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Shai Agassi - Electric Car Network Update

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by shmessy, Apr 17, 2009.

  1. shmessy

    shmessy Maude Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    Last edited: Apr 17, 2009
  2. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    Hydrogen is a much more plausible alternative. I just don't see electric vehicles as being practical. I could be wrong, but the energy you'd need, and the availability of refueling pose big time problems. Maybe in very urban area's, there could be a market for them, but I don't see wide scale usage, certainly anytime soon.
  3. shmessy

    shmessy Maude Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    I'm not being sarcastic, but did you read the link? I found it to be very in depth and an interesting piece.

    One of the main points in the article centers around current limitations on range and, precisely, what Better Place is implementing (5 minute replacement stations, dedicated GPS systems with unique info regarding range to replacement stations, etc. in each car).

    Keep in mind, however, the range limitations are CURRENT - - battery range development keeps extending every 6-12 months, so it will never be as big an impediment as it is right now.
  4. scout

    scout Rookie

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    #15 Jersey

    That guy is impressive.
    I believe, if you took a dozen of Shai Agassi's and an unlimited budget, they would have a solution to our transportation dilemma within five years.
    Yes, an unlimited budget. Whatever amount of money that they spend would be recaptured many times over.
  5. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

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    How many nuke and coal power plants will be required to provide all this electricity? How much to upgrade the power grid?
  6. shmessy

    shmessy Maude Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    From the article:

    "So where does Agassi’s Better Place fit into this electric universe? Because Agassi plans to buy only “clean” electricity, from wind and solar farms, Better Place customers will be, in theory, producing nearly zero emissions."
  7. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

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    ok how many windmills, and solar panels?
  8. shmessy

    shmessy Maude Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    A whole lot.

    Am I correct in guessing that you are considering the CURRENT capabilities of wind and solar and not taking into account the fact that those technologies are also exponentially improving year over year?
  9. shmessy

    shmessy Maude Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

  10. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I am thinking about the density of BTU of each technology I am also thinking about the damage to bird populations that would ensue from a massive number of windmills in an area with enough wind and the protest from the NIMBY crowd (think a windmill farm off the coast of the cape for example) or the protest of the greenies in CA when a solar farm was to be installed in the desert...
  11. shmessy

    shmessy Maude Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    Once again, the technology improvements over the next 40 years will necessitate fewer windmills and solar panels per BTU produced.

    What did cell phones look like 15 years ago?

    What did laptop computers look like in 1991? How powerful were they?

    No one is saying that 1.5 billion vehicles will be electric in 2011.

    This is a step. There will be many steps ahead.

    Someone starting out today as a 22 year old in a career knows that the $16,500 he puts into his 401(k) this year won't get him to a retirement next year.
  12. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Not saying there won't be improvements however the problems are very different than inproving electronic compentents. There is this 2nd law of thermo dynamics, plus the need for energy may outstrip the technology.

    Think economic development requirements in the third world.
  13. shmessy

    shmessy Maude Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    If the need for energy compounds (and it will), then aren't we at a worse position vis a vis using a FINITE source such as oil and coal instead of an infinite source such as the sun or wind?

    Today, nuclear is the only technology that can meet the world's needs for centuries, but even that relies on a finite resource in Uranium (plus, the disposal isn't exactly risk free yet).

    Again, we need to look at it as taking necessary steps - - not the currently easy ones.
  14. apple strudel

    apple strudel Banned

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    Nitpick: exponential growth is huge, huge improvement. They can not be improving exponentially, if they were we would be guaranteed a Utopian solution to the energy problem.
  15. shmessy

    shmessy Maude Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    You're right. Wrong word.
  16. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Well if your count coal and tar sands we have enough resources to cover everything for 100-200 years without other sources coming online. Not that other sources shouldn't be developed, fusion if we can develop it would be the real 'infinite' source of energy.


    Breeder reactors is almost a free lunch from a fuel POV and reduces the amount of waste.
  17. PressCoverage

    PressCoverage Banned

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    read every word... very interesting... very optimistic... i'll have more to comment later...

    a few things:

    - on page 2, the story mentioned that Agassi's "light went on" in 2005 at Davos ... it was then that he truly realized that mankind was facing an emergency ... Davos is the conference I have alluded to several times where the world finally acknowledged peak oil reality. ... It's interesting that this entrepreneur would invest such a huge portion of his life savings in such a risky ambition... underscoring the desperate situation mankind is in... kudos to him for taking such a risk...

    - transfer to clean energies for transportation is great, if it ever becomes viable... but I wonder what the elites have in mind to replace things like pesticides, rubber (1.4 billion tires?), road pavement, plastics, medicines, refrigeration, etc., that oil currently provides....

    - i tend to believe no amount of battery will propel an 18-wheel rig loaded with goods and services up a mountain-side highway...

    - as countries' governments and international banks continue to fall like dominos, what time is left? who has the money to invest?
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2009
  18. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign On the Roster

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    Freight trains are mostly powered by electric engines and they're damn powerful PC.
  19. Gunnails

    Gunnails Rookie

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    ==================================

    I think the electric motors are powered by diesel generators, still it proves the point that electric motors have some advantages over internal combustion..
  20. sdaniels7114

    sdaniels7114 Rookie

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    Am I bitter in thinking that its perfect that its a Jew who's well on his way to ruining the lives of millions of oil fat cats in Saudi Arabia, Iran, etc...

    Attach this guy's work to a just a couple more decent breakthroughs in clean coal technology and the world's gonna change.

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