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Santonio Holmes


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Holmes got alot of the flashy catches, but Edwards was always there to move the ball.

Holmes dropped 2 simple touchdowns this year, and those 2 drops resulted in losses.

I used to think Edwards was overrated, but he is actually underrated. Guy is a monster at blocking too.

So what's your take on that situation? Sign Edwards let Holmes walk? Or get both? Or let them both go?
 
I think the Jets find a way to keep both,whether it's tinkering with other players contracts or something else
 
Welker got benched for making foot references. The second Holmes talked to the media he would walk straight into BB's doghouse and stay there.

The Pats are the type of team that usually goes with the aged players at WR

Derrick Mason is a possibility,I expect the Ravens to part ways with him.

Mason is a billion years old now and his wife hates New England. There's no chance he comes here.
 
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I dont like him but I cant deny his skill
 
So what do you guys think about trying to bring him in? I'm on the fence about it because of his attitude but the guy has talent and he's clutch. Let's look at the pros and cons.

Pros
  1. Great hands.
  2. Fast, can stretch the field for Welker.
  3. Clutch.
  4. Would keep him from the jets and the rest of the league.
  5. He's only 26.
Cons
  1. Expensive?
  2. He's kind of a d-bag.

I'm not so sure about clutch. Seemed to have a lot of drops lately.
 
Hindsight was 20/20, but I can't watch the Steelers without thinking that we took Brandon Tate the pick before they took Mike Wallace...

Holmes and Edwards both have talent, tons of it. So do Malcolm Floyd, Mike Sims-Walker, and James Jones - cheaper prospects who come without the attitude.

I like the possibility of getting Jones because the Packers have so much outside talent they just might let him go. He runs the tree, and he burned our rookie All-Pro cornerback so you know he can run with the best of him.
 
Mason had his chance three years ago. He spurned BB's overtures to stay with Ravens.

Holmes is the receiver the Steelers could afford to let go because they had Mike Wallace , another stretch the field receiver who is an emerging star. The Pats have to draft a similar receiver this year.
 
This is the guy who gets upset about the amount of throws he receives? No thanks. I've seen what that does to Brady.
 
Hindsight was 20/20, but I can't watch the Steelers without thinking that we took Brandon Tate the pick before they took Mike Wallace...

Holmes and Edwards both have talent, tons of it. So do Malcolm Floyd, Mike Sims-Walker, and James Jones - cheaper prospects who come without the attitude.

I like the possibility of getting Jones because the Packers have so much outside talent they just might let him go. He runs the tree, and he burned our rookie All-Pro cornerback so you know he can run with the best of him.

Holmes is wayyyy more talented than the other guys you mentioned, all James Jones does is drop passes. He's talented but can't catch the ball. Hell, even Edwards has better hands than him.
 
So what's your take on that situation? Sign Edwards let Holmes walk? Or get both? Or let them both go?

i dont think its as hard as everybody thinks. the jets have alot of players they will most likely cut, or demand they take a pay cut(or be cut)

if cut $ saved
Bryan Thomas-3.7mil
Kris Jenkins- 4.6mil
Damien Woody- 3.2mil
Jason Taylor- 2.2mil
LdT- 2.4mil
and a few more
^ I see all of those players being cut.
also Tony Richardson is gone, and being replaced by a 400k a year player.

Brad Smith will most likely be gone. Why pay a guy alot of $ to run the wildcat, 4th string wr, kick returner, and special team gunner? I would rather pay him what he wants to be the 2nd string QB, and have him do all the other crap he does(besides the WildCat. Dont need any more WC)
Also lets be honest most kick returners success is due to great blocking...unless you are Devin Hester. But yes Brad Smith is a very good kick return man.

I can see Holmes, Edwards, and Harris being resigned. Cromartie will probably be the odd man out.

edit: Also Holmes is ONE **** up away from being suspended an entire year. I'm sure that will hurt his $, and Edwards isnt exactly a 'great guy' off the field either. The off field **** may, or may not come into discussions though with the total $ they can demand.

edit2: i got the $ info from http://www.nyjetscap.com/salary11.html btw if any Pats fan wants to take a look at the Jets cap/contracts/etc.
 
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i dont think its as hard as everybody thinks. the jets have alot of players they will most likely cut, or demand they take a pay cut(or be cut)

if cut $ saved
Bryan Thomas-3.7mil
Kris Jenkins- 4.6mil
Damien Woody- 3.2mil
Jason Taylor- 2.2mil
LdT- 2.4mil
and a few more
^ I see all of those players being cut.
also Tony Richardson is gone, and being replaced by a 400k a year player.

Brad Smith will most likely be gone. Why pay a guy alot of $ to run the wildcat, 4th string wr, kick returner, and special team gunner? I would rather pay him what he wants to be the 2nd string QB, and have him do all the other crap he does(besides the WildCat. Dont need any more WC)
Also lets be honest most kick returners success is due to great blocking...unless you are Devin Hester. But yes Brad Smith is a very good kick return man.

I can see Holmes, Edwards, and Harris being resigned. Cromartie will probably be the odd man out.

edit: Also Holmes is ONE **** up away from being suspended an entire year. I'm sure that will hurt his $, and Edwards isnt exactly a 'great guy' off the field either. The off field **** may, or may not come into discussions though with the total $ they can demand.

edit2: i got the $ info from New York Jets Salary Cap btw if any Pats fan wants to take a look at the Jets cap/contracts/etc.

Great source, thanks for the link. I pretty much agree with your list of cuts. Jenkins is definitely a goner, Taylor and LT too probably since they're both done, and Woody and Thomas have to be in danger with those cap figures, if there's any kind of a squeeze. Even if all those guys get cut, though, how much money can the Jets realistically lock in at WR with all of the guys that they still need to sign to get back to a full roster? Even if they go with the Colts model and fill out the entire bottom of the roster with minimum salary guys, you're still looking at $101M committed with fairly pressing needs at LG, RT, OLB, ILB (gotta re-sign Harris), WR1, WR2, RB2, CB2, DE... (if you assume that Wilson's the slot guy, and even if you don't, it's a gamble to assume that he can move outside when he hasn't shown much of anything anywhere on the field yet).

Are you assuming that Pitoitua can replace Ellis, McKnight can jump into the RB rotation, and Ducasse can slide in to RT? Even if all of that works, you still have to sign Harris to a pretty big contract,and it seems sensible that Edwards/Holmes and Cotchery is a solid 1/2 at WR, and it's easier to find a WR3 than, say, a CB2 or a starter-caliber OLB. If you figure that combined Holmes/Edwards would carry a cap hit of around $15M (that's around where I'd ballpark it, but you might disagree), then I'm not sure how they can swing that while maintaining the defensive talent to execute the gameplan that they did on the Pats last week.

I dunno, you obviously know your team a lot better than I do, but it seems to me that whether or not they can sign both Holmes and Edwards, it probably wouldn't be the wisest use of what's likely to be very limited cap space. But I do know that folks around here have been predicting the Jets' descent into cap hell for 3-4 years and running, never seeming to account for the fact that the Jets can/will cut some overpaid veterans to free up room. They're certainly not in good cap shape, but I'd agree with you that it's not nearly as bad as a lot of people here are making it out to be.
 
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i dont think its as hard as everybody thinks. the jets have alot of players they will most likely cut, or demand they take a pay cut(or be cut)

if cut $ saved
Bryan Thomas-3.7mil
Kris Jenkins- 4.6mil
Damien Woody- 3.2mil
Jason Taylor- 2.2mil
LdT- 2.4mil
and a few more
^ I see all of those players being cut.
also Tony Richardson is gone, and being replaced by a 400k a year player.

Brad Smith will most likely be gone. Why pay a guy alot of $ to run the wildcat, 4th string wr, kick returner, and special team gunner? I would rather pay him what he wants to be the 2nd string QB, and have him do all the other crap he does(besides the WildCat. Dont need any more WC)
Also lets be honest most kick returners success is due to great blocking...unless you are Devin Hester. But yes Brad Smith is a very good kick return man.

I can see Holmes, Edwards, and Harris being resigned. Cromartie will probably be the odd man out.

edit: Also Holmes is ONE **** up away from being suspended an entire year. I'm sure that will hurt his $, and Edwards isnt exactly a 'great guy' off the field either. The off field **** may, or may not come into discussions though with the total $ they can demand.

edit2: i got the $ info from New York Jets Salary Cap btw if any Pats fan wants to take a look at the Jets cap/contracts/etc.
Those are 4 players who contributed an awful lot to your team this year, plus Jenkins, that you are cutting and seemingly thinking wont matter. Plus Smith plus Cromartie, and you are still over 100mill of cap cost with something like 25 legitimate players signed.
 
Great source, thanks for the link. I pretty much agree with your list of cuts. Jenkins is definitely a goner, Taylor and LT too probably since they're both done, and Woody and Thomas have to be in danger with those cap figures, if there's any kind of a squeeze. Even if all those guys get cut, though, how much money can the Jets realistically lock in at WR with all of the guys that they still need to sign to get back to a full roster? Even if they go with the Colts model and fill out the entire bottom of the roster with minimum salary guys, you're still looking at $101M committed with fairly pressing needs at LG, RT, OLB, ILB (gotta re-sign Harris), WR1, WR2, RB2, CB2, DE... (if you assume that Wilson's the slot guy, and even if you don't, it's a gamble to assume that he can move outside when he hasn't shown much of anything anywhere on the field yet).

Are you assuming that Pitoitua can replace Ellis, McKnight can jump into the RB rotation, and Ducasse can slide in to RT? Even if all of that works, you still have to sign Harris to a pretty big contract,and it seems sensible that Edwards/Holmes and Cotchery is a solid 1/2 at WR, and it's easier to find a WR3 than, say, a CB2 or a starter-caliber OLB. If you figure that combined Holmes/Edwards would carry a cap hit of around $15M (that's around where I'd ballpark it, but you might disagree), then I'm not sure how they can swing that while maintaining the defensive talent to execute the gameplan that they did on the Pats last week.

I dunno, you obviously know your team a lot better than I do, but it seems to me that whether or not they can sign both Holmes and Edwards, it probably wouldn't be the wisest use of what's likely to be very limited cap space. But I do know that folks around here have been predicting the Jets' descent into cap hell for 3-4 years and running, never seeming to account for the fact that the Jets can/will cut some overpaid veterans to free up room. They're certainly not in good cap shape, but I'd agree with you that it's not nearly as bad as a lot of people here are making it out to be.

The only needs at LG, and RT are depth. Wayne Hunter RT(D. Woody's back up) has proven to the NFL he can start. He destroyed Peppers(not 1 on 1 everytime of course) and did very well against the Steelers twice.

LG Matt Slauson after week 1 (when Ngata blew him up on 2 plays) has been very consistent. He is also a solid starter.

Ducasse was Slauson in 2009. He wont have to start next year since it seems obvious by Jets beat reporters(and Wayne Hunter on Twitter himself @uso099) that Wayne Hunter will start at Right Tackle.

Ducasse will get another year of learning/training to be an offensive linemen(unless injury of course) Just like Slauson did.

Harris is an issue, but I'm not sure how much $$ he will require. He cannot cover, but is excellent at run stopping, and is a hard hitter. (didn't do well against Mendenhall though..sunday..) I don't think the Jets will let Harris go.

We have some guys on the Practice squad who were high draft picks let go at DE/OLB that all I heard of them was good. Now obviously I cant take that so seriously...since you rarely hear bad things about PSquad players from a team.

OLB is a MAJOR issue. We have nobody whom can beat their man 1 on 1 at a consistent basis, and that's embarrassing. Calvin Pace week 3 preseason broke his foot, and that screwed us. Pace isnt really that good anyway though.

Jamaal Westerman, and Josh Mauga are pretty okay guys that the jets have been developing as OLB/ILB.

Pitoitua may be able to replace Ellis, but I think Ellis will give it one more go on the cheap. Also Jarron Gilbert(dude who is famous for jumping out of a pool on youtube lol), and Marcus Dixon have gotten some playing time this year, and done well in a MINOR rotation role on the DLINE.

Bottom line is Holmes/Edwards most likely will be difficult, but it seems doable.

Those are 4 players who contributed an awful lot to your team this year, plus Jenkins, that you are cutting and seemingly thinking wont matter. Plus Smith plus Cromartie, and you are still over 100mill of cap cost with something like 25 legitimate players signed.

Smith only got on the field, because Jim Leonhard went down. Well actually he started once opposite Leonhard, because Pool didn't fully know the system.

Jenkins hasnt contributed **** the past 2 years. Damien Woody is done, and we have a backup check. Bryan Thomas is one of the slowest OLB in the league. Jason Taylor sucks.

Cromartie indeed is another issue. The thing with him though is he loves upfront guaranteed $$. If the Jets can get him for another year, or two and front load the deal.. I think he will stay. He needs the $ ASAP to feed those kids.
 
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So what do you guys think about trying to bring him in? I'm on the fence about it because of his attitude but the guy has talent and he's clutch. Let's look at the pros and cons.


Pros
  1. Great hands.
  2. Fast, can stretch the field for Welker.
  3. Clutch.
  4. Would keep him from the jets and the rest of the league.
  5. He's only 26.
Cons
  1. Expensive?
  2. He's kind of a d-bag.
1 not realy
2 sure
3 not so much (the one clutch play he is known for was after a drop by him on the play before)
4 pointless, we cant sign guys so other teams dont have them
5 ok

1 yup
2 big time


So in the end you have
Fast and 26, and an expensive dbag

Why would we want him again?
 
The only needs at LG, and RT are depth. Wayne Hunter RT(D. Woody's back up) has proven to the NFL he can start. He destroyed Peppers(not 1 on 1 everytime of course) and did very well against the Steelers twice.

LG Matt Slauson after week 1 (when Ngata blew him up on 2 plays) has been very consistent. He is also a solid starter.

Ducasse was Slauson in 2009. He wont have to start next year since it seems obvious by Jets beat reporters(and Wayne Hunter on Twitter himself @uso099) that Wayne Hunter will start at Right Tackle.

Ducasse will get another year of learning/training to be an offensive linemen(unless injury of course) Just like Slauson did.

Harris is an issue, but I'm not sure how much $$ he will require. He cannot cover, but is excellent at run stopping, and is a hard hitter. (didn't do well against Mendenhall though..sunday..) I don't think the Jets will let Harris go.

We have some guys on the Practice squad who were high draft picks let go at DE/OLB that all I heard of them was good. Now obviously I cant take that so seriously...since you rarely hear bad things about PSquad players from a team.

OLB is a MAJOR issue. We have nobody whom can beat their man 1 on 1 at a consistent basis, and that's embarrassing. Calvin Pace week 3 preseason broke his foot, and that screwed us. Pace isnt really that good anyway though.

Jamaal Westerman, and Josh Mauga are pretty okay guys that the jets have been developing as OLB/ILB.

Pitoitua may be able to replace Ellis, but I think Ellis will give it one more go on the cheap. Also Jarron Gilbert(dude who is famous for jumping out of a pool on youtube lol), and Marcus Dixon have gotten some playing time this year, and done well in a MINOR rotation role on the DLINE.

Bottom line is Holmes/Edwards most likely will be difficult, but it seems doable.



Smith only got on the field, because Jim Leonhard went down. Well actually he started once opposite Leonhard, because Pool didn't fully know the system.

Jenkins hasnt contributed **** the past 2 years. Damien Woody is done, and we have a backup check. Bryan Thomas is one of the slowest OLB in the league. Jason Taylor sucks.

Cromartie indeed is another issue. The thing with him though is he loves upfront guaranteed $$. If the Jets can get him for another year, or two and front load the deal.. I think he will stay. He needs the $ ASAP to feed those kids.

Wow, after 2 days we are already into the Jet fans mantra, if they were gone they sucked, and if they are new they are great.

BTW, every other teams money can pay Cromarties massive child support bills too. But, I really, really hope you pay huge money to keep the slug.
 
Wow, after 2 days we are already into the Jet fans mantra, if they were gone they sucked, and if they are new they are great.

BTW, every other teams money can pay Cromarties massive child support bills too. But, I really, really hope you pay huge money to keep the slug.

where do i say this? whats the problem?
 
The suspension hanging over his head would be enough in his case to keep me from paying him what he's going to want. He's a dangerous player but he's a big risk imo.
 
where do i say this? whats the problem?
Read your post. You trashed all of the guys you think are leaving.
Woddy is better than Hunter because he started ahead of him, even while injured. Hunter has never been able to win a starting job in the NFL.
Thomas has been your starting OLB for years and Taylor played a lot for you. To you they are too slow, and suck.
 
Read your post. You trashed all of the guys you think are leaving.
Woddy is better than Hunter because he started ahead of him, even while injured. Hunter has never been able to win a starting job in the NFL.
Thomas has been your starting OLB for years and Taylor played a lot for you. To you they are too slow, and suck.

:rolleyes:

I dont know if you've noticed, but the Jets have ZERO pass rush. I have no emotional stock into these players. All I can say is "hey thanks for what you did in the past"

Tom Brady might suck one day, but because he was a elite quarterback for so many years he cant suck when hes 40? Sometimes players get older in the NFL, and arent good anymore...lol

Woody was the weakest link of the Jets offensive line the entire season. Nice guy, but I'am a Jets fan..Not a Damien Woody fan.

Woddy is better than Hunter because he started ahead of him, even while injured
How is Woody better than Wayne Hunter when Woody is injured?


Jason Taylor..I hated this guy forever, and thought of him as a tool to use this season, and then actually started to like the guy. Hey Jason you are going to be a 36 year old Outside Linebacker next year...Thanks alot for what you did for ONE YEAR...Bye.
 
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:rolleyes:

I dont know if you've noticed, but the Jets have ZERO pass rush. I have no emotional stock into these players. All I can say is "hey thanks for what you did in the past"

Tom Brady might suck one day, but because he was a elite quarterback for so many years he cant suck when hes 40? Sometimes players get older in the NFL, and arent good anymore...lol

Woody was the weakest link of the Jets offensive line the entire season. Nice guy, but I'am a Jets fan..Not a Damien Woody fan.


How is Woody better than Wayne Hunter when Woody is injured?


Jason Taylor..I hated this guy forever, and thought of him as a tool to use this season, and then actually started to like the guy. Hey Jason you are going to be a 36 year old Outside Linebacker next year...Thanks alot for what you did for ONE YEAR...Bye.
As I said, when the Jets lose players, all of a sudden they sucked.
ITs been going on for many many years. Its what defines a true Jet fan.
 
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