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Referee Reform

Discussion in 'NFL Football Forum' started by Urgent, Jan 12, 2014.

  1. Urgent

    Urgent Rookie

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    The league is going to have to confront reform of the current referee system this offseason. This has been the worst season for referee performance in recent memory.

    Any team can point to blown calls, and there seem to be more examples of the league admitting game-changing mistakes this season. Lots of overturned calls.

    I think few fans point to bias - the evidence for incompetence is overwhelming.

    And it's hard to point at any individual terrible referee - there is enough blame to spread around fairly evenly.

    Potential solutions:

    Younger referees - build a cadre of 30-year olds to complement the 60-year olds who may struggle with the speed of the game.

    More referees total - add a group of referees, and treat them like players. That is, aggressively measure them game to game with a panel of reviewers and rank them for game performance. Players are rated every game, and those that don't perform sit or are released. Rather than simply allocate post-season games, allocate all games based on performance. Those that are culled out can apply for roles at the college level.

    More referees per game - maybe it's just not possible to move quickly enough to get in proper position.

    Leverage technology better - when 10 million fans can see it's a touchdown and the seven guys on the field cannot, there should be a simple solution. Add seniority to the replay official - make him/her the 'captain' of the team and the highest-paid role, and give him/her the authority to overturn calls - if done within 30 seconds. The fact is that the casual viewer now has far greater ability to judge calls than the guys on the field, with a single angle at enormous speed. Given the super-slow-motion high-definition replays we see, it's amazing how often the guys on the field picked up the position of the ball. But 90% accuracy, when all the fans can see the actual result, isn't acceptable.

    As a baseball fan, I can see a similar need. Now that technology can determine balls and strikes, and safe or out, it's frustrating to rely upon 60-year old men with obstructed angles. Video technology has advanced faster than the referees could keep up. It's time to accept that and utilize technology and reform to improve the game.
  2. reflexblue

    reflexblue PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #91 Jersey

    i'd like to know what happened it went from OK to gruesome in a year.
  3. fnordcircle

    fnordcircle ( o Y o ) PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Nope. It's not even close. It's like you guys never even heard of Ben Dreith.

    Here's what's really happening - technology - both in the televising of the games and social media, have significantly outpaced the antiquated idea of having 80 70 year olds making the calls.

    But advances in filming the game giving us perfect angles in ultra-slow mo at 130942 FPS and then we all go on facebook or twitter or whatever and get angry.

    We're also at the perfect age for the generation that grew up being told how special they were, that they didn't even have to try to work at it, they're just special. So when things don't go their way it conflicts with everything they've been told and they start looking for reasons to invalidate it.

    So we're seeing more and more of us are shrieking about what we see in more advanced ways. That's what's happening.
  4. Elijah

    Elijah PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #11 Jersey

    As always, one generation blames the other for something that has nothing to do with age. I'll get off your lawn now.
  5. SalemPats

    SalemPats Rookie

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    No Jersey Selected

    They need to invest in the referees. Hire these guys full-time and give them a full week to prepare and make sure everyone is consistent in their calls.
  6. Bobsyouruncle

    Bobsyouruncle On the Roster

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    I don't know what you can really do. You could do the replay official thing but you can't give them 30 seconds without changing the game. You have to give them until the next snap. More officials might help, or they might get in the way. Younger officials might help, or they might lack experience and make wrong calls. I like BB's idea of making everything reviewable for the challenges.

    Games will always have bad or missed calls. BB's way you get to pick the calls that are the biggest game changers for review but still keep the game going since the challenges stays the same. And if a team complains they got screwed, they can take it up with their coach for not challenging. That puts it back on the teams, not on the officials effecting games.
  7. dizi24

    dizi24 Rookie

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    Sorry, but HD TVs, multiple TV angles, and Facebook has been around for a decade, and has been extremely common for the last 5-6 years. The point is this year, compared with past years had been the worst.


    People who talk like this are the most obnoxious people on earth. Save it for the local town hall meetings discussing skateboarding on the sidewalks
  8. SalemPats

    SalemPats Rookie

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    full-time referees and video replay done from a central location to take the pressure off them
  9. Bobsyouruncle

    Bobsyouruncle On the Roster

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    This is a popular idea but last I checked they make about $100,000 a year. They could make this their only job, but I'm sure the reason they don't is because they don't have enough work to fill the entire week. I believe the head of the crew is full time.

    The question is, how do you make them full time. Just say they can't work on their off days. Make them come into some office 5 times a week for 8 hours a day... What are they going to do? Review the rule book. That should kill about 4 hours, what about the other 36 hours per week. Plus, most of these guys don't live in the same state. Where would they go to work? Now your basically forcing people to quit their job, move so they can go to an office and sit on their hands 4 days a week.

    I just don't think making them go full time will do much but create bored officials and probably will cost them the better officials who don't want to move.
  10. dizi24

    dizi24 Rookie

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    I wonder how much they are actually able to change. My guess is the CBS impacts a lot of changes that people want to be made
  11. PATSYLICIOUS

    PATSYLICIOUS Rookie

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    It has been one of the worst years overall.

    I will give credit to the playoff crews though, so far I think the officiating's been great these 2 weeks aside from this game on right now (and I wouldn't be suprised if the SD-DEN game is a ****storm). And with all the close games I have yet to see a major blown call or the refs altering any outcomes late in the game.
  12. dhamz

    dhamz Rookie

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    Can't fix the refs until you fix the rules.

    Start with the Polianization of defense in the middle of the last decade, add in a couple major QB injuries leading to over the top QB protection, and top it off with Godell's lawsuit defense protection of defenseless players and you have made the game impossible to officiate. It is made worse by the calls that are the most judgmental also being the most punitive - spot foul PIs, automatic 1st downs on illegal contact, 15 yards for roughing and unnecessary roughness.

    Fans, players, coaches never know how any game they watch/play will be officiated.
  13. fnordcircle

    fnordcircle ( o Y o ) PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Facebook being around for a decade has little to do with how deeply ingrained social media has become in our lives is something that has only truly come about the last 3 years. Smart phones, twitter, etc, these things are more common place. Facebook was 'around' last decade but it only got opened up to the general public what, 5 years ago? And then after that it took a long time before your average farmer out on his tractor had a softphone buzzing in his pocket to see that someone had liked his meme post about Obama being Kenyan.

    Angles are better, we've got that robot camera on a wire, etc. But I mean plug your fingers in your ears and say that because some people had computers back in the 80s that nothing is different now, that's fine, reality shuffles onward without your agreement.


    I didn't fight in WW2 to be spoken to that way.
  14. Michael

    Michael Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    This guy
    [​IMG]
    Garth DeFelice #53 has GOT To go. I've noticed this guy ever since SB XL when he stood out as very suspicious to me. And I've seen him on MANY questionable calls since and has shown A LOT of attitude against teams as he did yesterday against Blount.

    Example of SB XL
    Here's his view of Hasselbeck
    [​IMG]
    He lost the ball after this but, it wouldn't be a fumble if he was touched before going down.

    Here he is emphatically signaling a turnover
    [​IMG]

    Here he is angrily in Hasselbeck's face
    [​IMG]

    Seattle had to challenge and he was over turned.

    Yes, I REALLY dislike this guy.
  15. pats4life12

    pats4life12 Rookie

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    the ref's have been horrible this year. some not all but some of the replacement ref's were better then these guys. Just look at today's Denver game the was no way that ball was catchable for Welker. But they still call PI on it. You will never guess who was refereeing that game Clete Blakeman, for those who don't know he was the guy how did not call PI in the end zone in Carolina. They have been inconsistent all year and it needs to change.
  16. Bobsyouruncle

    Bobsyouruncle On the Roster

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    As I see it, after reading Peter King's piece there are three problems:

    1. The rules are incredibly stupid.

    If anyone saw the Cam Newton roughing the passer call today we saw a call that shouldn't be made. As discussed in the King article, if the refs don't make that call they get downgraded.

    The point of all rules should be fair competition- and that's it. All this stuff about player safety has no bearing on how rules should be made, it's just PR stuff. Player safety has a place in the rules in that intentionally injuring a player creates a competitive advantage like face masks, late hits etc. But roughing for a hit that maybe sorta kinda could have been helmet contact even though it was a textbook tackle is stupid, no place in the rule book. The infraction should equal the competitive advantage, too many rules have become asymmetrical.

    2. Refs have a difficult time judging quick plays like PI.

    There's no easy fix, and I don't think making them full time will make any difference in how they can judge these plays. Maybe making them younger, but I doubt it. The plays can cause big swings in the game. The only way I see to affect this is to allow the coaches to challenge everything with their 3 challenges. These plays will always be difficult full speed.

    3. Refs are inconsistent.

    Take the Jets game, a penalty out of the blue that could have been called anytime.

    Every play the refs must count how many players come in and out so there are only 11, check that the formation is legal and look at the neutral zone, set the play clock and start or stop the game clock. Some of those things could easily be done with cameras and a booth officials freeing up the field officials to pay attention to moving parts. I think if you remove some of the minutiae it will free them up to catch more of the things going on in the field of play.

    That's my suggestion anyway, not that the NFL listens to me.
  17. Michael

    Michael Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I just looked at the officials roster. Greg Steed is still on it. I don't need to remind any Pats fan who watched the playoff game in Denver in 2006 (05 season) who he is. :rolleyes:
  18. FredFromDartmouth

    FredFromDartmouth Rookie

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    When you consider all the hundreds of millions bet on NFL games and some of the unsavory characters involved in betting, you have to assume that most games are rigged. You might scoff at this, but look at professional basketball.

    Since holding takes place on every play, it is easy for a ref to rig a game with a few holding calls, but this year it seems that the refs are not as subtle about rigging games as in the past. Just look at which team gets the ticky-tacky holding call or pass interference calls and you can figure out which team will not beat the spread.
  19. cavtroop

    cavtroop Rookie

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    I agree that something has to give - I know these guys are under an unbelievable amount of pressure, and we have the luxury of HD, replay, slo-mo etc, but the system is still broken.

    Firstly, Take todays broncos game - that gift PI call that Welker got near the end to basically seal the game, it wasn't even close, that should NEVER have been called. I know there was holding by another Charger on the play, but that irrelevant - the call on Welker never should have happened.

    The Jets game - calling us for a penalty that's NEVER been called before - or since, especially when the Jets had done it that game, too!

    The Carolina game, the PI on Gronk.

    The SAME ref that made the BS non-call flag pick up in the Carolina game was doing the Chargers game today - that ref should never get a sniff at the playoffs after clearly costing a team a W during the regular season.

    Maybe the solution here isn't more technology, or opening up replays or challenges - but not rewarding the mediocre and below refs with post season games? Jerome Boger last year was a prime example of that, along with the bozo that had the Chargers game today.

    Secondly, I agree the rule book needs a big overhaul, with an especially long look at all the changes and emphasis since Polian pooped his diapers a few years ago. PI should have less of a game changing impact, and they need to clear the rules as to what PI is - if they're going to call ANY contact, thats OK, they just need to do it consistently. It's too much of a judgement call right now.
  20. Chevy

    Chevy Rookie

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    The excuse that irks me the most is "We didn't want the game to come down to a call" (paraphrasing) ... See it, call it. Period. By actively deciding to NOT call a penalty they are having a far more negative impact. Look at the Carolina game - at a minimum it was illegal contact after 5 yards, possibly holding or PI. Either way, the game was ended because of the official's decision.

    I'm also tired (as has been said in other posts above) of there being camera angles on the jumbotron that show the play was (fill in the blank), but the officials didn't "have access to that angle". Bull.

    The officials are there to observe and to only interrupt play when there is an infraction of the rules. Timing cannot be a consideration if they are to do their job without bias.

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