Quick Game Thoughts - Digging for Gold Nuggets in loss to the 49ers edition

[ATippett56]

More importantly, they resulted in zero points for us.

The New England Patriots offensive line did not show up in the first half either.

 

[smg93]

You do realize that the two first half turnovers by the New England Patriots offense resulted in zero points by the 49ers offense?

Watch San Francisco 49ers vs. New England Patriots [12/16/2012] - NFL.com

So are you saying that Turnovers have zero bearing in a game if there are no points scored off of it?

 

[TheBostonStraggler]

So let me ask you this: why did this game end up 41-34, while the Texans essentially gave up last week?

For a little while, either our OL got better or the 9ers forgot they could manhandle our OL. Once that happened, the Patriot's poise and mental toughness that is the heart of this team kicked in, the Patriots did what they always do and they scored a lot of points. The Texans never had that moment, either in poise or in adjustment. They looked like they felt they were on over their heads and decided to go back to the drawing board. That says something about the Patriots and Texans.

On an added downer of a note, when we needed that last TD (right after the final 9er TD), the OL just couldn't get it done. All the poise and mental toughness in the world will not make up for a QB that has 7 guys out in pass coverage and still has less than 3 seconds before he gets smacked.

 

[mayoclinic]

Good OP. A few thoughts:

2. The Pats probably should have used the no huddle, hurry up sooner. The fact that the 49ers don't make a lot of personnel changes on defense would have tired them out a lot quicker IMHO. Granted with the Pats turning over the ball and not making plays early on offense, wouldn't have made much of difference.

I agree. The Pats' tempo on offense seemed very slow in the first half. I wondered why they weren't pushing it more.
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4. Credit the 49ers. They are the best team in the NFC and possibly the NFL. I still think the Pats can beat them and decisively in a rematch if they meet in the Super Bowl. If they can get tired in the cold, wait until they are in a hot dome.

No disrespect to the 49ers, I think Seattle will give SF a run for their money as the best team in the NFC. That could be a bit like the Ravens-Titans in 2000 - two very good, very physical teams, and the one who ends up being the wild card may not be the worse of the two in the long run.

5. I agree with Collinsworth. The Pats gave up so much to get back in the game that they might have had nothing left when the score was tied.

That's pretty common when a team has to come back from way down. Huge energy expenditure, and then when you catch up, you're out of gas. If the other team doesn't collapse, it's hard to sustain.

8.I will give the offense credit for getting over 500 yards and 34 points against the best defense in the league. That said, they might have gotten over 600 yards and 40 points if they weren't so awful in the first half.

The Pats have yet to face a top defense - the 49ers and Seahawks being the two best they have faced so far - with both Gronk and Hernandez healthy. Take this as a learning experience for the team about how to attack these kind of defenses in the future. If we are fortunate enough to play either team this season, it will be in the SB. Both will be confident having beaten us this season. As the Giants proved in 2007 and we proved in 2001, it's not always the team that wins the first matchup that ends up on top in the SB. But there's a lot of things we have to do to get to that point.

I'm kind of glad that this game's over, for better or worse. No more pressure of "having" to win. No more target on our back of being better than the rest of the NFL. Now we can just hunker down and focus on fine tuning the team for the playoffs, without much fanfare or distraction the last 2 weeks.

 

[mayoclinic]

Here's a nice attempt to find a silver lining:

Trailing 31-3 midway through the third quarter on Sunday, Tom Brady and the Patriots could very well have thrown in the towel and turned their attention to next week’s visit to Jacksonville. But right in line with the “Patriot way”, New England fought tooth and nail right until the final whistle at Gillette Stadium on Sunday. The comeback didn’t end with an incredible late-game score, like so many Brady comebacks have before, nor did it end with a win. But while losing ground in the AFC playoff picture, the Patriots may have gained something far more important to their Super Bowl dreams.

“We are never going to quit. It’s obviously not the way we are made,” Rob Ninkovich said with a stern stare after the game. “But even if we pull that one out, it wouldn’t have felt like a true victory because of the way we started the game off. You just can’t start a game like that.”

The way the Patriots started Sunday night’s showdown with arguably the best team in the NFC was downright pitiful. Clearly, there was an underlying issue with their preparation, or maybe it was just overconfidence from coming off a big win over Houston. In any event, the Patriots didn’t show up at the start of the game, but by the time it was all over, the Pats who took the field on Sunday night were completely transformed. Maybe it wasn’t apparent just yet, or they didn’t want to let onto what had just transpired, but even in defeat the Patriots were able to achieve something only championship-caliber teams possess: Will.

“I had a feeling we’d be able to come back,” Brady said of his team’s effort. “We hung in there, we battled back from a 28-point deficit, but we just made too many mistakes when we needed to make the plays.”

Mistakes aside, and there were plenty, the Patriots showed confidence and toughness in what was undoubtedly their roughest loss of the season. Coming back from a 28-point deficit to nearly pull out a win doesn’t just happen. It’s not a product of luck or chance. There’s nothing random to that sort of feat. An accomplishment like that is purely a manifestation of focus, persistence and resolve, and each of those are traits that any Super Bowl team must and does possess.

The Packers saw theirs blossom right here in New England during their Super bowl run in 2010 as they nearly took down the Patriots behind the arm of a backup quarterback in Matt Flynn. And the Giants saw theirs manifest in a loss to the Packers late last season before going on to take down the mighty Patriots in Indianapolis. Maybe Sunday was the Patriots’ moment of truth.

The disappointment of this defeat will continue to linger on the minds of each and every Patriots player, as it so vividly did in the locker room after Sunday’s game. But in the same vein, the Patriots will also remember the relentless attitude that saw them charge all the way back and nearly steal a win. And when the true tests arise on those frigid weekends in January, the perseverance and willpower that the Patriots discovered within themselves on this Sunday night may prove to be the difference.

Patriots Finally Find Super Bowl Formula Despite Loss With Resilient Comeback Against 49ers | New England Patriots | NESN.com

It's a nice take on a discouraging loss. I hope he's right.

 

[Steve102]

Here we go:

[*]Although, the odds of a first round bye are dwindling, this was the one game the Pats could afford to lose in any tiebreaker. Although even then, I don't know if any tiebreaker at this point would come down to conference wins unless the Ravens, Pats, and Broncos are tied at 11-5. Not really likely.

The Broncos have the Browns and the Chiefs remaining. I feel comfortable in saying that the two seed is likely not going to happen.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Here's a nice attempt to find a silver lining:



Patriots Finally Find Super Bowl Formula Despite Loss With Resilient Comeback Against 49ers | New England Patriots | NESN.com

It's a nice take on a discouraging loss. I hope he's right.

I don't feel great about any of the losses, but I feel far better about this one than I do about the three from earlier in the year.

 

[mayoclinic]

I don't feel great about any of the losses, but I feel far better about this one than I do about the three from earlier in the year.

This is the only one of the three in which we were clearly outplayed, and deserved to lose.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

Good OP. A few thoughts:



I agree. The Pats' tempo on offense seemed very slow in the first half. I wondered why they weren't pushing it more.
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No disrespect to the 49ers, I think Seattle will give SF a run for their money as the best team in the NFC. That could be a bit like the Ravens-Titans in 2000 - two very good, very physical teams, and the one who ends up being the wild card may not be the worse of the two in the long run.



That's pretty common when a team has to come back from way down. Huge energy expenditure, and then when you catch up, you're out of gas. If the other team doesn't collapse, it's hard to sustain.



The Pats have yet to face a top defense - the 49ers and Seahawks being the two best they have faced so far - with both Gronk and Hernandez healthy. Take this as a learning experience for the team about how to attack these kind of defenses in the future. If we are fortunate enough to play either team this season, it will be in the SB. Both will be confident having beaten us this season. As the Giants proved in 2007 and we proved in 2001, it's not always the team that wins the first matchup that ends up on top in the SB. But there's a lot of things we have to do to get to that point.

I'm kind of glad that this game's over, for better or worse. No more pressure of "having" to win. No more target on our back of being better than the rest of the NFL. Now we can just hunker down and focus on fine tuning the team for the playoffs, without much fanfare or distraction the last 2 weeks.

Im pretty sure hernandez played gainst seattle and so did gronk.

 

[ivanvamp]

That's pretty common when a team has to come back from way down. Huge energy expenditure, and then when you catch up, you're out of gas. If the other team doesn't collapse, it's hard to sustain.

I don't think they were out of gas. I think they were full of energy and it was SF that was out of gas. And then the long kickoff return (aided by several missed holding calls) jumpstarted them, along with the terrible missed tackle by Arrington.

That re-energized SF, I think, and they got a couple of huge stops. I don't think the Patriots ran out of gas, though. Just a couple of bad mistakes when they could afford to make none.

 

[BelichickFan]

Im pretty sure hernandez played gainst seattle and so did gronk.

He didn't say "played", he said "healthy" and Hernandez probably should have been held out of that game.

 

[Rob0729]

The Broncos have the Browns and the Chiefs remaining. I feel comfortable in saying that the two seed is likely not going to happen.

IDK, the Browns have arguably been playing better than the Ravens over the last month. The Browns are 3-1 and the Ravens are 1-3. Don't be surprised if they give the Broncos a much tougher match up on Sunday than the Ravens did yesterday.

If I was betting money, I wouldn't bet a penny against the Broncos winning out. But the Browns are not these doormats that people think they are. They aren't a good team, but they play most teams tough and brought some good teams to the wire (Dallas in overtime, Indy, etc.). If Denver looks past them, they could get smacked.

 

[Steve102]

IDK, the Browns have arguably been playing better than the Ravens over the last month. The Browns are 3-1 and the Ravens are 1-3. Don't be surprised if they give the Broncos a much tougher match up on Sunday than the Ravens did yesterday.

If I was betting money, I wouldn't bet a penny against the Broncos winning out. But the Browns are not these doormats that people think they are. They aren't a good team, but they play most teams tough and brought some good teams to the wire (Dallas in overtime, Indy, etc.). If Denver looks past them, they could get smacked.

I think you are seeing what you want to see. Manning looks like he's on a mission.

 

[mayoclinic]

I don't think they were out of gas. I think they were full of energy and it was SF that was out of gas. And then the long kickoff return (aided by several missed holding calls) jumpstarted them, along with the terrible missed tackle by Arrington.

That re-energized SF, I think, and they got a couple of huge stops. I don't think the Patriots ran out of gas, though. Just a couple of bad mistakes when they could afford to make none.

You may well be correct. As I've noted elsewhere, I haven't seen the 2nd half yet - I had to be up at 4:30, so I signed off at halftime. My comment was more of a general one than specifically a judgment that the Pats' ran out of gas, since I didn't have the opportunity to observe them first hand.

 

[ForThoseAboutToRock]

Responding to my own post in a pre-49er game thread:

1 - Are the 49ers the healthiest team in playoff contention this year? They've had the same starting 5 OL for every game. /snip

They toughed it out last night (49ers did). Iupati went out, came back, went out, came back. There was at least one play I saw where he was ineffective due to a banged up shoulder. The SF defense certainly seemed to miss Smith when he was out with the elbow issue. Eventually his replacement made a major sack (how a DT beats Solder on a pass rush... ) Credit to the 49ers.

2 - How tight are the refs going to call this game? Will there be a call in the early part of the game that adds/removes points from the board while each team is trying to set it's physical tone?

I hated how the game was called last night. Why did we need a 10 minute delay (felt like it was half an hour!) on that punt call? I think the 1st INT was exactly the type of thing I was referring to in my original post. Welker was clearly held in a Ty Law-ian fashion. Credit to Rogers for finishing the route, but it was a missed call on a game changer.

3 - Forecast calling for temps in the mid 30's and showers. That's wet, cold football. Ball security will be of the highest priority. Last week the Patriots RB's experienced a slew of fumbles which is extremely uncharacteristic for them. I'll go ahead and be bold in saying that I don't believe any Patriots RB will fumble the ball on Sunday.

I'll go ahead and not make any bold predictions again. :bricks:

4 - I don't think the Patriots have seen much in the way of plays out of the pistol from any opponents. This formation/scheme seems to be spreading from college to the NFL. Will the offense have holding power, or will it fade back to relative obscurity? A game like Sunday could have an impact on the future of the style... success in December, on the road, in primetime against a legit contender could spawn lots of dreamers and copycats looking for the next best idea. The inverse scenario is obviously in play as well.

Pistol offense seemed to be in the middle of the scenarios I put in. The 49ers offensive line blocked well, Gore is talented, and the misdirection of the zone read options seemed to help more than hinder the 49ers, but at least they weren't gashing the defense on 50 yard runs.... Instead the dude threw 3 20+ yard TD's.

6 - At face value, a rookie QB on a west-coast team beating the Patriots in Foxboro in December is preposterous... if only the games were won based on historic trends and what we're accustomed to seeing

:itsok:

7 - Will Brady have extra fire to step up his game against SF? Go watch the Brady 6 again and tell me he doesn't have even a teeny tiny grudge.

He was fiery. Lots of mistakes made on offense though.

8- Moss, gamebreaker?

Sorta... :nosmile:

9 - I think the Patriots play a cleaner, sounder game than the 49ers and win by 6. Games like this are a real stress test for fundamentals - generally the Patriots play with superb fundamentals and only rarely do they hurt themselves with mental mistakes. I think lots of people (especially in the media) will find a play here or there that should've gone the other way and therefore would've spelled victory for the 49ers.

Well the Patriots played an inferior game. The 49ers were fortunate to not pay for their fumbled exchanges with a turnover (except the one on 4th down), but that's how the ball bounces. There's no excuse for Ridley fumbling the ball (with another turned over on replay.) Same with Vereen. Special teams is almost all about fundamentals, and it was mostly poor with a streak of terrible thrown in. I wonder if Tracy White is that big a difference maker?

 

[Patriot Missile]

With all this talk about Manning and the Broncos you would think we lost to to them earlier in the season? I don't get all the fear emulating from the fans. Our team is better since the last meeting and so is theirs.

Broncos are still one of the worst teams covering tight ends and we have the best one in Gronk and a top 4 in Hernandez. Gronkowski in the lineup spells a better running and the numbers prove it. Look what Dennis Pitta did to them in the loss yesterday 7-125 2 tds. I fear nothing. I welcome the rematch as long as Dennard and Talib are healthy the Pats should be able to out score and out muscle this team.

It's not like the Broncos have this defense that makes QBs uncomfortable like the 49ers,texans and Giants. I see something like a 38-24 win on the road in Denver if the Pats play well the next 3 games.

 

[ForThoseAboutToRock]

With all this talk about Manning and the Broncos you would think we lost to to them earlier in the season? I don't get all the fear emulating from the fans. Our team is better since the last meeting and so is theirs.

Broncos are still one of the worst teams covering tight ends and we have the best one in Gronk and a top 4 in Hernandez. Gronkowski in the lineup spells a better running and the numbers prove it. Look what Dennis Pitta did to them in the loss yesterday 7-125 2 tds. I fear nothing. I welcome the rematch as long as Dennard and Talib are healthy the Pats should be able to out score and out muscle this team.

It's not like the Broncos have this defense that makes QBs uncomfortable like the 49ers,texans and Giants. I see something like a 38-24 win on the road in Denver if the Pats play well the next 3 games.

I would be so giddy at the thought of a quasi-Blizzard in Denver for the 2/3 matchup game. Let Peyton outplay Brady in the cold snow...Patriots vs Colts divisional 2004 - YouTube

 

[mayoclinic]

Here's a nice attempt to find a silver lining:

Patriots Finally Find Super Bowl Formula Despite Loss With Resilient Comeback Against 49ers | New England Patriots | NESN.com

It's a nice take on a discouraging loss. I hope he's right.

Maybe - just maybe - this will light a fire:

Angry. More than anything else, the Patriots were angry that they didn’t show up for the first 35 minutes of Sunday night’s game and spotted the 49ers a four-touchdown lead.

They were willing to give the 49ers credit for what they did in building that lead. And the Patriots were cognizant of the fact the Niners should have been even further ahead than 17-3 at halftime.

But the fact that they turned the ball over four times, drew key special teams penalties and had breakdowns on the back end that Colin Kaepernick and the Niners exploited simply ticked them off.

“The guys in here, we’re hot,” said special teams captain Matt Slater. “We know we’re a better football team than we showed out there tonight. Hopefully this serves as a wakeup call. Any team can beat any other team on any day and if we don’t come out and play up to our standards, something like this can happen. We can’t afford to have games like this going forward.”

“We just blew the game,” lamented Deion Branch. “We blew the game. Straight up. We straight blew the game. With all the stuff that was going on in the first half, they gave us so many opportunities. And our defense played great. They gave us so many chances on offense and we didn’t cash in. We spot them all those points, but we just couldn’t finish it off again.”

Curran: Patriots angry at themselves after loss to 49ers

Good. They should be pissed at themselves. Maybe come playoffs they won't take any prisoners.

 

[Rob0729]

I think you are seeing what you want to see. Manning looks like he's on a mission.

Not at all. Manning is beating on a lot of bad to average teams. Mission failed vs. the Pats. Mission failed vs. the Falcons. Mission failed vs. the Texans. Heck, mission almost failed vs. the Chiefs a few weeks ago (if the Chiefs had even a bad offense, they might have won that game).

Sorry, the Broncos since they played the Patriots had a cake schedule. The only real teams they faced were the Bengals who were on a four game losing streak when they lost to the Broncos and Ravens who are clearly on a downward spiral. Other than those two teams, every team they faced currently have a losing record. In fact, none of the other teams they have faced on their current winning streak currently have more than 6 wins on the season.

So on their current 9 game winning streak they have beaten seven teams that will likely finish the season below .500, the Bengals who cannot be better than 9-7, and a rapidly falling Ravens team that might finish the season 10-6 or 9-7 after being 8-2 a month ago.

I see things perfectly clear. I just don't buy the media hype. The Broncos are a very good team, but they are beating up the hot garbage of the NFL and has yet to beat any elite team they have faced.

 

[Steve102]

With all this talk about Manning and the Broncos you would think we lost to to them earlier in the season? I don't get all the fear emulating from the fans. Our team is better since the last meeting and so is theirs.

Broncos are still one of the worst teams covering tight ends and we have the best one in Gronk and a top 4 in Hernandez. Gronkowski in the lineup spells a better running and the numbers prove it. Look what Dennis Pitta did to them in the loss yesterday 7-125 2 tds. I fear nothing. I welcome the rematch as long as Dennard and Talib are healthy the Pats should be able to out score and out muscle this team.

It's not like the Broncos have this defense that makes QBs uncomfortable like the 49ers,texans and Giants. I see something like a 38-24 win on the road in Denver if the Pats play well the next 3 games.

I am not saying that I don't think the Pats can't beat the Broncos. I am saying I don't think the Browns and Chiefs can.