

They had no business losing the Raiders game. It still evens out.
 
Congratulations - you have won the official aqua4ever award.

aqua4ever was a dolphin fan. I'm not.

Are you saying Dawkins wouldn't have been an improvement this year?

Is the original poster then an Aqua4ever too?
 
Man, I wish you guys would stop quoting kilenfan. I have that stupid failure of a poster on my ignore list for being a complete waste of a human brain.

Oh, so now we're allowed to insult posters? FU, "black glass". Homer.
 
I had some interest in Dawkins this offseason, but I had concerns about adding an old safety to a defense that lacked speed in '08. As for Sharper, I knew the Patriots wouldn't have any interest. The main reason Sharper was shown the door in Minnesota was his tendency to freelance. That tendency leads to big plays...both ways. The Minnesota staff wanted Sharper to play assignment football and simply got fed up with him not following the gameplan. Obviously, this would be a huge red flag in the Patriots Defense.

In hindsight, I'd love to have either guy on the team this year. For a few weeks, McGowan/Merriweather looked like a great young tandem. Now McGowan is benched and Merriweather has made a number of notable mental errors. I still like Merriweather a lot, but maybe playing with a veteran safety would have been best for him this year.
 
I had some interest in Dawkins this offseason, but I had concerns about adding an old safety to a defense that lacked speed in '08. As for Sharper, I knew the Patriots wouldn't have any interest. The main reason Sharper was shown the door in Minnesota was his tendency to freelance. That tendency leads to big plays...both ways. The Minnesota staff wanted Sharper to play assignment football and simply got fed up with him not following the gameplan. Obviously, this would be a huge red flag in the Patriots Defense.

In hindsight, I'd love to have either guy on the team this year. For a few weeks, McGowan/Merriweather looked like a great young tandem. Now McGowan is benched and Merriweather has made a number of notable mental errors. I still like Merriweather a lot, but maybe playing with a veteran safety would have been best for him this year.

You make some good points.

Whether with FA or the draft, whenever a player does well somewhere else (Dawkins and Sharper at safety, Clay Matthews at LB, for example) there is a tendency on this board to post one of these kind of threads, with many posters suggesting (1) that BB should have been clairvoyant about the unexpected success the player in question has had and gone after him, and (2) that the player's success on another team in a different system would have translated into equivalent success with the Pats. Obviously, both of these assumptions are flawed.

Last free agency no one wanted Sharper for a reason. He was a 33 year old FA safety coming off of a solid but uninspiring season with Minnesota in which he had had 1 interception, his career low since becoming a starter. He didn't sign with NO until March 18, so he was not exactly a highly sought after guy, and the Saints didn't go after him terribly aggresively. As you say, he had a reputation for free lancing and giving up the big play, which BB abhors, and which led Minnesota to decide not to more aggresively pursue re-signing him. Obviously, Greg Williams' defense was perfectly suited to take advantage of his skills. The Pats' defense would not have been so perfect.

Brian Dawkins was coming off of a pro bowl season in 2008, but was 35. Most people were shocked when Denver threw a 5 year $17M contract with incentives up to $27M at him. The cost of our entire secondary was less than that contract. And 2009 was not an uncapped year. Even if you subtract the voidable years, $4.5M/year for a 35 year old player was very aggressive. Obviously, in retrospect it was worth it, especially to a team like Denver which needed leadership. We don't know that the Pats didn't want Dawkins. James Sanders wasn't re-signed until March 1, the day on which Dawkins signed with Denver, so for all we know the Pats went after Dawkins and were simply outbid by the Broncos.

The big demand for the Pats defense last offseason was to get younger and faster. Signing 33-35 year old FA's was just not something that people were clamoring for last FA. Not that BB would have cared, but those signings would have been met with a lot of skepticism.

Finally, last FA I don't think anyone anticipated quite the void in defensive leadership that we have experienced. The Vrabel trade was quite unexpected, and came on February 27. Dawkins signed 2 days later with Denver, on March 1. I think many here expected Tedy Bruschi to be with the team this season mainly to provide veteran leadership and continuity. I don't think people expected his skills to have eroded to the point where he really couldn't get on the field. The Junior Seau experiment of bringing in a veteran leader who hasn't been able to work his way into the lineup much hasn't been a huge success so far this season.

Going back through the threads on this forum, I have been unable to find a single thread posted around either signing bemoaning the Pats' lack of interest in picking up either Dawkins or Sharper.

Great players having great years, yes. But Hindsight is always 20/20, and it's not clear that either would be having nearly as much success if the Pats had picked them up.
 
Going back through the threads on this forum, I have been unable to find a single thread posted around either signing bemoaning the Pats' lack of interest in picking up either Dawkins or Sharper.

Great players having great years, yes. But Hindsight is always 20/20, and it's not clear that either would be having nearly as much success if the Pats had picked them up.

I posted about wanting him in the thread about Paxton getting signed.

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/10/219459-paxton-signed-broncos.html#post1295762

I hadn't really posted about it until he signed, though, so it's not as if I was beating drums every day. Also, I can't see complaining that he wasn't signed, given the size of his contract. I don't have the details on how team friendly the contract is, so it wouldn't be fair to kvetch.
 
Problem with the Pats simply to many decisions are made when money is the sole focus " signing bonus money" that is. When you have people that you draft and nurture through your system and you know they can play and have proven it you go to those guys a year and a half before FA and offer them a good market contract not a home town discount. First it lets the player know he is one of the building blocks of the team and you have a content player. Instead we let players like Branch, Givens, Graham and Samuel go. Why because we had to squeeze the rookie contract out of them every last dime and you don't think that creates animosity? Now the Pats have gone to some players namely the offensive line and Ty Warren to name a few but in general they haven't and now the same crap is happening with Wilfork and to boot you trade away Seymour two days before the season starts. I contend his presence would have made a difference as far as rushing the passer. On our local sports talk show host Michael Felger has taken the Pats to task over this salary cap and their spending habits and in the beginning I thought he was full of hot air but as I examined his comments I totally agree with him. Every team is given a cap of 125 mil what the Pats say is they spend to the cap every year but the real secret hear is the bonus money that comes right from the owners pockets and it's now obvious to me in this case their trying to assemble the team on the frugal side. You have a franchise qb in his prime with maybe four more solid years left they should be maximizing every off season how they assemble this team every year. It's a qb driven league and franchise qb's to fall into your lap every ten years.
 
aqua4ever was a dolphin fan. I'm not.

Are you saying Dawkins wouldn't have been an improvement this year?

Is the original poster then an Aqua4ever too?

Aqua4ever was as obnoxious as any poster ever was and you are giving him a run for his money. At least he wasn't a supposed fan of the Pats. If you treat(ed) your wife anywhere close to the way you treat your sports team, you must be divorced by now, or never found anyone to say yes.

The OP is respected, makes good points, raises interesting questions and didn't throw a needless trashing of Sanders in there.

Would Dawkins have helped this team, sure, as would countless number of other free agents - I bet other teams wish they had picked up Welker for a song too a couple of years ago..

You seem to have a need to trash this team and posters beyond belief.
 
chung.jpg


ImgDyn.cfm
 

This pick makes me wish that they had invited all four second-rounders. Imagine the Krafts standing next to Mt. Vollmer. :rofl:
 
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we could have gotten Deion Sanders but until we address the real need which is a pass rush our secondary will continue to be inconsistent and not look so good. In large part I do not think it is their fault.

we need pass rushers and we need real answers.
 
Sharper, yes. Dawkins, no.

Dawkins would be good for leadership though.
 
Aqua4ever was as obnoxious as any poster ever was and you are giving him a run for his money. At least he wasn't a supposed fan of the Pats. If you treat(ed) your wife anywhere close to the way you treat your sports team, you must be divorced by now, or never found anyone to say yes.

The OP is respected, makes good points, raises interesting questions and didn't throw a needless trashing of Sanders in there.

Would Dawkins have helped this team, sure, as would countless number of other free agents - I bet other teams wish they had picked up Welker for a song too a couple of years ago..

You seem to have a need to trash this team and posters beyond belief.

Well...I am somewhat negative and disappointed in this season and make no bones about it. I still am hopeful for the year but I was pretty crushed after NO. I get so many insults from posters on here it almost wants to make me turn against the pats, even though I've been a fan since the mid 70s, longer than some of these jackals have been alive.

I don't insult other posters at all, unless they insult me.

Sure Welker was good, that's true. Wish they could hire a decent OC who could make the offense a little bit less predictable.
 
Well...I am somewhat negative and disappointed in this season and make no bones about it. I still am hopeful for the year but I was pretty crushed after NO. I get so many insults from posters on here it almost wants to make me turn against the pats, even though I've been a fan since the mid 70s, longer than some of these jackals have been alive.

I don't insult other posters at all, unless they insult me.

Sure Welker was good, that's true. Wish they could hire a decent OC who could make the offense a little bit less predictable.

OK - I a really going to make an effort here......you do realize the season is not over?

Winning a division and having a home game (or 2) in the playoffs is a huge accomplishment. Division Championship T shirt and hats only happen to 4 teams from the AFC every year. So, if nothing else good happens this year, winning the division alone should eliminate any negativity or dissapointment. How spoiled did you get after the amazing 3 out 4 run??


Only 6 teams make the playoffs from a conference and only 4 can win their divisions, - we will most likely be one of those teams, that in and of itself should be HUGE to a fan from the 70's.


This Sunday is a T shirt & hat game - you should be really pumped - I know my group of 6 Patriot fanatics right here in Foxboro are all, ahem, jacked and pumped out of our minds for Sunday. Then, we also know a HOME playoff game will soon follow. Do you recall how many home playoff games there were before the Bledose era starting in 1996 and of course the Brady years starting with snowbowl? The answer is one and we were blown out in 1978 by spaghetti legs Pastorini from the HOuston Oilers.

With the exception of the Saints game, we snatched defeat from the jaws of victory (all teams have a bummer game or two every year - ours came at a time when the Saints met happened to have had their best game of the year) as for the Jets, Miami, Colts, Denver (all of those games were lost due to our own meltdown, not that we were outclassed, outplayed or hopeless as you seem to think). One more victory, just one, would mean we would be in position for #2 seed and most would be saying we are odds on favorites to make it to the Superbowl or at least be one of the front runners?

There are many promising signals that you can look at that may very well mean this team could go very far in the playoffs, such as Maroney's running, hopeful and apparent return to health of Brady, Wilfork, Warren, Taylor, Neal etc. Yes, there are things that need to be addressed, but they are working hard and have the talent on the field and coaching them to get over the hump.

There is not one team we will face that scares me or that we are not capable of beating in the playoffs.

Try looking at things positively, you just might like what you see......I have had this feeling for the past couple of weeks now that this team is going to go deep in the playoffs and I really am thinking Miami is in their future.
 
I concur. BB screwed up again, it looks like. Instead we signed the venerable James Sanders for a long term deal.

Re-signing lil' Jimmy Sanders was a(nother) waste of money by Emperor William. Also see Connelly, Dan; Alexander, Eric; Kaczur, Nick; et.al.

The guy I wanted him to sign as our SS for this season was Sean Jones. He played under RAC the past 4 years in Cleveland, so the transition would've been as seamless as a vet joining a new team could've been expected to make; he has the height/weight which I prefer in a SS; and he would've cost over $2M /year less than Jimmy the JAG.

P.S. to Klinefan: pay no heed to the delusional, KoolAid-drinking homers who are too blind to see that the Emperor is no longer wearing any clothes.
 
Re-signing lil' Jimmy Sanders was a(nother) waste of money by Emperor William. Also see Connelly, Dan; Alexander, Eric; Kaczur, Nick; et.al.

The guy I wanted him to sign as our SS for this season was Sean Jones. He played under RAC the past 4 years in Cleveland, so the transition would've been as seamless as a vet joining a new team could've been expected to make; he has the height/weight which I prefer in a SS; and he would've cost over $2M /year less than Jimmy the JAG.

P.S. to Klinefan: pay no heed to the delusional, KoolAid-drinking homers who are too blind to see that the Emperor is no longer wearing any clothes.

Are you telling me Sanders makes 5M a year?? Jones signed a one year deal for 3M.

PS - You can sure call me a homer or fanatic, I am. I can call you a fair weather fan, you so are.
 
Spoiled whiners comes to mind.
 
I concur. BB screwed up again, it looks like. Instead we signed the venerable James Sanders for a long term deal.

so did 30 other teams... those idiots... it seems if someone else makes a right decision bb is an idiot. once again can someone show me how to delete a poster?
 
Nobody has answered my "question yet." Why do you sign a Sharper or Dawkins when you drafted a guy in the first round, and then early in the second round two years later at safety? Is Chung a bust?
 
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