Schefter: Cassel misunderstood what signing the tender meant

[Synovia]

Re: Adam Schefter Cassel misunderstood what signing the tender meant

Probably not. Cassel would probably get the same or more in real dollars if he got a new deal. He would probably get something like a $12-14 million bonus in a deal which is paid out immediately upon signing (it might be broken into two payments during the season) and a base salary of some sort. It would probably be low the first year, but Pioli tends to like making contracts that the money is spread out pretty evenly over the life of the contract (especially with the 30% rule in effect). So Cassel could get somewhere around 16-17 million in real dollars this year. Plus, the tender money is paid out over the season rather than one lump sum like a signing bonus is.

Cassel is already GUARANTEED 14.6M. In order to sign a long term deal, you're going to have to guarantee him atleast a significant amount more this year. He has no incentive to take a deal that gives him less than 14.6M right now.

 

[Rob0729]

Re: Adam Schefter Cassel misunderstood what signing the tender meant

Cassel is already GUARANTEED 14.6M. In order to sign a long term deal, you're going to have to guarantee him atleast a significant amount more this year. He has no incentive to take a deal that gives him less than 14.6M right now.

There is a difference between signing bonus and guaranteed money.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Re: Adam Schefter Cassel misunderstood what signing the tender meant

Cassel MIGHT take less year one if the overall guaranteed money was higher. Just because you guarantee a play X amount of dollars, they don't usually get it all in the first year. If Cassel got a contract with 30 million of guarantees that were paid out over the next 3 years, but the real money he got in 2009 was lower than $14 million I bet he would jump at it in a second. He would be stupid not to.

From a tax standpoint, it may be better for Cassel to get less each year of his contract even if the guaranteed money is the same.

So you are basically telling me that Cassel is going to turn down $30 million in guaranteed money (most people think it will be around $25 million if he gets a new deal, so $5 million in more guarantees than expected) if he doesn't get paid at least $14.6 million this year? That makes no sense.

Once you''ve blown thru the max tax rate it saves nothing of consequence to spread it out.

Were I advising someone in Cassel's situation financially I'd say take the money NOW before the threats to increase the top tax rates % get implemented.

 

[Rob0729]

Re: Adam Schefter Cassel misunderstood what signing the tender meant

Once you''ve blown thru the max tax rate it saves nothing of consequence to spread it out.

Were I advising someone in Cassel's situation financially I'd say take the money NOW before the threats to increase the top tax rates get implemented.

I am not a tax advisor. I answered the wrong question though.

 

[Synovia]

Re: Adam Schefter Cassel misunderstood what signing the tender meant

There is a difference between signing bonus and guaranteed money.

Not in the case of the Franchise Tag, theres not. As soon as he signed that tag, He gets 14M, whether he gets hurt, whatever,.

 

[Rob0729]

Re: Adam Schefter Cassel misunderstood what signing the tender meant

Not in the case of the Franchise Tag, theres not. As soon as he signed that tag, He gets 14M, whether he gets hurt, whatever,.

There is no signing bonus for the franchise tag. There is one for a new contract and that is significantly lower than the overall guaranteed money in a lot of cases. If Cassel gets offered the choice of a contract with $30 million guaranteed over 3 years and only gets a $12 million sign bonus or a contract with only $25 million in guarantees and a $17 million signing bonus, he isn't going to take the second deal because it has a bigger signing bonus. He would be stupid to take the franchise tag tender rather than the first deal. If he gets $30 million in guarantees, he is guaranteed the money as much as he would if he would with the franchise tender.

 

[Synovia]

Re: Adam Schefter Cassel misunderstood what signing the tender meant

There is no signing bonus for the franchise tag. There is one for a new contract and that is significantly lower than the overall guaranteed money in a lot of cases. If Cassel gets offered the choice of a contract with $30 million guaranteed over 3 years and only gets a $12 million sign bonus or a contract with only $25 million in guarantees and a $17 million signing bonus, he isn't going to take the second deal because it has a bigger signing bonus. He would be stupid to take the franchise tag tender rather than the first deal. If he gets $30 million in guarantees, he is guaranteed the money as much as he would if he would with the franchise tender.

I know theres no bonus on the tag, it is all guaranteed though. He gets paid whther he gets cut, sucks, hurt, whatever. THe only way he doesn't get paid that 14.6M is if he renegotiates. So, I'd guess 20M guaranteed would be the absolute lowest he would even think about.

It needs to be significantly more than 14M guaranteed, and actually guaranteed, not roster bonuses, for him to think about it.

 

[Rob0729]

Re: Adam Schefter Cassel misunderstood what signing the tender meant

I know theres no bonus on the tag, it is all guaranteed though. He gets paid whther he gets cut, sucks, hurt, whatever. THe only way he doesn't get paid that 14.6M is if he renegotiates. So, I'd guess 20M guaranteed would be the absolute lowest he would even think about.

It needs to be significantly more than 14M guaranteed, and actually guaranteed, not roster bonuses, for him to think about it.

Again, if you sign a long term deal with $30 million of guaranteed money, it is guaranteed too. Of course he would get more in guaranteed money if he signed a long term deal, but his signing bonus money may and may even most likely be less than $14.6 million.

 

[Synovia]

Re: Adam Schefter Cassel misunderstood what signing the tender meant

Again, if you sign a long term deal with $30 million of guaranteed money, it is guaranteed too. Of course he would get more in guaranteed money if he signed a long term deal, but his signing bonus money may and may even most likely be less than $14.6 million.

I agree. As long as its guaranteed money, and not "guaranteed money" like the press likes to report. At this point, if Cassel thinks hes good, it may be in his advantage to play through the tag, and cash in next year when either hes an FA, or they tag him again.


Its a question of whats more important to him, total earnings, or guaranteed earnings. There are players who go either way.

 

[eom]

Re: Adam Schefter Cassel misunderstood what signing the tender meant

Cassel is already GUARANTEED 14.6M. In order to sign a long term deal, you're going to have to guarantee him atleast a significant amount more this year. He has no incentive to take a deal that gives him less than 14.6M right now.

of course he does.

what if he gets hurt?
what if he sux this year?
what if the bottom falls out on the new cba?

 

[Rob0729]

Re: Adam Schefter Cassel misunderstood what signing the tender meant

I agree. As long as its guaranteed money, and not "guaranteed money" like the press likes to report. At this point, if Cassel thinks hes good, it may be in his advantage to play through the tag, and cash in next year when either hes an FA, or they tag him again.


Its a question of whats more important to him, total earnings, or guaranteed earnings. There are players who go either way.

The press likes to report non-guaranteed money that are in inflated years that there is little chance that the player will ever get. They don't report non-guaranteed money as guaranteed money.

Personally, I think it is more advantageous for the Chiefs not to do a deal at this point than Cassel. The Chiefs are rebuilding right now and Cassel doesn't have the weapons he had last year. Even if he is the real deal, he is bound to have a bit of a down year from last year. That can hurt his stock. His value is at the highest right now as it may be for a few years as Pioli builds a team around Cassel.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Re: Adam Schefter Cassel misunderstood what signing the tender meant

of course he does.

what if he gets hurt?
what if he sux this year?
what if the bottom falls out on the new cba?

Cassel can always buy insurance in case of injury if he wants.

If he signed a long-term deal that only gave him, say, $10M in payments in 2009, and he stinks up the joint, then how is he better off?

I'm not sure what you mean by the third one, though.

In any case, if the Chiefs were to fully guarantee him more than $14.6M over the life of his contract, that might be a different matter. But, I still don't see why he would take a contract that doesn't guarantee him $14.6M.

 

[Rob0729]

Re: Adam Schefter Cassel misunderstood what signing the tender meant

Cassel can always buy insurance in case of injury if he wants.

If he signed a long-term deal that only gave him, say, $10M in payments in 2009, and he stinks up the joint, then how is he better off?

I'm not sure what you mean by the third one, though.

In any case, if the Chiefs were to fully guarantee him more than $14.6M over the life of his contract, that might be a different matter. But, I still don't see why he would take a contract that doesn't guarantee him $14.6M.

Well, $14.6 million in guarantees would be well below market value whether Cassel had the franchise tender or not. So him getting anything less than $20-25 million in guarantees would be Cassel taking a huge discount. I would say based on the market, Cassel is looking about $25 million in guaranteed money. That might be too hard to give up considering his stock could drop this year without Moss and Welker, McDaniels calling the plays, and Belichick leading the team.

 

[eom]

Re: Adam Schefter Cassel misunderstood what signing the tender meant

In any case, if the Chiefs were to fully guarantee him more than $14.6M over the life of his contract, that might be a different matter. But, I still don't see why he would take a contract that doesn't guarantee him $14.6M.

yeah, that'd be all I'm talking about --- if he took less this year to sign a bigger long term deal.
if he waits a year to sign a long term deal, all those 3 things could work against him, and his new deal could be far less than what he could've gotten now.

 

[Synovia]

Re: Adam Schefter Cassel misunderstood what signing the tender meant

of course he does.

what if he gets hurt?
what if he sux this year?
what if the bottom falls out on the new cba?

How are these reasons he should take less guaranteed money? These are the reasons he should get as much guaranteed as he can.

 

[Synovia]

Re: Adam Schefter Cassel misunderstood what signing the tender meant

They don't report non-guaranteed money as guaranteed money.

Yes, they very often do.

It's official. The Oakland Raiders have reached agreement with cornerback DeAngelo Hall on a seven-year, $70 million contract that includes $24.5 million in guaranteed money, NFL Network's Adam Schefter is reporting.

Raiders, Hall agree on seven-year deal

Deangelo Hall got cut this year, and received a TOTAL of roughly $7M.