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Romney to lay it on the line

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by Fogbuster, Dec 3, 2007.

  1. Fogbuster

    Fogbuster Pro Bowl Player

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    I have to admire the man for taking it to the table rather than just letting it fester in the background. He is as wise as John Kennedy was 47 years ago, when JFK took his Catholicism to the debate, rather than letting the debate come to him. This should put Romney back on track, and he needs it. At this point it is Romney, Giuliani, Huckabee, and Fred Thompson. This could push Romney up, and although some say it is risky, I believe it is the only way to go. Get it out in the open.


    [size=+3] Romney speech is a huge gamble[/size]

    By: Mike Allen and Jonathan Martin
    Dec 3, 2007 06:29 AM EST

    Mitt Romney decided to deliver a major speech about his religious faith after concluding attention to his Mormonism would only intensify in potentially unflattering ways in the crucial weeks ahead. But even some of his top aides see the speech as a wildly unpredictable gamble.

    Aides were split over the wisdom of elevating the Mormon issue even more, and the campaign goes into the speech with barely disguised trepidation.

    Romney, however, is excited to finally be fighting back, advisers said.

    The speech, titled “Faith in America,” is potentially at war with the campaign’s longtime precept that it is not a winning strategy for Romney to be identified primarily as the Mormon candidate in a Republican race dominated by Christian voters.

    http://www.politico.com/news/stories/1207/7143.html


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  2. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I agree with you Fog, but let's hope Romney uses this opportunity wisely.

    What I find unfortunate about Romney is that when he was a young man, in the enlightened 60s and 70s, and many Mormons were pressing their church to end its anti-black beliefs, Romney did nothing. More recently he has been weak in terms of gay rights and supposedly said he would not appoint Muslims to his Cabinet.

    Like many conservatives, I'm afraid Romney only understands prejudice that affects him personally. JFK was far braver and applied the lessons of prejudice to help change the course of the nation in terms of equal rights for black Americans. Romney has a great opportunity in his speech if he speaks to prejudice and intolerance in general, not just to Mormonism. One can only hope.
     
  3. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I'm glad he's doing it though I don't know why he has to, in this day and age of Liberal Tolerance where the Left Wing Liberals are telling us we should LOVE every degenerate murdering savage on the planet why should Romney have to explain his religion, what bad things have the Mormons done, if Mohammad Garuba Daruba were running for president would he have to explain his religion.

    Where are all the crys of discrimination and bigitory from the double standard Lefty Loons, in this day and age of 2007 why should this man have to explain his religious beliefs, are we going back in time.

    This Man Is A Mormon-------SO WHAT

    We had a President that used to masturbate under the Oval Office Desk and the Loons all loved him.
    :bricks:
     
  4. Fogbuster

    Fogbuster Pro Bowl Player

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    Well, I think you have selectively cherry-picked issues in Romney's life, and you've made certain judgments of the man, while missing the larger picture: that he stands for an America that is religiously diverse and tolerant, that believes in giving every religious point of view a chance to have their say in front of an impartial public.

    And while you reference Romney's youth in the 60s and 70s, what he should and should not have done, I find it glaring that Hillary Clinton was so lenient and looked the other way during Bill Clinton's extra-marital sexual dalliances during the 70s, 80s, and 90s. (We don't know what he may have done in the 00s, yet.) Her obvious betrayal of the sanctity of marriage fidelity can only be interpreted as her own desire to use her husband to further her own private agenda: her personal quest for political power.


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  5. Fogbuster

    Fogbuster Pro Bowl Player

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    Well, he's not doing for the Liberal Left; he's doing it for the Great Undecided and for the more open-minded of the Christian Right.

    I think it's a good idea. Will clear the air of a lot of pettiness. I hope.

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  6. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    Romney has no chance, and this is a gamble he has to take. Personally, I don't this matters much, since he never really had a chance to begin with. The GOP nomination is now down to 3 people. Huckabee, Giuliani, and believe it or not Thompson. Thompson still polls well in SC, and that gives him a chance. MCCain would really need a miracle to have a shot.

    The Dems are down to Obama & Clinton, which to be honest, is actually a surprise since it wasn't all that long ago that they had already kinda picked their horse. What a strange election.
     
  7. Fogbuster

    Fogbuster Pro Bowl Player

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    Romney may or may not make it, but I'd be comfortable with any of the any other three you listed. We will see.


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  8. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Well, as a young man he didn't stand for that in terms of black people (nor did he did not object when his church gave them equal rights). And again, the lessons of prejudice should be applied more broadly, and I hope he does so.

    Not sure what Hillary's past has to do with Romney's failings.
     
  9. wistahpatsfan

    wistahpatsfan Pro Bowl Player

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    #75 Jersey

    Romney's a wooden doll. He has no chance because he's not real to most Americans. He's right out of Stepford.
     
  10. IcyPatriot

    IcyPatriot ------------- PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

  11. Fogbuster

    Fogbuster Pro Bowl Player

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    How did you feel about black people when you were a young man?



    I'm sorry, I thought Hillary was running for president, too. :rolleyes:


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  12. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I went from the Bronx, NY where all my friends were black when I was 7-9 years old to a very conservative all-white suburb of NYC where my neighbor wouldn't be my friend because my older sister had a black friend and the mayor for whom I did lawn work referred to blacks as pickaninnies. I became sensitized to prejudice at a very young age.

    That said, Romney was an adult and should have known better. There were Mormons who fought (successfully) for the church to end its prejudice. It was a real failure of his in my opinion. He also ducked out of the war, thus avoiding the two major social movements (war and race) of his time. Hillary, who served as President of the Young Republicans at her college, stepped down because of her involvement in anti-war protests and civil rights.
     
  13. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

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    What Is Wrong With Being A Mormon
     
  14. Fogbuster

    Fogbuster Pro Bowl Player

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    Somehow, for some reason -- can't quite put my finger on it -- it seems you would find something wrong with Romney, and any other Repub candidate who does not support or acquiesce to the homosex lobby, no matter what else he or they ever did in their lives.


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  15. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Well yes I would find fault in any candidate who opposes gay rights, just as I would find fault in any candidate who did not stand up against sexism, racism, and religious intolerance. By the way, to my knowledge, there is no homosex lobby, since sex itself is legal under the law. There is a gay rights lobby that says that people should be treated the same regardless of their sexual orientation. I'd appreciate if you'd stop referring to the lobby as "homosex," since that's clearly intended as disparaging by reducing gay rights to nothing more than the right to have sex, when it's actual about job, housing, military service, and other forms of discrimination.
     
  16. Fogbuster

    Fogbuster Pro Bowl Player

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    As far as I'm concerned the term "gay" has been stolen by the same-sex sexual relations community. "Gay" used to be an innocent term, referring to "happiness", "light-hearted joy", and the like. Now it has been stolen, appropriated by those who are trying to ram the legitimatization of this misuse of love and sexual relations down everybody's throats. Homosexual relations lead only one way: into a pit of never-ending misery and despair. To try to paint it any other way is a devious lie, one that is destined to produce only untold suffering and hell, plain and simple.

    As the man you call your friend, Jesus, used to say: "Hate the sin, love the sinner." "Free" sex and homosexual behavior are absolutely sins, the worst of all sins. It won't matter if a million, ten million, or a hundred million join the homosex movement; it will still be wrong. Forever wrong. These things are seen the moment one dies and goes to spirit world. Infinitely better to stop such misbehavior now, while you still have a physical life. Man is created for woman, and woman is created for man. This will never change as long as there is life because that is how life is multiplied.

    Just as every plus in the universe is seeking its complementary minus, for every man in this world, there is one woman. For every woman, there is a man. Our mission in life is to find our opposite-sex partner and love her (or him, in the case of woman) as much as we love our own life. Only in living for the sake of our opposite sex spouse will we ever be allowed to know the full eternal joy of God's Kingdom, because that is what He made us for: eternal joy and happiness, no more suffering under Satan's accusation. But that is possible only when we live God's way, not Satan's way.

    So recognizing and granting legal protection to a "union" of two people of the same sex as "equal" to the marriage of two people of the opposite sex would be the very worst insult to the family, where love, life, and lineage originate between a man and a woman. Two people of the same sex can never create new life, thus such a relationship can never be sanctioned as "equal" to a family where love, life, and lineage begin.


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    Last edited: Dec 4, 2007
  17. wistahpatsfan

    wistahpatsfan Pro Bowl Player

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    #75 Jersey

    How the hell do you know that gay relationships lead "into a pit of never-ending misery and despair"? Who are you talking to? I'm sure there's plenty of gay couples who are miserable with each other. Lots of straight married people I know can say the same thing (but not me).

    "Free" sex and homosexual behavior are absolutely sins, the worst of all sins, huh? Wow! Worse than child molesting and murder? Worse than coveting thy neighbor's wife and goods? Don't remember gay sex being mentioned in the ten commandments.


    "Our mission in life is to find our opposite-sex partner and love her (or him, in the case of woman) as much as we love our own life. Only in living for the sake of our opposite sex spouse will we ever be allowed to know the full eternal joy of God's Kingdom, because that is what He made us for:"
    So I guess couples who can't have children or people who never marry and die alone cannot know your god's love, is that it? How about adoption? Is that OK? How about artificial insemination? No dice, eh?....Nice god you got there.


    So that's about it, Patters. It's all about sex. Foggy's god cares about sex above all things. Now we can all understand his obsession with the subject, just like the rest of the neocon freaks. Murder, stealing, worshiping false idols... are all better than not having straight sex. Pardon the pun, but you're fukced! Go directly to HELL!
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2007
  18. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    Absolutely Wistah. He's tall, has a strong arm.... He seems so programed in too many of his responses. I'll pass thanks.
     
  19. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Liberal Club 2:00 AM:

    Knock Knock
    "who is it"
    "my name is Allah"
    "oh, come right in, welcome"

    Same Club 2:24 AM:

    Knock Knock
    "who is it"
    "my name is Jesus Christ"
    "get the f-ck outta here"
    :bricks:
     
  20. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Oh, Fog, for heaven's sake. Grow up. You can still use the word the 'gay' in the old way, except with maybe pubescent teens who might giggle. The word was already going out fashion and was mostly used with expressions like gay 90s.

    If that's your experience, then I feel bad for you. As for me, I've been in a very gay gay relationship for 25 years, and I know many other people with equally happy relationships. In fact, I would think that no one else in this forum would agree with you regardless of their political persuasion, unless they don't know any gays.

    That's a battle you lost. Gays outnumber Unification Church members by an enormous number, and when I read about the Unification Church it's no surprise that people only take it seriously when Moon buys them. Here's a good article by a former leader of the Unification Church:

    http://www.freedomofmind.com/resourcecenter/groups/m/moonies/moonorg.htm

    I think I outgrew that kind of simplistic reasoning by the time I was about six. If that's the level of sophistication in the Unification Church, no wonder it's members are taught that questioning Moon is evil.

    It won't be long before science will allow two women to have a child of their own and two men, with a surrogate woman to do the same. So, I guess that will solve that problem.
     

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