Welcome to PatsFans.com

Props to the Patriots organization re the OL

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by Fencer, Dec 24, 2011.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Fencer

    Fencer Rookie

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2006
    Messages:
    7,608
    Likes Received:
    3
    Ratings:
    +3 / 0 / -0

    The Patriots' ENTIRE starting OL from last season was unavailable for (almost) all of this game. Still, the Patriots wound up putting together a good overall offensive performance.
  2. IcyPatriot

    IcyPatriot ---- JAG ----- PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    36,492
    Likes Received:
    18
    Ratings:
    +24 / 1 / -0

    #87 Jersey


    Certainly hope the fans here bashing the Belichick drafts realize this ... his drafting there has saved the season.
  3. Uncle Rico

    Uncle Rico Rookie

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2010
    Messages:
    8,962
    Likes Received:
    3
    Ratings:
    +6 / 0 / -0

    #70 Jersey

    Wow. Now let's see how much notice this gets in the media, compared to the whole Packers o-line injury saga. Betting not so much, despite the fact pats won.
  4. Fencer

    Fencer Rookie

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2006
    Messages:
    7,608
    Likes Received:
    3
    Ratings:
    +3 / 0 / -0

    And they did it in diverse ways, with contributions from all over the organization.

    Waters -- quality FA
    Solder -- high pick
    Connolly -- returning solid reserve
    Cannon -- low pick who then had to be PUPed
    Thomas -- who?

    The personnel folks did very well. Dante obviously did great. The game-day play-callers adapted beautifully to the strengths and weaknesses of the group they had on the field, even if it took them a number of series to get there. And the skill-position players blocked solidly when needed as well.
  5. Joker

    Joker PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2004
    Messages:
    16,128
    Likes Received:
    36
    Ratings:
    +56 / 2 / -2

    while I agree with about 90% (could be 99%...but then could be 80%) of what you just posted,I have to say, my opinion on Thomas is he's a JAG...this is not a player I want starting in a playoff game.

    My guess is Light is back next week and then pulled, Mankins sits and BB plays it conservatively with a lead in the Razor.The #1 seed is still in play and that IS an incentive, but there's a number of nagging physical problems with more than a few important players on this roster that could stand a little more R+R. Tough call...can't wait to see what Bill does....probably the opposite of what I would guess.
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2011
  6. alvinnf

    alvinnf Rookie

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2008
    Messages:
    3,296
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    Three cheers for Scar! Hip Hip Hooray! and so on.
  7. ctpatsfan77

    ctpatsfan77 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2005
    Messages:
    20,243
    Likes Received:
    33
    Ratings:
    +34 / 0 / -1

    The Pats won a SB with a JAG filling in for Matt Light.
  8. Stilla

    Stilla Rookie

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2011
    Messages:
    261
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    Really, are we ready to draft a defense this off season...

    Its time to make sure the o-line has depth and a future.

    2 Drafted Running backs and an old QB will be riding their backs.

    Worst defense and Brady upright throwing = playoffs.

    No o-line and we can't throw or run.
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2011
  9. The Scrizz

    The Scrizz Rookie

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2010
    Messages:
    1,516
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    We drafted 2 tackles in this most recent draft and still have Vollmer (who's an all-pro when healthy), Mankins, Light and Waters - both above average for another year. Should we draft 1st round OT's that only play in case of injuries?

    2 rooks, a jag, and a backup C kept Brady upright for the whole 2nd half. I would say that is depth AND the future.

    Give us an average D and Brady will rip this league apart.
  10. Wax Frog

    Wax Frog Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2007
    Messages:
    2,576
    Likes Received:
    3
    Ratings:
    +3 / 0 / -0

    I love me some Scar :D
  11. Deus Irae

    Deus Irae PatsFans.com Retired Jersey Club PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2006
    Messages:
    40,774
    Likes Received:
    64
    Ratings:
    +89 / 3 / -1

    Disable Jersey

    When did BB draft Waters, Thomas and Connolly?



    The coaching staff was able to settle the O-line down today, and it was a huge part of the difference in the second half, but let's not go making this out to be something about the drafting, because it wasn't. 3 of the 5 left standing weren't even drafted by the Patriots, regardless of round.
  12. Fencer

    Fencer Rookie

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2006
    Messages:
    7,608
    Likes Received:
    3
    Ratings:
    +3 / 0 / -0

    But the other two were rookies, one playing after a compressed off-season, and the other playing with a lot less practice than even that.

    So drafting was indeed a part of it.
  13. Sciz

    Sciz PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2009
    Messages:
    7,095
    Likes Received:
    5
    Ratings:
    +13 / 0 / -0

    Yep. If they had grabbed someone who wasn't ready (like a Sherrod or Carpenter, or really just about any OT other than Cannon after the first 2 rounds), then the Pats probably don't win that game, and Brady probably would have needed some rest this coming wekk:eek:
  14. TheComeback

    TheComeback Rookie

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2008
    Messages:
    1,526
    Likes Received:
    2
    Ratings:
    +2 / 0 / -0

    Pretty ridiculous to argue that drafting wasn't a part of their performance when both tackles playing today were drafted rookies.
  15. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    19,975
    Likes Received:
    24
    Ratings:
    +28 / 1 / -0

    We are likely to add an OL. However, the current OL looks pretty good going into 2012. Belichick might just stay pat.

    COMING BACK
    Near the top in pro bowl voting: Light, Mankins and Waters
    The three young OT's with a future: Solder, Cannon and Vollmer
    backup centers who have started: Wendell, McDonald
    backup OG, FB, signed for 4 years: Thomas

    NOT SIGNED FOR 2012 (one or both could be re-signed)
    # AFC center and fullback Connolly
    a solid center for years Koppen
  16. State

    State Rookie

    Joined:
    Jan 10, 2005
    Messages:
    2,507
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    Not to put a damper on it, but some of this is luck with excellent FA pickups, like Brian Winters, and drafting a first round guy who had the non-hodgens lymphoma detected which caused him to drop like a meat ball off the table in the draft. Marcus Cannon is the real deal. He's got a great base (giant arse and sturdy legs) to be a RT for a decade or more.

    But most important, Scar is simply the best in the business. You can't beat good coaching.

    having said that, this team will need to upgrade the middle of the draft. That kid they drafted from Penn State too high hasn't panned out so far. And the monster NTs are getting too big for Koppen to handle in the run game.

    BTW, who is Thomas,64 ? He looked awfully small. Like Gronks little brother or something.
  17. PatsFanInVa

    PatsFanInVa PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2006
    Messages:
    19,531
    Likes Received:
    41
    Ratings:
    +43 / 0 / -2

    And that Gronkowski pick last year? Who spends a pick that high on a tight end?

    Utterly useless I tell you. Why oh why don't the Pats call the patsfans.com draftniks before they pick? I mean, I know they have a war room and stuff, and I know all about Belichick's ego, how he's supposed to be good at football and stuff, but really? At least half of us hated the Chad Jackson pick and he never panned out. Shouldn't that be enough?
  18. randomk1

    randomk1 Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2010
    Messages:
    3,818
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    Brady and some of the receivers deserve credit aswell. In the 2nd half he started getting the ball out alot quicker to guys like Welker and Hernandez. Also the TD to Branch was just the same brain those guys share.

    I just hope we get healthy...the OL is one place where we can't afford injuries.

    The Steelers or Ravens would've had a field day yesterday.
  19. DarrylS

    DarrylS PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    40,315
    Likes Received:
    19
    Ratings:
    +19 / 0 / -0

    Scarnecchia is the man.. the unsung hero of this franchise.
  20. Pat the Pats Fan

    Pat the Pats Fan Rookie

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2005
    Messages:
    2,857
    Likes Received:
    2
    Ratings:
    +2 / 0 / -0

    I thought it was an incredible recovery by the OL in the 2nd half, due to great coaching.:singing:
  21. patchick

    patchick Moderatrix Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    11,112
    Likes Received:
    26
    Ratings:
    +34 / 0 / -0

    With so many OL injuries, I've lost track of what's wrong with Wendell. Presumably if he's available he'll start at center and Connolly can move out to guard, displacing Thomas?

    How many different starting OLs have the Patriots fielded this year? 4 different centers alone. But of course,you can't possibly expect the Jets to be able to function without Mangold. They get a pass on those games. :rolleyes:
  22. robbomango

    robbomango Rookie

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2011
    Messages:
    2,915
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    This is a good article comparing GB, NO, NE offenses and QB advantage. I believe they used outside professional sources to draw the comparisons. the O-line was ranked 3rd out of the 3 teams or tied with GB.

    In a battle of best, Tom Brady may get the nod - Sports - The Boston Globe
  23. patchick

    patchick Moderatrix Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    11,112
    Likes Received:
    26
    Ratings:
    +34 / 0 / -0

    Here's something to contemplate. GB and NE both have battered o-lines, right?

    Aaron Rodgers sacks to passing attempts ratio, 1:13
    Tom Brady sacks to passing attempts ratio, 1:21
  24. RayClay

    RayClay Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2005
    Messages:
    17,518
    Likes Received:
    40
    Ratings:
    +49 / 0 / -1

    #75 Jersey

    Wonder if we could pick up some vet for security? Dante's coaching can only work if there's a body attached to it.

    And could we please hold off the next year's draft talk just a bit? For all you gnub's, it used to be a big deal to be 12-3 and headed for the playoffs as the first seed. Almost as important as the draft, even.
    Last edited: Dec 25, 2011
  25. upstater1

    upstater1 Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2005
    Messages:
    12,926
    Likes Received:
    9
    Ratings:
    +9 / 0 / -0

    It could simply be they like Thomas better than Wendell. I wouldn't be surprised. Thomas is a lot stronger than Wendell and a lot more athletic. Also, if you were watching him, he throws an amazing first punch. I saw him knocking people back. He's raw though, he needs Scarnecchia to teach him a lot.
  26. upstater1

    upstater1 Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2005
    Messages:
    12,926
    Likes Received:
    9
    Ratings:
    +9 / 0 / -0

    First, Ohrneberger was a 4th or 5th rounder, so he wasn't drafted that highly. You can't even expect 4th or 5th round lineman to stick with your team more than 2 years.

    Donald Thomas is 6'4" and 315 pounds. If you think he's small, then what do you think of Conolly, Koppen and Wendell. Brian Waters is even smaller.

    Thomas is a great athlete, he's built like Adonis, but he only had 3 years of college football, one year of high school football (freshman year) as he went to a school without football and then wasn't allowed to play on a cooperative team.
  27. upstater1

    upstater1 Rookie

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2005
    Messages:
    12,926
    Likes Received:
    9
    Ratings:
    +9 / 0 / -0

    They look full-up at the OL. The only question is Waters as he's getting up in age. Light too, but both these players look like they still have it. Maybe Koppen coming back from an injury is a question too.

    Regardless, I can't see expending any draft picks on this position next year. I see them carrying 9.
  28. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    19,975
    Likes Received:
    24
    Ratings:
    +28 / 1 / -0

    The question is indeed a pure Thomas vs. Wendell at OG. Thomas is apparently ahead of Wendell in the OG depth chart.

    And Connolly is clearly ahead of Wendell at C. In fact, Connolly has been good enough to be voted the #4 OC in the AFC by fans.

    One question is how much we lose when we go from Connolly to Wendell at center. The other is the difference between Connolly and Thomas at guard. I think that Connolly has found a home at center and that Belichick wants to re-sign him for 2012.

    As far as the combination of two players, Belichick seems to prefer Option 1.

    OPTION ONE
    LG Thomas
    C Connolly

    OPTION TWO
    LG Connolly
    C Wendell

    Connolly is a starter quality center. Thomas is getting experience at OG and might have starter talent. Wendell is a perennial backup. I'm fine with Wendell being on the team. We need solid backups.

  29. goheels22002

    goheels22002 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2009
    Messages:
    3,714
    Likes Received:
    4
    Ratings:
    +9 / 0 / -1

    #50 Jersey

    The Patriots lost a Super Bowl with a JAG at right tackle. Reggie White destroyed the Patriots offense with the Max Lane matchup.

    16 years later the fundamental need is for a healthy, effective line come playoff time. Thank goodness for the bye week.
  30. fester

    fester Rookie

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2005
    Messages:
    429
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    I like this entire piece except the bolded part. Fans, even hyper fans like those that post on Patsfans.com are not reliable evaluators when grading interior line play. Let's see where Connolly falls in the player and coaches' votes [there are some problems with these metrics, but the confidence intervals of reality vs. perception should be a lot tighter as the players being voted upon are being evaluated by people who actually know what they should be looking at {on the whole --- just thinking of what the typical kicker knows about interior O-line play or CB technique, but I digress).

    I figure the Pats will grab an interior lineman somewhere in the first four rounds, and then another half dozen UDFAs OGs/OCs for camp competition
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page