Serioulsy, How bad will the Pats secondary get tourched Sunday?

[RayClay]

Fortunately, the players and team aren't losers.

I'm looking forward to the relatively new defense gelling together.

 

[DaBruinz]

Well since Ninkovich will be playing a lot, Manning will certainly have all day to throw.

That is BS also. Shows a complete lack of actually watching the games. Ninkovich has been getting pressure on the QBs despite having to face a tackle and getting chipped by a TE or RB half the time. Go back and watch the All-22 and you'll see it.

 

[supafly]

That is BS also. Shows a complete lack of actually watching the games. Ninkovich has been getting pressure on the QBs despite having to face a tackle and getting chipped by a TE or RB half the time. Go back and watch the All-22 and you'll see it.

I thought that Ninkovich played just fine on Sunday, even playing what could be considered "well" on certain plays.

I'm not suggesting that he's an all-pro, but I'm also not fully understanding the lack of respect for him by many.

I'm not stating that what I see is right, or vice versa, it's just interesting how different people see things in different ways. Ninkovich will never be one of the elite in the game, but he should be good enough to do his job/complete his assignments in most cases too. We will never have a team of allstars at every position.

 

[ivanvamp]

Manning will get his yards and Denver will score some points. But that's ok as long as NE wins.

Pats: 38-34
Manning: 365 yds, 3 td, 2 int

Brady will do his thing and put up 300+ yards and at least 3 td, and the running game will batter Denver. That said, I fully expect a very tough contest on Sunday.

 

[Bassman]

Yes because we all know that the 1st four games of the season are guaranteed to tell you exactly how good a team is going to be by the end of the year. It's a mathematical imperative, right?

You can be all whiny and cover your eyes and just look at stats, but they never tell the whole story. Especially when you just cherry pick the ones you want while ignoring other things. Like the team is "on pace" to have as many interceptions as they did last year. Or that they are "on pace" to give up 37 fewer passing 1st downs than last year.

The Pass defense is a work in progress and has shown improvements. Most people understand that.

So what do you want to do, wait till the end of the year before you realize the pass defense is not that great. The rush defense is better, and they are on pace to match INT's and increase fumble recoveries. You can be all whiny and cover your eyes, but the fact is the pass defense is NO better so far this year than last year. Enjoy the sand.

 

[PlainOldEd]

Seriously, How bad did the threads in this forum got?

Not to mention the grammar.

 

[PlainOldEd]

So what do you want to do, wait till the end of the year before you realize the pass defense is not that great. The rush defense is better, and they are on pace to match INT's and increase fumble recoveries. You can be all whiny and cover your eyes, but the fact is the pass defense is NO better so far this year than last year. Enjoy the sand.

This is just not true.

 

[Joker]

 

[Brady_to_Moss]

The game hasn't even been played..wait until it at least starts

 

[RayClay]

So what do you want to do, wait till the end of the year before you realize the pass defense is not that great. The rush defense is better, and they are on pace to match INT's and increase fumble recoveries. You can be all whiny and cover your eyes, but the fact is the pass defense is NO better so far this year than last year. Enjoy the sand.

So you propose totally turning over parts of the defense every four games until we get it right?

Personally, I think having a very talented first round draft pick we built around turn out to a be blockhead, has made it more important that we build chemistry among a cohesive group, but what do i know?

 

[Marqui]

I thought that Ninkovich played just fine on Sunday, even playing what could be considered "well" on certain plays.

I'm not suggesting that he's an all-pro, but I'm also not fully understanding the lack of respect for him by many.

I'm not stating that what I see is right, or vice versa, it's just interesting how different people see things in different ways. Ninkovich will never be one of the elite in the game, but he should be good enough to do his job/complete his assignments in most cases too. We will never have a team of allstars at every position.

He was solid against the Bills, but what about the other 3 games where he was invisible? That's why I really dislike him, he's Tully Banta-Cain 2.0 to me. "Plays just fine" and "make a few plays" and pads his stats against the Bills of the league but disappears against good teams.

I don't think they need an "allstar at every position" but I do think they need consistently effective players at every position.

 

[DaBruinz]

So what do you want to do, wait till the end of the year before you realize the pass defense is not that great. The rush defense is better, and they are on pace to match INT's and increase fumble recoveries. You can be all whiny and cover your eyes, but the fact is the pass defense is NO better so far this year than last year. Enjoy the sand.

First of all, please show where I said that the Pass defense was great. You can't because I didn't. Secondly, people who ONLY look at the stats, the way YOU are doing are missing most everything. Like the actual games themselves.

Next, here is some reality for you. After the first four games last season, here are the pertinent stats from the defense.

Passing Yards Allowed: 1507 (avg of 376.75)
Rushing Yards allowed: 431 (avg. of 107.75)
Sacks: 6
Interceptions: 7

Using your "ON PACE" method of judging things, this is how it would have been:

Passing Yards allowed: 6028
Rushing Yards allowed: 1724
Sacks: 24
Interceptions 28

Here is what REALITY was:
Passing Yards allowed: 4703 (293.5 avg)
Rushing Yards allowed: 1874 (117.125)
Sacks: 40
Interceptions: 23

Can you see the differences? The Pass defense improved significantly. The rush defense took a slight step backwards.

So, currently, the Pats are doing BETTER than last year's numbers allowing 281.5 passing yards per game and significantly better against the run.

The Pats have had a significant change over on their D-line with Carter and Anderson moving on and Jones and Ninkovich taking over. Not to mention the Pats moving to the 4-3 almost exclusively. They also have 3 new safeties in Wilson, Gregory and Ebner (two of whom are rookies). T

So, you'll forgive me if I'm not all doom and gloom like yourself and making claims that just aren't supported by reality. I can fully understand that this defense gets better as the season goes along. That the players GEL. That the rookies get better as they learn the system. That the veterans who are new to the system get better as they adjust to the system.

YOU, Bassman, are the one with your head in the sand, refusing to see reality. The NUMBERS clearly show that.

 

[DaBruinz]

He was solid against the Bills, but what about the other 3 games where he was invisible? That's why I really dislike him, he's Tully Banta-Cain 2.0 to me. "Plays just fine" and "make a few plays" and pads his stats against the Bills of the league but disappears against good teams.

I don't think they need an "allstar at every position" but I do think they need consistently effective players at every position.

That's just it. Ninkovich wasn't "invisible". People claiming otherwise just don't want to deal with reality. They need someone to complain about and they pick the guy that they clearly don't understand his job.

BTW, Ninkovich did more than just "pad his stats" against the Bills. Comments like that make detract from your credibility. Making TFLs that set up 3rd and longs is not padding his stats.

The other 3 games? Gee. Ninkovich was solid against Baltimore. He actually did his job against Kolb and Locker by making sure they stayed in the pocket and didn't run wide.

Basically, your problem is that he doesn't meet your irrational expectations and so it's his fault. NOT your expectations that are erroneous.

 

[RayClay]

That's just it. Ninkovich wasn't "invisible". People claiming otherwise just don't want to deal with reality. They need someone to complain about and they pick the guy that they clearly don't understand his job.

BTW, Ninkovich did more than just "pad his stats" against the Bills. Comments like that make detract from your credibility. Making TFLs that set up 3rd and longs is not padding his stats.

The other 3 games? Gee. Ninkovich was solid against Baltimore. He actually did his job against Kolb and Locker by making sure they stayed in the pocket and didn't run wide.

Basically, your problem is that he doesn't meet your irrational expectations and so it's his fault. NOT your expectations that are erroneous.

And he's pretty much the opposite of Banta Cain (your quotee). Yes, players do have different roles.

 

[Deus Irae]

He was solid against the Bills, but what about the other 3 games where he was invisible? That's why I really dislike him, he's Tully Banta-Cain 2.0 to me. "Plays just fine" and "make a few plays" and pads his stats against the Bills of the league but disappears against good teams.

I don't think they need an "allstar at every position" but I do think they need consistently effective players at every position.

Ninkovich is a weak link, but all teams have them. If you look at this defense right now, I think you'll find that LDE is not the biggest worry on the defense. As long as Jones is the real deal, I'd slot The LDE as issue #6 facing the defense, behind the 4 starting DBs and the nickel.

 

[Marqui]

That's just it. Ninkovich wasn't "invisible". People claiming otherwise just don't want to deal with reality. They need someone to complain about and they pick the guy that they clearly don't understand his job.

BTW, Ninkovich did more than just "pad his stats" against the Bills. Comments like that make detract from your credibility. Making TFLs that set up 3rd and longs is not padding his stats.

The other 3 games? Gee. Ninkovich was solid against Baltimore. He actually did his job against Kolb and Locker by making sure they stayed in the pocket and didn't run wide.

Basically, your problem is that he doesn't meet your irrational expectations and so it's his fault. NOT your expectations that are erroneous.

I know what his jobs are and yes he is good at 2-gapping/stopping the run/containing. But as a DE his job is also to put pressure on the passer during passing plays. And imo he fails miserably at that the majority of the time. And in today's league disrupting the pass is just as, if not more, important than containing the run.

I just don't feel Ninkovich is the answer for this defense. That's all.

 

[PlainOldEd]

I know what his jobs are and yes he is good at 2-gapping/stopping the run/containing. But as a DE his job is also to put pressure on the passer during passing plays. And imo he fails miserably at that the majority of the time. And in today's league disrupting the pass is just as, if not more, important than containing the run.

I just don't feel Ninkovich is the answer for this defense. That's all.

Are you on the coaching staff? How do you know what his job is on any given play?

 

[RayClay]

I know what his jobs are and yes he is good at 2-gapping/stopping the run/containing. But as a DE his job is also to put pressure on the passer during passing plays. And imo he fails miserably at that the majority of the time. And in today's league disrupting the pass is just as, if not more, important than containing the run.

I just don't feel Ninkovich is the answer for this defense. That's all.

Well that's fairer than the TBC comparison. With all the pass rushers they retained, I'm assuming they'll work guys in as the season progresses. stability is important too. Remember how Andre Carter was mocked for his "we're getting closer on the rush" remark?

Cunningham could expand his role and what about Scott? He's no rookie, so i assume he's on the roster for a reason. They aren't going to sell out for the rush at any expense to the cohesiveness of yet another new defensive look. Solid comes before flashy.

 

[jcdavey]

peyton's been mostly underneath stuff, i think your dline just needs to get their hands up alot on sunday

should cause some ints i'd wager

i think the game will come down to which oline allows more pressure

 

[Bill 4 Prez]

some of you guys get to worried about numbers, theyve had one bad game in the secondary this year, they made mistakes vs buffalo but they got the turnovers. this secondary can do just enough to win and really thats all that matters.