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Scientist find 'No Sun Link' to climate change

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by jack, Apr 3, 2008.

  1. jack

    jack 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

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    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/7327393.stm
    Scientists have produced further compelling evidence showing that modern-day climate change is not caused by changes in the Sun's activity.

    The research contradicts a favoured theory of climate "sceptics", that changes in cosmic rays coming to Earth determine cloudiness and temperature.

    The idea is that variations in solar activity affect cosmic ray intensity.

    But Lancaster University scientists found there has been no significant link between them in the last 20 years.

    Presenting their findings in the Institute of Physics journal, Environmental Research Letters, the UK team explain that they used three different ways to search for a correlation, and found virtually none.

    This is the latest piece of evidence which at the very least puts the cosmic ray theory, developed by Danish scientist Henrik Svensmark at the Danish National Space Center (DNSC), under very heavy pressure.

    Dr Svensmark's idea formed a centrepiece of the controversial documentary The Great Global Warming Swindle.

    We started on this game because of Svensmark's work," said Terry Sloan from Lancaster University.

    "If he is right, then we are going down the wrong path of taking all these expensive measures to cut carbon emissions; if he is right, we could carry on with carbon emissions as normal."

    Cosmic rays are deflected away from Earth by our planet's magnetic field, and by the solar wind - streams of electrically charged particles coming from the Sun.

    The Svensmark hypothesis is that when the solar wind is weak, more cosmic
     
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2008
  2. jack

    jack 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

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    :rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl
     
  3. Stokes

    Stokes In the Starting Line-Up

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    Not to say that I think the CO2-temperature link is bunk, but I have a couple issues here:

    First, they only looked over 20 years. When a skeptic publishes an article showing no link between CO2 and temperature for a 20 year period they are derided for choosing such a short timespan to investigate such a long process as climate change. Second, the work simply can't be that groundbreaking if they could only get it into the Institute of Physics Journal. If this really refuted the solar avtivity theory it would be worthy of publication in a high-level journal such as Science or Nature. Third, the proponent of the solar activity theory (a biased source obviously) thinks they have basically set up a straw man argument, making bogus claims on what the theory should predict for temp changes then showing those bogus claims not to be occuring (I would need to read the article and read this guy's research to come to any kind of conclusion as to whether that is right or not).

    My view is still that there is evidence for a CO2 temp link, but the story has not been conclusively proven. The thing about climate change though is that there are so many variables it may be impossible to prove anything. It is definitely in our interest to reduce CO2 emissions, but much of the dire forcasting that comes from some groups is overstated. We need to take a sensible approach, and stop listening to that idiot Al Gore. He is a propagandist for the movement, not a reliable source. Possibly the stupidest thing I've heard of is buying CO2 offsets, paying to be able to release CO2. If Al Gore really cared about the environment he would reduce his carbon footprint, not tell others to do it while he continues to pollute but makes himself feel better about it because he can afford to pay for someone to burn a bunch of trash and call that a CO2 savings.
     
  4. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Apparently you didn't read the whole article, OTOH have you ever taken a PDE class? or a stastics class? Just curious.



    BTW temps haven't increased since 1998 while CO2 levels have increased does this disprove the MMGW?
     
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2008
  5. jack

    jack 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

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    I watch you push every piece of junk science/propaganda that fits your political beliefs/faith..

    And when its proven propaganda or junk I post the link, it's like setting up rat traps.
     
  6. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

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    You didn't answer my question.


    BTW were you aware of the math proof that proved the equations used in the climate models were incorrect sue to incorrect boundary conditions?


    Again do you have any math education ?
     
  7. jack

    jack 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

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    http://www.mpg.de/english/illustrat...tion/pressReleases/2004/pressRelease20040802/
    Studies at the Max Planck Institute for Solar System Research reveal: solar activity affects the climate but plays only a minor role in the current global warming


    Since the middle of the last century, the Sun is in a phase of unusually high activity, as indicated by frequent occurrences of sunspots, gas eruptions, and radiation storms. Researchers at the Max Planck Institute for Solar System Research (MPS) in Katlenburg-Lindau (Germany) and at the University of Oulu (Finland) have come to this conclusion after they have succeeded in reconstructing the solar activity based on the sunspot frequency since 850 AD. To this end, they have combined historical sunspot records with measurements of the frequency of radioactive isotopes in ice cores from Greenland and the Antarctic. As the scientists have reported in the renowned scientific journal, Physical Review Letters, since 1940 the mean sunspot number is higher than it has ever been in the last thousand years and two and a half times higher than the long term average. The temporal variation in the solar activity displays a similarity to that of the mean temperature of the Earth. These scientific results therefore bring the influence of the Sun on the terrestrial climate, and in particular its contribution to the global warming of the 20th century, into the forefront of current interest. However, researchers at the MPS have shown that the Sun can be responsible for, at most, only a small part of the warming over the last 20-30 years. They took the measured and calculated variations in the solar brightness over the last 150 years and compared them to the temperature of the Earth. Although the changes in the two values tend to follow each other for roughly the first 120 years, the Earth’s temperature has risen dramatically
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/7327393.stm
    Scientists have produced further compelling evidence showing that modern-day climate change is not caused by changes in the Sun's activity.
    .

    The research contradicts a favoured theory of climate "sceptics", that changes in cosmic rays coming to Earth determine cloudiness and temperature.

    The idea is that variations in solar activity affect cosmic ray intensity.

    But Lancaster University scientists found there has been no significant link between them in the last 20 years.
     
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2008
  8. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    Are you laughing at yourself ? You go crazy over a study of 20 years when we have millions of years of climate change before cars, planes, heck before people.

    :rofl: Indeed. I'm on the floor now - laughing at you.
     
  9. jack

    jack 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

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    http://www.patsfans.com/new-england...owthread.php?t=77505&highlight=global warming
    :):):rofl:
    Belichickfans response to harry's propaganda link
     
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2008
  10. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Here are couple of the peer reviewed papers that are debunking the MMGW scam and power grab by the socialist.


    The equations used by the Global warming Climate modelers is all all wrong. IOW IPCC and Hansen (realclimate .org and NASA) are producing junk science.

    link to the paper:http://met.hu/idojaras/IDOJARAS_vol111_No1_01.pdf


    And the simple version for scientific illerates like you jack:http://www.dailytech.com/Researcher+Basic+Greenhouse+Equations+Totally+Wrong/article10973.htm



    And from Brookhaven a paper on how the carbon budgets and forcing assumed by the Gorbots is well exaggerated and wrong:http://www.ecd.bnl.gov/steve/pubs/HeatCapacity.pdf
     
  11. atomdomb

    atomdomb Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    please bring on global warming, it fcking snowing in new hampshire. fck!!
     
  12. wistahpatsfan

    wistahpatsfan Pro Bowl Player

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    #75 Jersey

    :rofl: Ha ha ha!
    Look at the sheep argue about whether global warming is man-made or not!
    Meanwhile, the corporate pigs continue to sh!t where our children play and get sicker and sicker every year. More plastic products, more VOCs in the carpeting....this would be fu(king hilarious if it wasn't so deadly.

    Keep up the arguing, suckahs! Put more toxins in the environment. Keep buying chinese and Indian crap while they demolish the planet's air and water.
    MORE STUFF!...WE NEED MORE STUFF! It's about FREEDOM!
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2008
  13. atomdomb

    atomdomb Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    uh oh! some of your heroes at the UN think they may have been wrong.

    U.N. Forecasters: Global Temperatures to Decrease
    Friday, April 04, 2008

    Average global temperatures in 2008 are forecast to be lower than in previous years, thanks to the cooling effect of the ocean current in the Pacific, U.N. meteorologists say.

    The World Meteorological Organisation's secretary-general, Michel Jarraud, said it was likely that La Nina, an abnormal cooling of sea surface temperatures in the Pacific Ocean, would continue into the summer.

    If the forecast holds true, global temperatures will not have risen since 1998, prompting some to question climate change theory.

    A small number of scientists doubt whether this means global warming has peaked and the Earth has proved more resilient to greenhouse gases than predicted, but Jarraud insists this is not the case and notes that 1998 temperatures would still be well above average for the century.

    "When you look at climate change you should not look at any particular year," he told the BBC. "You should look at trends over a pretty long period and the trend of temperature globally is still very much indicative of warming."

    "La Nina is part of what we call 'variability'. There has always been and there will always be cooler and warmer years, but what is important for climate change is that the trend is up."

    Experts at the U.K. Met Office's Hadley Centre for forecasting in Exeter said the world could expect another record temperature within five years or less, the BBC reports, probably associated with an episode of El Nino.
     
  14. wistahpatsfan

    wistahpatsfan Pro Bowl Player

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    #75 Jersey

    What do you mean by that?
    I think the UN should be disbanded! I hate the UN!
     
  15. atomdomb

    atomdomb Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    good for you. the scientists at the UN are one of the key driving forces behind the global warming scandal that is being forced on everyone.
     
  16. wistahpatsfan

    wistahpatsfan Pro Bowl Player

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    #75 Jersey

    There are many more researchers outside of the UN who think GW is man-made. The UN guys have PR power, but don't seem to be able to have any real effect on the real problem...reduction of toxins into the environment. China and India continue to trash the environment while the US supports them via trade.

    The UN does some good things, but it is mostly the US and Western Europe that pays for it and does the ground work. NATO could do what the UN does easily. The "UN" is actually North-western countries helping poor countries keep from starving. They do little else. Private orgs and individual governments could do just as well at what the UN does. UN mandates are only enforced if the US approves. It's a farce.
     
  17. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Hey whista, Algore and the MMGW nitwits are proposing the florscent lightbulbs containing mercury to replace the incandescent bulbs. the old broken lightbulb in the house becomes a whole new deal. Mercury in the house anyone? or the lcoal garbage dump, LIghtbulbs as a toxic waste management issue.
     
  18. otis p. driftwood

    otis p. driftwood Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    word to the power
     
  19. wistahpatsfan

    wistahpatsfan Pro Bowl Player

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    #75 Jersey

    I know...I read that somewhere. My wife brought some home thinking she was doing us a favor. Now those bulbs are in a box in the basement where they'll stay. She was shocked when I gave her the bad news. I don't know what to do with them.
     
  20. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    STFU you right wing neo-con! :p
     

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