Schefter: Predict's Cassel will be looking for a Aaron Rodgers type deal

[Wildo7]

Long term contract. Just like Samuel and Branch didn't want to be tagged. 6 years, $60M, with a $20M signing bonus or whatever. Less money per year, more guaranteed money. It happens ALL the time, that's why players hold out when they're tagged.

And that does nothing for the Pats, so again, there isn't a scenario in which the Pats could agree with another team on a trade before they've even tagged him. That is of course, if you're even allowed to do that.

 

[cmasspatsfan]

Long term contract. Just like Samuel and Branch didn't want to be tagged. 6 years, $60M, with a $20M signing bonus or whatever. Less money per year, more guaranteed money. It happens ALL the time, that's why players hold out when they're tagged.

Branch never got to that point, he had a year left on his contract for 1 mill I think and he wanted a raise and extension. His circumstances were different.

 

[BelichickFan]

You can't trade the player during the franchise tag period. Once he is tagged, other teams have the right to match or exceed the tag and compensate the Pats with two picks.

That's not true. The two first round picks are if a team makes an offer which the Patriots don't match. The Patriots CAN trade him while tagged if they agree with another team on the trade. Miguel verified this a long time ago.

 

[BelichickFan]

And that does nothing for the Pats, so again, there isn't a scenario in which the Pats could agree with another team on a trade before they've even tagged him.

The Patriots COULD agree to a trade before tagging him, they just couldn't actually make the trade until they tagged him.

 

[BelichickFan]

Branch never got to that point, he had a year left on his contract for 1 mill I think and he wanted a raise and extension. His circumstances were different.

Same concept of wanting a long term deal. Forget Branch, there are many examples, including Samuel, of players holding out to get a long term deal instead of the Franchise tag.

 

[Wildo7]

That's not true. The two first round picks are if a team makes an offer which the Patriots don't match. The Patriots CAN trade him while tagged if they agree with another team on the trade. Miguel verified this a long time ago.

But why would a team ever agree to that? There's no way they agree to pay him 11$ million when they can refuse and let him hit FA. The Pats don't have leverage to make such a trade since nobody would really believe they intended on keeping him. Cassel in FA is going to be cheaper for a team in FA than 11$ million for one year and draft picks or whatever. Since he has to be signed for $11 million for that year by whoever gets him anyway if he's tagged, what team would want to give up additional picks when they know the Pats can't really afford to keep him in 09 anyway? I maybe missing something here, but this really isn't making any sense to me whatsoever. And if it's the long term contract, why wouldn't Cassel just take the $11 million from whoever he gets traded to and wait until FA in 2010? Since there's no assurance that he signs a long term contract if traded, a team would essentially be trading for a one year player for $11 million dollars and some draft picks. I really doubt they would ever do that.

 

[sieglo]

But why would a team ever agree to that? There's no way they agree to pay him 11$ million when they can refuse and let him hit FA.

Because once he hits FA, some other team can pick him up.

Negotiating with the Pats enables a team to lock up rights in Cassel without having to compete on the open market.

And of course, teams will have incentive to move early to get Cassel into camp, learning their system, etc.

 

[BelichickFan]

But why would a team ever agree to that? There's no way they agree to pay him 11$ million when they can refuse and let him hit FA. The Pats don't have leverage to make such a trade since nobody would really believe they intended on keeping him.

I've already answered it, I'm not going to keep going round and round about this. It's not the leverage of the Patriots against, say, the Vikings if the Vikings were the team we were trading him to. It's the leverage of the Vikings against any other teams that might be interested. The Lions. The Rams. The 49ers, whoever. It can be a win, win, win. The Patriots get something. The player gets a contract he's happy with. The new team keeps Cassel off the open market.

 

[sg14]

If Cassel's looking for an Aaron Rogers type deal then I guess the Jets makes perfect sense. Brett Favre can announce he's retiring, then they can sign Cassel, and then Favre will change his mind and want to start again, and then the next season Favre will announce his retirement again and then change his mind and Cassel will again be relegated to the bench and then Favre will announce he's retiring, for real this time, and cry at the press conference and the Jets will announce its Cassel's team and then Favre will again change his mind and want to come back to start and this long drawn out soap opera will ensue and then finally Favre will demand a trade and get traded and Cassel will have a chance to start.

Hmmm - on second thought maybe Cassel might not want to say he wants an Aaron Rogers type deal.

That's funny,,,

 

[Wildo7]

Because once he hits FA, some other team can pick him up.

Negotiating with the Pats enables a team to lock up rights in Cassel without having to compete on the open market.

And of course, teams will have incentive to move early to get Cassel into camp, learning their system, etc.

Negotiating with the Pats does not ensure that Cassel will sign a long term deal with the team he is traded to. They would be essentially trading draft picks for a 1 year, $11 million dollar player. Cassel signing a long term deal with another team is not up to the Pats to decide and I guarantee that his agent would not agree to sign a long term deal with another team so that the Pats can trade him, knowing he's going to get that anyway, probably higher in FA.

 

[Wildo7]

I've already answered it, I'm not going to keep going round and round about this. It's not the leverage of the Patriots against, say, the Vikings if the Vikings were the team we were trading him to. It's the leverage of the Vikings against any other teams that might be interested. The Lions. The Rams. The 49ers, whoever. It can be a win, win, win. The Patriots get something. The player gets a contract he's happy with. The new team keeps Cassel off the open market.

If the long term deal is going to be better for the Vikings than what Cassel could get in FA, why would Cassel agree to that?

 

[BelichickFan]

If the long term deal is going to be better for the Vikings than what Cassel could get in FA, why would Cassel agree to that?

Why do players ever sign a new contract between ending the season and the start of FA ? They have a number that they want and if they can negotiate close enough to it and like everything else (the team, etc) they decide it's what they want to do. I guess you could make the argument they may cost themselves the last few dollars but 1) it happens a lot and 2) if they've been tagged they have no choice, it's the one year deal or the longer term deal.

Once we tag Cassel, he either gets to agree to a long term deal with someone else or be "stuck" with the $14M. I realize that's crazy money to be stuck with but if a team's offering a $20M signing bonus plus good salaries on a long term deal and you know you won't be cut for the first few years, you come out looking good. The $14M sounds great but one bad injury and you've hurt your long term money big time.

 

[Wildo7]

Why do players ever sign a new contract between ending the season and the start of FA ? They have a number that they want and if they can negotiate close enough to it and like everything else (the team, etc) they decide it's what they want to do. I guess you could make the argument they may cost themselves the last few dollars but 1) it happens a lot and 2) if they've been tagged they have no choice, it's the one year deal or the longer term deal.

Once we tag Cassel, he either gets to agree to a long term deal with someone else or be "stuck" with the $14M. I realize that's crazy money to be stuck with but if a team's offering a $20M signing bonus plus good salaries on a long term deal and you know you won't be cut for the first few years, you come out looking good. The $14M sounds great but one bad injury and you've hurt your long term money big time.

Yeah but "once we tag Cassel" are you sure he can sign with another team in a trade for a contract that includes less than $14 million in his first year? I would have thought that'd be against the CBA.

 

[spacecrime]

Re: Schefter: Cassel will be looking for a Aaron Rodgers type deal

To an NFC team and the Pats can get something. Work the trade out before for to a team that really wants him and then clear the cap space. Win win for all parties. Matt gets the $ and a starting gig, the Pats get something in return and some team gets starting QB...

How is it a win for Cassel when instead of being able to negotiate will all teams, he is restricted to the one the Patriots choose?

If I were Cassel I would not play that game. The Pats cannot do this unless Cassel agrees and he should not agree to a trade.

If the Pats franchise Cassel with the idea of trading, I hope Cassel refuses to negotiate with any team the Patriots select. Let the Pats pay him $15 mil to hold a clipboard, and then the next year Cassel will get to negotiate with any team he wants.

 

[spacecrime]

Same concept of wanting a long term deal. Forget Branch, there are many examples, including Samuel, of players holding out to get a long term deal instead of the Franchise tag.

No, totally different. Holdouts are under contract. Cassel would be a FA.

 

[Wildo7]

Re: Schefter: Cassel will be looking for a Aaron Rodgers type deal

How is it a win for Cassel when instead of being able to negotiate will all teams, he is restricted to the one the Patriots choose?

If I were Cassel I would not play that game. The Pats cannot do this unless Cassel agrees and he should not agree to a trade.

If the Pats franchise Cassel with the idea of trading, I hope Cassel refuses to negotiate with any team the Patriots select. Let the Pats pay him $15 mil to hold a clipboard, and then the next year Cassel will get to negotiate with any team he wants.

This is exactly what I'm thinking.

 

[spacecrime]

I've already answered it, I'm not going to keep going round and round about this. It's not the leverage of the Patriots against, say, the Vikings if the Vikings were the team we were trading him to. It's the leverage of the Vikings against any other teams that might be interested. The Lions. The Rams. The 49ers, whoever. It can be a win, win, win. The Patriots get something. The player gets a contract he's happy with. The new team keeps Cassel off the open market.

Only if Cassel agrees to be kept off the open market. He doesn't have to sign with another team, you know. No team will give up a first round pick for a guy who they will have the rights to for only one year.

 

[spacecrime]

Am I the only one who finds it funny that 80% of this board wanted us to cut Cassel this offseason/preseason and now he's about to seriously cash in? In BB we trust I guess...

What I find sick is that the ones who wanted to cut him, now want to prevent him from cashing in on free agency.

You guys didn't want him before. Let him go now.

 

[BelichickFan]

Re: Schefter: Cassel will be looking for a Aaron Rodgers type deal

How is it a win for Cassel when instead of being able to negotiate will all teams, he is restricted to the one the Patriots choose?

If I were Cassel I would not play that game. The Pats cannot do this unless Cassel agrees and he should not agree to a trade.

If the Pats franchise Cassel with the idea of trading, I hope Cassel refuses to negotiate with any team the Patriots select. Let the Pats pay him $15 mil to hold a clipboard, and then the next year Cassel will get to negotiate with any team he wants.

Cassel would have that right. But one injury on or off the field and the $14M is "all" he ever sees. He cut cut off his nose to spite his face if he likes but if a team offers him an appropriate deal it's in his best interest to get the good deal while it's sitting there.

 

[BelichickFan]

No, totally different. Holdouts are under contract. Cassel would be a FA.

He's a FA once he's tagged but in name only because if he signs with someone else they are obligated to pay us two #1 picks unless we match the offer. He wouldn't be a true FA.