See You In a Week

[ralmat55]

You are talking about an one play, TEN YARD TD drive. It isn't like it was an one play 50 yard TD drive. Yes, the defense blew it on the play, but let's not make it sound like it was a total disaster on that drive. Plenty of great defenses have give up TDs on plays that were first and goal on the ten yard line. I still give 90% of the blame on that TD to the Pats' offense.

That one play sums up this Patriots defense. A GOOD defense makes a stand there and doesn't just fall down allowing an easy touchdown.

 

[AQPE]

Can't we all just get along?

I love this forum, I feel like I learn a few things about football and the team every time I "visit," but sometimes I really hate the way people dump on each other.

OK, I know it's inevitable on any message board dealing with any topic, discussions can sometimes get overheated. Occasionally folks will get a bit too personal in their comments back to others with whom they are having a discussion. It is clearly at that point right now for some of the people here.

Most of us visit here because we are huge fans of the Pats and want them to win every game every year. Sure, it's not the most grown up way to feel, but those of us who are into the Pats enough to spend time here and add our two cents to a discussion from time to time, a lot of us really get upset when they lose, and even more so when they see as many signs as I happen to think are there that the rest of the season is not looking too great (if feeling that way makes me one of the "entitled," then so be it).

So, I think we could all use some discretion in terms of the words we use towards each other. Saying people are "entitled," or "whining" about things they are upset about with the team's performance can feel insulting to those people on a personal level. It's like you are questioning their maturity level. I don't feel it's necessary to do that to advance your argument. This is equally true of those who call others "homers." For those of you that feel that way about Andy Johnson and others, I'd suggest that you consider the fact that calling them a homer is really no different from calling them a "fool" or an "idiot." It's like you are saying they have no ability to critically analyze the team because they will always conclude that what the Patriots do is correct. From what I've seen, that isn't correct about Andy Johnson and isn't about any of the other frequent posters here that tend to take the more optimistic view. I see critical analysis from them regularly, but it is always in a context of believing that the problems they see can be fixed. Calling out others in a way that they can take as a personal insult does nothing to make your own opinion more valid.

One other thing, in particular reference to Andy Johnson, but which is applicable as well to someone on the other side of the "half-full versus half-empty divide," someone such as Deus Irae for example. To me, the people who have been here for a very long time and have contributed literally thousands of posts are deserving of respect just for all the time and effort they've put in. Those of us who come here fairly often, rather than some other message board, we do so because I think this forum has established itself as one where you can read the opinions of some people with exceptional knowledge and abilities to communicate. That didn't happen because of the contributions of people like myself who haven't posted that many times overall and who post infreqently. It happened because there are enough people willing to put their ideas out there enough times to establish this forum as one where you are pretty certain of getting a nugget or two of great insight every time - even when that insight reflects an opinion that contrasts strongly to your own. Obviously Ian deserves the lion's share of the credit for this, but so too do the Andy's, Deus', Mo Lewis', etc. (I know I'm failing to mention a lot of amazing posters here). I'm not saying don't ever take them on in a debate, because this place would be very boring if noone ever got challenged here. I'm just saying that certain posters, including Andy, should be cut a bit more slack than the rest of us based on how much their posting over the years has contributed to making this forum as good as it is.

OK, sorry to sound like such a "parent," please carry on ...

:rocker:

 

[West Philly Patriot]

See this is what us "homers" can't stand. You act like Manning and the Giants' offense had their way with the Pats' defense all game. That clearly wasn't the case. The Pats defense played some of their best defense of the year for 50-55 minutes of the game. Yes, they fell apart in the end, but you doom and gloomers want to pretend that Eli lit up the Pats' defense all game.

I have no problem with constructive criticism, but just piling on the defense is not constructive. The defense haters don't acknowledge that the Giants' first TD was probably 90% the fault of the Pats' offense because you cannot expect even the best defense to stop the opposing offense to score points when they start the drive ten yards from the end zone. The defense haters don't acknowledge that Brady and offense didn't show up until late in the 3rd quarter and every time the defense made a great stop, the Pats' offense was punting away the ball after 3-5 plays. Defense haters don't want to acknowledge that the special teams were horrid yesterday.

I saw a lot of positives by the defense. Most of this game was reminiscent of 2003 where the Pats slugged it out on defense. Yes, the defense ultimate failed on the last two drives, but there was significant progress in this game. There is hope they can pull it together down the stretch when there was little hope last week.

The D is def not the blame for this loss. I'm proud of their performance. They played great for the majority of this game. We have a few too many ST'ers getting significant PT But I do agree with the overall premise of his post which is blind homerism is also not constructive. It doesn't bring anything to a debate about bettering the team when the homer's response is always "but BB is the winningest coach and we won 3 rings" So your not a fan if you dont repeat that ad nauseum? That has no bearing on analyzing what we are currently seeing from the team's performance.

Sometimes the middle course is best. We as fans should talk about what we see on the field and go from there. 2001, 2003 & 2004 have nothing to do with this current pats team. When someone bring up games from 7 years ago to defend current deficiencies they should lose credibility because they aren't debating, analyzing or discussing they're reminiscing.

GO PATS.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Gostkowski missed a FG from inside 30 yards...I do not give a crap who wants to make excuses....THOSE kicks have to be 100% on a team that considers itself a contender. I can see a miss from 45 yards out...but a near extra point??what the hell was HE focused on during that play?

Interesting factoid: Adam Vinatieri has missed EIGHT kicks of under 30 yards.

 

[TheSolderKing]

Top 10 memorable NFL coaching rants - YouTube



If only BB could give a post game interview like these Most Memorable NFL Coaching RANTS.


-'AJ was who we thought he was!!! That is why we comment on his posts!!! If you want to Crown him??? CROWN his ass!!!! AJ is who we thought he was and we let him OFF the HOOK!!!'-


thank you Dennis Green (2006)

 

[chris_in_sunnyvale]

Regards,
Chris

 

[The Brandon Five]

That one play sums up this Patriots defense. A GOOD defense makes a stand there and doesn't just fall down allowing an easy touchdown.

Is this the same defense that had three goal-line stands in the first two games? Whiskey-Tango-Foxtrot?

 

[Gunnails]

maybe more. I have absolutely no interest in watching The Entitled join up with the Jet fan **** roaches that will show up and discuss how they feel the Jets will beat us. I will watch the game with confidence that we are the better team. Have a nice week cozying up with the trolls.

============================================

Nothing wrong with a little football discussion is there?

I think there is a good point to be made that either team should win next Sunday.

Personally for me I love the discussion/hype preceding a prime time match up between 2 great rivals.

When does your week off begin?

 

[Joker]

Lo0ok!!! A Jet fan!!....lynch him!!...(anybody got any lynch?)..call out the attack kittens!!!

 

[Kontradiction]

Sorry that I root for the team. I guess I should root against them so I can complain like you.

I took you off of ignore momentarily just for this reason. We all root for the team. Some of us can see the flaws and some of us can see them but, for whatever reason, absolutely, positively, cannot admit to them. Now that we're two games over .500, and those (and I quote) "naysayers" are starting to be proven right, the homers are starting to scatter. If you had any balls whatsoever, you'd stay here throughout the week because, believe it or not, many of those "naysayers", myself included, WILL be battling with these Jets fans. After it's over, win or lose, we'll still be battling with them. The only difference is that we'll be getting it from both sides. From Jets fans and from the over-the-top homers that plague this place. So go on and run off with your tail between your legs. Us "untrue fans" that "don't root for the team" will still be here when you get back.

Jesus, what a terrible post. What a terrible thread...

 

[Kontradiction]

See this is what us "homers" can't stand. You act like Manning and the Giants' offense had their way with the Pats' defense all game. That clearly wasn't the case. The Pats defense played some of their best defense of the year for 50-55 minutes of the game. Yes, they fell apart in the end, but you doom and gloomers want to pretend that Eli lit up the Pats' defense all game.

I have no problem with constructive criticism, but just piling on the defense is not constructive. The defense haters don't acknowledge that the Giants' first TD was probably 90% the fault of the Pats' offense because you cannot expect even the best defense to stop the opposing offense to score points when they start the drive ten yards from the end zone. The defense haters don't acknowledge that Brady and offense didn't show up until late in the 3rd quarter and every time the defense made a great stop, the Pats' offense was punting away the ball after 3-5 plays. Defense haters don't want to acknowledge that the special teams were horrid yesterday. Defense haters fail to acknowledge that the Pats were down Spikes, Guyton, and Barrett for either both final drives or at least the last (none are world beaters, but certainly better than Sergio Brown and Tracy White).

I saw a lot of positives by the defense. Most of this game was reminiscent of 2003 where the Pats slugged it out on defense. Yes, the defense ultimate failed on the last two drives, but there was significant progress in this game. There is hope they can pull it together down the stretch when there was little hope last week.

I hated the way the defense fell apart in the end, but if the offense was just average for the first 40 minutes or so, the Pats would have won this game by at least a TD because the defense did everything to put this team in a position to win this game for most of this game and the offense couldn't get going. Yet, everyone wants to spin it as the offense was good enough to put the team in a position to win and the defense blew it. The only reason anyone can even make that spin is because the defense covered the offenses' arses while they failed to score even a field goal until about five minutes left in the 3rd quarter. That is on the offense.

See? This is a great post. I don't agree with all of it, especially the way you seem to put the loss on the offense at the end (I tend to blame both units), but I do agree that this was, by far and away, the defense's best game of the season. Those who are piling on the defense for this bad boy should step back and take a look at what Brady and the offense did yesterday. Then they should take a look at the personnel, what we have, and how we're being stopped. Did the defense fall apart at the end? Sure. They were handed a lead with 80 yards to paydirt to go and the Giants pulled it out. But it isn't as if the offense made it any easier on them...

 

[Dutchmaster617]

It's the Patriots fault. They have been winning for so long that some of the fans have become the most spoiled of almost any fan base. When things go bad they need to whine,cry, and throw temper tantums.

Is it their fault for winning in 2004 or is it there fault that after losing in 07 they refused to get better pass rushers and DBs? Maybe after 09 refusing to get a legit #1 to replace Moss?

Is that being spoiled that you expect a team to build off its weaknesses, despite the great run in 04? Does 3 titles in 4 years justify starting James Ihedigbo on defense? I don't understand how people are spoiled because they want to win again, its not like a team has never won 4 titles in 12 years and we expect the impossible, the Niners won 5 in 13 or so years.

 

[Kontradiction]

Is it their fault for winning in 2004 or is it there fault that after losing in 07 they refused to get better pass rushers and DBs? Maybe after 09 refusing to get a legit #1 to replace Moss?

Is that being spoiled that you expect a team to build off its weaknesses, despite the great run in 04? Does 3 titles in 4 years justify starting James Ihedigbo on defense? I don't understand how people are spoiled because they want to win again, its not like a team has never won 4 titles in 12 years and we expect the impossible, the Niners won 5 in 13 or so years.

Exactly. Last time I checked, the goal of every football team is to build the best, most competitive team possible. With this in mind, should fans be happy that we're looking at a trio of Ihedigbo, Brown, and Barrett at safety? Should the fans be happy that we screwed the pooch in getting a WR that can't understand the offense?

 

[Jangles]

I took you off of ignore momentarily just for this reason. We all root for the team. Some of us can see the flaws and some of us can see them but, for whatever reason, absolutely, positively, cannot admit to them. Now that we're two games over .500, and those (and I quote) "naysayers" are starting to be proven right, the homers are starting to scatter. If you had any balls whatsoever, you'd stay here throughout the week because, believe it or not, many of those "naysayers", myself included, WILL be battling with these Jets fans. After it's over, win or lose, we'll still be battling with them. The only difference is that we'll be getting it from both sides. From Jets fans and from the over-the-top homers that plague this place. So go on and run off with your tail between your legs. Us "untrue fans" that "don't root for the team" will still be here when you get back.

Jesus, what a terrible post. What a terrible thread...

I wish you could like posts more than once

 

[Kontradiction]

I wish you could like posts more than once

Andy and I got into it many times before to the point where it came down to heated PM's sent back and forth because they couldn't be posted on the board. But that doesn't mean I want him to tuck his tail between his legs and leave. I'd rather he'd just admit to the issues instead of driving himself crazy trying to pretend they're not there, then following that up by saying that those of us who DO see the issues aren't "true fans" and are equivalent to Jets fans.

 

[TheSolderKing]

Someone build me a ******* time machine!

A time machine??? Time Travel, what a quaint idea PJ

 

[BlueThunder]

Is this the same defense that had three goal-line stands in the first two games? Whiskey-Tango-Foxtrot?

It definately needs some Hotel Echo Lima Papa

 

[Palm Beach Pats Fan]

Lo0ok!!! A Jet fan!!....lynch him!!...(anybody got any lynch?)..call out the attack kittens!!!

skip the attack kittens and send out the killer rabbit!

Surely a low-life Jets fan would have no knowledge of how to use the Holy handgrenade of Antioch to combat the beast.

 

[PATSNUTme]

Is it their fault for winning in 2004 or is it there fault that after losing in 07 they refused to get better pass rushers and DBs? Maybe after 09 refusing to get a legit #1 to replace Moss?

Is that being spoiled that you expect a team to build off its weaknesses, despite the great run in 04? Does 3 titles in 4 years justify starting James Ihedigbo on defense? I don't understand how people are spoiled because they want to win again, its not like a team has never won 4 titles in 12 years and we expect the impossible, the Niners won 5 in 13 or so years.

Nice cherry pick of my post. If you are going to "quote" someone quote the entire posts for now on.

Do you think that as a 40 year Patriots fan who has been through the dark days, that I don't want them to win again? Seriously?

Fans are spoiled when the advocate getting rid of BB, when they make suggestions that the organization is "refusing' to get better. How in the hell can you or others say that they "refused" to get better? They tried but it didn't work so they will keep on trying.
I don't know how anyone who calls themselves a Patriots fan can even think that BB with TFB and RK, does not want put the best team they can out there.

14-2 last year and they lost a playoff game to the Jest and that hurt. But many Patriots fans got over the loss and have move on. Just some to continue to whine, cry, and stomp their feet about it.

I guess I must have struck a nerve with some.

 

[chris_in_sunnyvale]

skip the attack kittens and send out the killer rabbit! Surely a low-life Jets fan would have no knowledge of how to use the Holy handgrenade of Antioch to combat the beast.

Jets fan: Look at the bones!!!

Regards,
Chris