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Republican leaders in VA embrace homophobic discrimination

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by Patters, Mar 5, 2010.

  1. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Think Progress Virginia attorney general instructs state colleges to stop protecting gay students from discrimination.

    In VA, a state where Republicans are generally considered moderate, the Republican governor, "Gov. Bob McDonnell (R-VA) refused to renew an executive order that would have protected gay and lesbian state workers from discrimination." And now, "Virginia Attorney General Ken Cuccinelli is asking the state’s colleges and universities 'to rescind policies that ban discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation.'"

    “It is my advice that the law and public policy of the Commonwealth of Virginia prohibit a college or university from including ’sexual orientation,’ ‘gender identity,’ ‘gender expression,’ or like classification as a protected class within its non-discrimination policy absent specific authorization from the General Assembly,” he wrote. Colleges that have included such language in their policies — which include all of Virginia’s leading schools — have done so “without proper authority” and should “take appropriate actions to bring their policies in conformance with the law and public policy of Virginia,” Cuccinelli wrote.
  2. PatsFanInVa

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    Pretty grim if you ask me.

    Virginia has long had one value that is antithetical to its historically republican attitudes, and that is a culture of superior, widely affordable post-secondary education. The "public ivies" in the Virginia system competed at a level approaching the most enviable private schools, at a price that real families can afford. You can't get in "Bones" by going to a Virginia school, I suppose, but the actual academics of a UVA or a William and Mary are pretty rigorous -- More like the Ann Arbor model than the Penn State model.

    To effectively announce that one of the jewels of the state, the post-secondary education system, is now a tool for exclusionary policy paints an ugly picture, not just for gays/lesbians/bisexual/transgender individual, but for any fair-minded individual who happens to be straight.

    If I'm 19 and astute enough to know that the body parts I prefer in a partner are pretty well determined for me prior to when I become sexually active, I can easily see the unfairness of legal discrimination against those whose orientation is different from mine.

    If I see a place that can provide a good education, but announces "oh yes, but we will discriminate against gays/lesbians/etc., it's just the way it is," I'll look at that as pretty much the same thing as announcing "It's a very good school, and one great aspect is we keep the darkies in their place."

    It's an ugly stain on the state's education system, one that I hope is removed as soon as possible. It's time.

    PFnV
  3. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

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    #11 Jersey

    I'm not surprised. Va. is one of the few states where it is technically illegal to live with a member of the opposite sex whom you are not married to.
  4. Wolfpack

    Wolfpack Banned

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    This is wonderful news. It is nice to see politicians who actually reflect community standards and refuse to cowtow to special interest groups seeking special advantages and benefits.
  5. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

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    #11 Jersey

    Protecting someone, anyone, from discrimination hardly seems like a special advantage or benefit, does it?
  6. Wolfpack

    Wolfpack Banned

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    Of course not, but as anyone who follows politics is well aware, these sorts of things are about setting up special rights, favors and protections for certain groups above everyone else. Whether we are talking about hiring quotas or hate laws, it is about making sure some people are more equal than others.
  7. Harry Boy

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    Does that go for Sarah Palin and her family also............:rofl:
  8. Nikolai

    Nikolai Football Atheist PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #54 Jersey

    LOL, as if it's enforced. Every state has archaic, asinine laws still on the books.

    In any case, this is rather moronic of the governor et al but let's be realistic here. This has a near zero chance of becoming reality. Virginia has become "independent voter central" lately and those guys could kiss those votes goodbye if they push too hard. They'll fall in line.
  9. sdaniels7114

    sdaniels7114 Rookie

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    If that's what the people want in their schools let them have it. I happen to think having outstanding schools in a region is a major plus for that region and wouldn't want to do anything to drive the very few exceptional minds out there away.

    In the end this just means it'll be that many more really gifted people settling here in Boston and other places that understand that certain people do have things a bit tougher than the rest of us.
  10. PatsFanInVa

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    Unfortunately, sdaniels, Massachusetts is not renowned for its state schools. Harvard and MIT aren't your local equivalent. UMass is, such as it is.

    Here are your "public ivies" - you'll note 2 of the original 10 are in Virginia, none in Mass, where one buys one's prestige.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_ivies

    Nothing against the really top-notch schools, sd, but Mass. does not put the same emphasis on public support of post-secondary education, and it shows.

    PFnV
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2010
  11. PatsFanInVa

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    So Wolf, you believe that if I score perfect 800s on verbal and math sections of the SAT, have a 4.0 GPA with a bunch of advanced placement classes, am the captain of both the debate team and the football team, and write a brilliant entrance application essay, but I'm gay, I shouldn't be able to go to college because "community standards" say they should give that spot to a dullard that likes girls?

    That's fair in your world?
  12. Wolfpack

    Wolfpack Banned

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    You're putting words in my mouth, the sign of your intellectually bankrupt argument.

    What I am saying is that if you scored 800s total on your SATs, have a 2.0 GPA, and was the captain of your high school Beer Bong Team, then you shouldn't get accepted over someone with a 4.0, perfect SATs, etc, etc, just because you are gay/black/hispanic/whatever.

    Just out of curiousity, which schools actually ask applicants for their sexual orientation on the application? Because the way some of you are speaking, that must be going on due to all the alleged discrimination against homosexuals. (I look forward to you completely ignoring this question).
  13. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    Reminds me of cop killer laws. If some loser murders me, it's X years in prison, if he murders a cop, it's 2X. Is the cop's life somehow worth more than mine?

    The problem with all this stuff, is that there are now too many who recieve a special advantage, at the cost of someone else.
  14. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

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    #11 Jersey

    I think you're missing the point here. The law being struck down was not one which gave any special preferences or treatments - it merely said that gays and lesbians could not be discriminated against.
  15. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

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    #11 Jersey

    Yes, it is.
  16. PatsFanInVa

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    Nope, Wolf, I made exactly the argument that applies here.

    You are arguing for the right to discriminate against people based on sexual orientation. The reasoning you provided was that community standards justify it.

    Please continue to explain why discrimination is a good thing.

    RW, my cat's life is worth more than yours. This is not the point of cop-killer laws. They do not value the individual cop over you; they value his post as a peace officer. Killing the cop strikes at the person but also at the system of law enforcement itself. I am sure you and others here will bloviate at length about how they serve no purpose and you can take care of yourself, but that is another conversation (i.e., society of laws vs. random anarchy.)

    PFnV
  17. Wolfpack

    Wolfpack Banned

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    No, I think you are the one missing the point here.
  18. Wolfpack

    Wolfpack Banned

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    As soon as you answer my question (which I knew you would ignore) and let me know which colleges and/or universities require individuals to state their sexual preferences in the application.
  19. sdaniels7114

    sdaniels7114 Rookie

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    You have a point. This so called bastion of Communism does seem to provide an environment that private uni's excel at, yet doesn't have quite the same public university pedigree as some other places.

    So what though? The truely gifted minds out there earn a complete walk at Harvard or William and Mary. I have to figure that one being private and the other being public isn't that important to someone who really does understand Quantum physics. Is it that important to earn a 40k a year scholarship as opposed to maybe a 10k per year one? I'd say not. Its the learning possibilities and the environment that attracts those minds and the environment around these parts (as Quiggy/Wolfpack has made perfectly clear) ain't the same as it is in Virginia.
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2010
  20. Wolfpack

    Wolfpack Banned

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    To me the absurdity is when you start looking at motivation when determining a sentence. For example, hate crimes... You get more prison time if you murder someone because you "hate" them than you do if you murder them for other reasons. How ridiculous is that? Is there even such a thing as murder that is not based in hatred?

    I realize that motive is important in trying to establish probable cause or someone's guilt, but when dealing with sentencing? Gimme a break. "Hey Johnson murdered a black guy because he hates black people so he should get more time than Smith who murdered his wife."
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2010

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