You've said he's a bad DC never mind a bad coach. I've said he's a very good DC and an average coach. I think he's a Sean Payton, who's very overrated in mind, in that he needs a coordinator on the other side to run things for him. He'll never fix an offense. He'll never be a team builder.
I did not say he is a bad DC, I said he is not a good one (there is a big difference). I have cited performance on the field. If there is something you think I missed, please show me where he has consistently coached good defense. I assume we would agree that to be a good DC you would consistently have good defenses right? He has not.
You keep bringing up Sean Payton as an example and I do not know why.
As a HC Payton is 80-48 and has won a SB. He took over a worse team than Ryan took over before going 46-50.
As a 'one side of the ball savant' Paytons offense in NO as ranked first in scoring twice, second another time and never worse than 12th. Ryans defense in NY has been 20,20,19,24 the last 4 years after 1 and 6 the first 2. Payton has had very good offenses the entire time he has been in NO. Ryan has had below average defenses the majority of his time in NY.
Here's a list of coaches from last season. The top section clearly better than Rex. The second section is probably better but the all overrated team IMO with O'Brien thrown in there because I think he'll be good once he gets his QB situation worked out. I also put Ariens in there because he looks to be rising given Arizona and Indy. The bottom list I would take Rex over. You can debate a few of the names in all the levels but I think it mostly stands. If we did DCs which you feel he's even awful at that I'd put him in that elite level.
Belichick, Kelly, Harbaugh, Harbaugh, McCarthy, Coughlin, Carol,
Mike Smith, Lovie Smith, Caldwell, Marrone, Rivera, Lewis, Pettine, Garrett, Bradley, Philbin, Pagano, Weisenhunt, Zimmer, Gruden. McCoy, Sparano
Are we talking about the same guy? You have him similar to long term successes like Tomlin, Payton and Reid when he hasn't won anything.
You have him above guys who have totally outperformed him such as both Smiths,Pagano and even Lewis. Throwing OBrien in that group on a hunch kind of illustrates that your rankings are all over the place.
I think the issue here is that somehow you think Ryan has been successful. He has not. He failed in NY.
I'll give you my comparison to each coach, but remember a new coach who hasn't proven himself should get the benefit of the doubt over Ryan, who failed.
Belichick, Kelly, Harbaugh, Harbaugh, McCarthy, Coughlin, Caroll,
I'll just leave this group together and say not even close, although Kelly only because Ryan has failed, since Kelly has not really proven himself yet, but has started out decent.
Tomlin Not even close. 82-46, never had a losing season. Playoffs 5 of 8 years, and a RING
Payton Not even close. 80-48 Playoffs 5 of 8 years, 5 double digit win seasons and a RING
Fox Not even close 119-89 Playoffs 6 of 13 seasons. 2 SBs
O'Brien NOT YET PROVEN. Cannot compare yet
Reid Come on, you are kidding right? Andy Reid has coached TEN teams to the playoffs. Has won 150 games. Is 150-105. If andy Reid loses his next 57 straight games, he will have a better winning % than Rex Ryan. That is equal?
Fisher Again not even close. Fisher has won 162 games.
Ariens Early to judge but so far is way, way better.
Mike Smith Smith 66-46 Ryan 46-50 Smith 4 playoff teams in 7, Ryan 2 in 6. Smith better.
Lovie Smith Very similar coaches, but Smith has a better record, and got to a SB. Slight edge Smith
Caldwell Not even close. Caldwell has been a HC 4 years, and made the playoffs 3 of them. Would need to go 9-23 the next 2 years to match Rex Ryans 6 year record
Marrone Too early to judge
Rivera Close. Good comparison, could go either way
Lewis Not close. Lewis much better coach (and was a much better DC too by the way)
Pettine Too early to judge
Garrett Close. Much better record at 41-31. Better because his team has improved not declined by his leadership.
Bradley Too early to judge
Philbin Maybe too early, similar records overall but Philbin 23-25 to Ryan 18-30 the last 3. Philbin seems to be moving his team in the right direction while Rex was moving it in the wrong. Toss up
Pagano Not close. Pagano has done a great job in Indy, and was also a better DC 33-15 to 46-50. Again if Pagano goes 14-34 the next 3 years he has a better record than Rex and already has made the playoffs 3 times in 3 years while Rex made it 2 in 6 years.
Weisenhunt Very similar coaches. Have to give Whisenhunt the nod for getting to a SB when everything else is pretty equal.
Zimmer, Gruden. McCoy Too soon to judge.
Sparano This is actually the only no brainer in Rex's favor.
After reviewing your list, I think you need to go back and look at Rex Ryans tenure as HC of NYJ.
He has a losing record. He made the playoffs 2 times in 6 years, and none in the last 4.
He has had severe dysfunction in his lockerroom. Players have often quit on him, while others have taken his approach that saying how good you are is as good as actually winning (note this year his players were crowing about being the best 5-11 team in the league as if that is something to be proud of).
You call him an elite DC but he has been in the bottom 3rd of defenses 4 straight years, and he has had A LOT of talent on defense, including most of his high draft picks.
To compare him equally to Andy Reid, Sean Payton, or Mike Tomlin or call him better than Chuck Pagano or Jim Caldwell says either you aren't paying attention, or your rating is based upon how good Rex says he is, and ignores what has happened on the actual football field.
I've asked a few times what evidence you have of him coaching good defense, and you haven't answered that. I just gave a very detailed answer to your questions, so perhaps you can answer mine about where you can point to consistent very good defense being coached by him.
