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Replacement Refs

Discussion in 'NFL Football Forum' started by Brady_to_Moss, Aug 13, 2012.

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  1. Brady_to_Moss

    Brady_to_Moss Revis Island is here PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #95 Jersey

    God they are horrible. If they have to ref into the reg season...get ready to see the worst calls and explanations.
  2. Gwedd

    Gwedd PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    They aren't any worse than the ones who gave the 07 Superbowl to the Giants. Eli should have been called "In the grasp". BUT..... the refs let the play go and go and go and go and go.

    So, I say deal with it. Refs are gonna call the game the way the NFL wants it called whether they are full-time, part-time or replacements. Doesn't matter.

    Jaded? Cynical? You bet I am. YMMV, but that's how I see it.

    Personally, I could care less whether there are replacement refs or not.
  3. Brady_to_Moss

    Brady_to_Moss Revis Island is here PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #95 Jersey


    You should care. Missing calls or calling the wrong calls ruins games. yes it happens with the normal crew..but not nearly as much as with this group of misfits.
  4. MoLewisrocks

    MoLewisrocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    We survived an air traffic controller's strike, probably before your time. I think we can survive an NFL referees strike. This is entertainment, not life and death.
  5. Brady_to_Moss

    Brady_to_Moss Revis Island is here PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #95 Jersey


    Too bad this forum isn't an air traffic control forum
  6. Wolfpack

    Wolfpack Banned

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    Pretty weak reply, MLR. If replacement refs cost the Pats a game, this forum will EXPLODE. They'll be no "it's only entertainment" excuses.
  7. ausbacker

    ausbacker Brady > Manning. PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #51 Jersey

    The refs that ****ed the Seahawks out of a Superbowl win were worse than the replacement refs.
  8. Brady_to_Moss

    Brady_to_Moss Revis Island is here PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #95 Jersey


    The people would be the same people *****ing if it came to these replacements screwing the pats out of a W..we would all be *****ing
  9. PatsWickedPissah

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    Precisely. Even though our dog wasn't in that hunt I went ballistic watching that travesty. Nothing I've seen with the B team refs even comes close.

    If in pre-season the NFL gets legitimately concerned about ref mistakes, they can temporarily order more reviews & challenges. Won't help PI calls but they've been a joke for years anyway. But for example the league may quietly tell the newbies not to call PI unless blatant. As Gwedd stated, the refs are gonna call it like the league wants. Let the noobs get the kinks out in pre-season, just like the players. Remember Edelperson's screwup?
  10. Reckedtrek

    Reckedtrek Rookie

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    I think most people realize it's not life and death. But I also don't think it should be too much to ask to have the games called as fairly as possible, especially with ticket prices as they are.
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2012
  11. Gwedd

    Gwedd PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    True, but then these things have a way of working themselves out. You go too far one way with ticket prices, for example, and folks just start staying home and watching the game on their flatscreen with a nice surround sound system. People are willing to pay more for somethings in order to have that live experience, to be in the stands when that one big play happened. they expect to get gouged for that. BUT you can only gouge them so much before they say no more, and vote with their wallets and their feet. I know I did.

    Same thing with the refs. It will only get so bad before the NFL will settle with the union guys. If it doesn't get to that point, if the officiating isn't too bad, if the crowd doesn't really notice, then there's no urgency to settle.

    In the end, it all comes down to money.
  12. UK_Pat37

    UK_Pat37 Rookie

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    I'm with that line of thinking and said as much in another thread already set up on this. They look nervous; stuttering on their words I'm sure they would normally get correct, pointing wrong directions and (I found this more comical than anything) saying the wrong teams name...a team that wasn't even playing. Some are blatantly shaking and you can see it.

    There have been a couple of bad calls, but I've seen some damn nice ones too.

    These guys got labelled failures before they set foot on the field by the media...and you can see their nerves showing. We had a tough preseason outing as a team...maybe we should focus more on that and less on these guys who could., for all ou know, gain in confidence and turn out to be pretty solid, if not outstanding, in the regular season. But hey, were the other refs anything but solid at most? Sometimes less so.

    Get behind them in preseason and help boost their confidence because I believe after four preseason games they will be a lot more so and much better in calling flags.
  13. MoLewisrocks

    MoLewisrocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    FWIW Ed Hoculi is leading the effort to keep the regulars in the loop and up to snuff on anything they might be falling behind on while they sit out...

    This is simply a pure money grab work stoppage I have little or no patience for. Fans cry for full time officiating. The guys on strike are the reason you will never get it. They are asking for huge increases and crying to keep a defined benefit pension plan the rest of us will never see again for working 26 weekends a year. They don't want to work full time, they all have rewarding careers outside the game. They all came up through the same ranks as the folks who are out there now, some of whom would probably much more amenable to a full time gig. In fact if those guys never return the ranks the league can recruit from will expand exponentially as Div.1 officials will apply in droves if the gig becomes a permanent one. That pool can't be tapped at this time because of threats against their college employment should they attempt to move up via fill in employment. And the union the league would be negotiating with would be far more likely to be open to full time discussion.

    Mistakes will be made because it's human nature and they always are. I think these guys will be focused on doing their best not to. Not so sure some of the incumbants hadn't gotten to the point where they did what they felt was in their best interest or what they felt was in the games (or a games) best interest on any given Sunday. These are the same guys who have consistently covered for each others gaffs and fought replay expansion for reasons of protecting self interest. Mike Perriera never met a mistaken call he couldn't rationalize until he went to Fox and his former constituents went on strike.

    The league has all the leverage here. The incumbants are simply attempting to create leverage through pounding the fear drum. They are doing and saying things about the people replacing them that they would rail against if it was being done to them. The only thing the replacement refs are threatening is the loss of the plum jobs of their predecessors.
  14. Reckedtrek

    Reckedtrek Rookie

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    As always, unfortunately.
  15. A.C Vegas

    A.C Vegas Rookie

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    I'll have some faith in the "refs" when they can tell the difference between Atlanta and Arizona
  16. Brady_to_Moss

    Brady_to_Moss Revis Island is here PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #95 Jersey


    Could be a few weeks before they get that one right
  17. PatsWSB47

    PatsWSB47 Rookie

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    Is it true that one of them is from the lingerie league? Heard that on Felger and Mazz.
  18. Mike in 333

    Mike in 333 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    This is a classic bush league power play by Goodell that could make the difference for some team or teams whether they go to the playoffs or not. We have a multi billion dollar organization nickel and diming a sport that dominates in all aspects other than their ability to come to terms with the officials who are responsible for the integrity and legitimacy of each game. I assume that anyone who feels the replacements are adequate won't be complaining about calls during season regardless of who's making them since it's apparently not a factor in the game.
  19. Brady_to_Moss

    Brady_to_Moss Revis Island is here PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #95 Jersey

    no....really? If this is the case...wow. Can't wait to see the calls that guy will be making if that's the case LOL
  20. fester

    fester Rookie

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    Oh no, I don't have a good pension, so no one else should and I'll support the cram down as we all race to the bottom....
  21. lurker1965

    lurker1965 Rookie

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    You are skipping the worst part.

    Say by week #3 the NFL settles with the ref's union. Week #4 sees the refs return -making preseason mistakes. A blown call by the regular refs then is a PR nightmare.
  22. PatsWSB47

    PatsWSB47 Rookie

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  23. UK_Pat37

    UK_Pat37 Rookie

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    A pension for a part time job that already pays ridiculously well on top of the good jobs they already hold?

    Screw that. If they aren't willing to go full time, why the **** should money earned by charging us for merchandise, tickets etc. go to their pockets when they've been shoddy at best the last few years.

    No one earns a pension part time...and if you do you're one lucky son of a *****! Why should they be any different? Train the guys we have now and do away with he gold diggers I say.
  24. Brady_to_Moss

    Brady_to_Moss Revis Island is here PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #95 Jersey

    bet anyone $5 this guy will be an official for the pats before all said and done
  25. MoLewisrocks

    MoLewisrocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Almost no one has defined benefit pension plans anymore because they either bankrupt industries or go under due to inability to continue to fund them. That these guys have had a pension plan for part time work is unique enough. The league wants to change it to a 401K plan. And give them substantial pay increases. Boo freakin' hoo. Reffing these games is kind of like playing in them, it's a priviledge and not a birth right. All the guys on strike came up through the same ranks as their replacements. And in 2001 Mike Perriera not only insisted they would be fine, reffing is reffing and they all make mistakes, he joined them coming down from his ivory tower VP of Officiating gig to serve as a backup replacement ref...
  26. MoLewisrocks

    MoLewisrocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Interesting podcast from outside the lines on the reffing standoff. Seems the issues boil down to the league insisting on a shift to funding a 401K retirement plan as opposed to maintaining the prior defined benefit plan. And wanting to make 7 officials full time in a move to expand training and study whether or not employment status improves performance. They also want to add 3 more crews (from 17-20) in order to facilitate replacement of individual officials due to injury or poor performance grading.

    The union seems to be arguing there is no rationale for messing with a good thing, honestly. They claim more crews are not needed because they don't get fatigued working one day a week (although arguing they work a lot more like 30-40 hours including in the off season training themselves with help from retirees and Ed Hoculi...even though they are otherwise full time employed). They claim 7 full time crew members are not needed. And it would be an insult to bring new guys on 3 additional crews in even from Div. 1 because it takes years and years to get good at this level...so they couldn't possibly be used to replace poor refs because the poor refs are years ahead of them.

    They seem to want a piece (%) of the pie base on revenue, just like players and owners...

    Outside The Lines - ESPN
  27. Brady_to_Moss

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    #95 Jersey

  28. p8ryts

    p8ryts Rookie

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    As an air traffic strike survivor, I can assure you that anyone can be replaced. I didn't think they were any worse than the regular refs. Every game we complain about bad calls and every game one of the points to the wrong team or makes a misstatement.
  29. PatsSox363804

    PatsSox363804 Rookie

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    Let's see them make calls that are worse than faceguarding in the AFC championship game or overturning Polamalu's INT in the playoffs (funny how those both benefited Peyton Manning.) As of now we're being hit with a barrage of media saying "these guys don't know what they're doing" and while it's true that they aren't as seasoned as the real refs let's not act like every fan base doesn't spend considerable time every year complaining about the refs. If this continues into the season the narrative in the media will change from the usual "these guys are only human, they're right 99% of the time" complete with mike pereira making excuses for them on Fox to "these scabs are ruining the integrity of the game" for blowing the exact same calls. The main complaint I have with them so far is that they are taking too long to make initial calls and review calls and it's hurting the flow of the game, that and the moron that called the ball downed at the 4 a touchback. Other than that it hasn't been that bad from the games I've watched.
  30. doesntmatter1

    doesntmatter1 Rookie

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    If i wasn't told constantly that they were replacements i would never have known. They'll speed up their calls with a little practice and eventually be just a good as the old ones, if not better. Besides, I haven't seen any bogus faceguarding or false starts #70.

    One other thing. I am tired of mike perira acting like its rocket science to call a game.
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