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Roster questions: ST guys

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by ctpatsfan77, May 12, 2008.

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  1. ctpatsfan77

    ctpatsfan77 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    By my count, at the end of last season, the Pats had seven players (Gostkowski, Hanson, Paxton, Washington, Izzo, Andrews, Ventrone) who were used almost exclusively on STs, and one more (Eckel) who was primarily on STs, but saw spot duty on offense.

    My questions:
    (1) Am I forgetting anyone?
    (2) Does that seem like one or two too many?
    (3) Why so many ST-only guys, anyways?
  2. signbabybrady

    signbabybrady On the Roster

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    1. Alexander and woods (while they may have had a bigger role as reserves their primary roles were STs.
    2. no
    3. becuase it is 1/3 of the game
  3. ctpatsfan77

    ctpatsfan77 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    The reason I asked (2) is because you only have 46 game-day roster spots, so using ~8 on STs leaves you with ~38 players for O and D (or ~19 each).

    As for (3), it's obviously one phase, but is it really "1/3"? If I had to guess, I'd say ST accounts for ~20% of plays, but I could be wrong (in either direction).
  4. signbabybrady

    signbabybrady On the Roster

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    I don't think all 8 or 9 guys we mentioned as primarily STs were all active for the same game so that is a few roster spots back.

    whether it is actually the 20% you say or the 33.33% (1/3) I said it is a large portion of the game and its importance should not be diminished.
  5. JoePats

    JoePats Rookie

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    I took the Jets game from December of last season at random.

    http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/boxscore?gid=20071216017

    There were 125 offensive plays between the two teams.

    There were 10 punts.

    Gost made 2 FGs and 2 PATs (4) and Nugent had a PAT, FG, and missed FG (3).

    Since there were 6 scoring plays, that's 6 kickoffs, plus the 2 to begin each half. So that's 8 kickoffs.

    10+8+7 is 25 out of 150 plays of that game were special teams by my count. That would be 16.7%.
  6. Pats726

    Pats726 Rookie

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    I think while everyone says a third..it's MORE LIKE...20%..nonetheless...if you do NOT have Good STers...it will really have a LARGE effect on your game...
  7. JoePats

    JoePats Rookie

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    I agree completely. I just wanted to put a number on it because I'd never seen a specific breakdown.

    Games can be won or lost on special teams. Look at the 01 AFC Championship game. Momentum plays on special teams can be huge too. We almost lost the Giants game in the regular season, and that game really turned on the Hixson kick return.
  8. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    First, why are you asking ? What does this have to do with Matt Walsh and the camera ? :D

    3 are a given with the kickers and Paxton - not that I like having a long snapper exclusively but Belichick seems to like having him around.

    Washington I don't think was intended to be ST exclusive but we had no WR injuries for the first time in forever.

    Izzo is unique as he's the ST captain. I expect we'll see him again in that role.

    The others are just roster fillers who will likely be gone and replaced by some of the rookies/low level FA signings on defense.
  9. WhiZa

    WhiZa Rookie

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    With our depth, while other teams are drafting starters we have the luxury of drafting player to fit ST. Next year we should have one of the best STs in the league.
  10. DocE

    DocE Rookie

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    1.I don't think you are forgetting anyone, unless you count Troy Brown who only returned a few punts this year.

    2. Yes I think it seems like one or two too many. For example, in the Super Bowl, the Patriots kept only 7 offensive lineman active, and de-activated their 3rd TE as well. I feel like this was a huge mistake and probably cost us the game. How nice would it have been to counter the undersized Tuck playing DT by putting in the 3 TE package that was so effective against the Chargers? Weslely Britt (one of the inactive lineman) also played some TE for the team during the season and could have been used in a power formation instead of Spach, if they preferred an extra lineman.

    3. I think age on defense was part of the equation. I also think that you need all of the game day active players to help, in some way, on the field. It's more important for the 4th safety to be a good special teamer than it is for him to be a good base defense player. That 4th safety is going to play special teams, but it's unlikely he'll get in on the base defense. Ray Ventrone made a huge play to stop the Giants return at the 17 yard line at the end of the Super Bowl..that was the one point that I thought we had that game won.

    I think it's possible you will see fewer spots go to guys who are exclusively special teams players this year. Sammy Morris will be back and he's played a lot on special teams throughout his career. Wheatley and Wilhite(if he makes the team) will likely play on the coverage teams. I think Crable will play special teams as well, it might even be his main role as a rookie. On the flipside, Sam Aiken and Matt Slater were both brought in and they are both considered special teams only type guys. If Slater can return kicks and cover them, than I would consider him to be adding quite a bit of value to the roster.
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