ProJo: Still no movement on Samuel

[BionicPatriot]

I'm glad they're stubborn, there is not much else I can add to what has already been said because I agree with alot of it. How can you say Samuel deserves to get paid elite money when the dude has done it ONE single year? What about all those average seasons he had? You cannot blame the Pats for this one, because this is just another player who has a big year and thinks he deserves HOF money.

Samuel is as good as gone next year if he does not become realistic. Which is fine because I know he wont, but I bet you anything he plays this season because there is no way he loses out on all that money AND loses a chance to assure GM's he is worth the cash.

Thats just fine to me, because I've seen this team tear apart the league with average secondaries, so obviously we're not built on elite CB play.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

I don't even think it's that they think they deserve HOF money, I think they see themselves as striking while the iron is hot.

Deion thought he could strike while people still remembered him as a super bowl MVP, and Samuel wants to strike while people are talking about him sharing the interceptions lead... note that in both cases there was an option of playing ball and moving on, Deion in the last year of his contract, and Meriweather under the franchise tag.

They saw this as against their interest, because they could be paid more elsewhere, they could get hurt, they were at the top of an earning arch that stood more chance of declining in a year than holding steady or increasing. They were trying to "sell high".

Yeah well, you can't do that, without the team you play for basically giving you the gift of that last year of the contract, or that non-use of the tag. What you do when you hold out, is cancel any "good will" type gestures that might be made in a less brass-tacks bargaining environment. If you play hardball, the team plays hardball... it was a gift to let Deion go to Seattle, in fact. Not that I begrudge him it... it would probably do nobody any good to have him sitting around sulking.

So, they excercise their rights, and hope for the best. But I really think these guys would be best served by looking long-term at the impact of the type of money that is separating their expectations from the team's position. At least, to hear Deion tell it last season.

PFnV

 

[old 55]

Question - can the Pats suspend him for a year and retain his rights if he doesn't report by the first game?

I assume they have to pay him the whole salary if he reports for the 1st game, but I'm unclear as to their obligation to let him call the shots and chose to sit out just the 1st 10 games.

If anyone knows how this works, please enlighten me.

Thanks

 

[slash83]

let him sit his ass out and then next year franchise him again to set an example weve won with worse at DB. SAMUEL WILL NOT GET A LONG TERM DEAL WITH THE PATRIOTS WE DONT VALUE DBS MUCH IN OUR SYSTEM.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

And you think that you can force a player to play at a probowl level and get injured.?

Nobody's forcing anyone.
It's in his interest to GET PAID and play.
If he wishes, sit out the 1st 9 weeks and only play the last few games to minimize injury risk, showcase his talent, make some money and not lose the NFL year. It's in his interest to play well to Max out his FA value.

That strategy assumes (likely) that we need help (via injury, lack of talent) at CB in weeks 10+.

 

[PatsSteve1]

IMO, which I've posted before, the 2 sides are too far apart for a deal to happen. So he's either traded, shows up about 9/1 or shows up the 10th game. Or 11th game. Whatever anyone here thinks about what the Patriots reportedly offered isn't going to make Samuel take it.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Question - can the Pats suspend him for a year and retain his rights if he doesn't report by the first game?

I assume they have to pay him the whole salary if he reports for the 1st game, but I'm unclear as to their obligation to let him call the shots and chose to sit out just the 1st 10 games.

If anyone knows how this works, please enlighten me.

Thanks

Not for not reporting. He is under no obligation to report until and unless he signs the franchise tag. He is currently an unsigned FA whose rights remain with this team only by virtue of the tag. He can hold out until week 10 (which happens to be our bye week, and the union usually advises they report a week early lest some mishap prevent them from reporting on time) and then report and collect roughly $4M in guaranteed salary whether they choose to play him or not. He also gets a full year of service credit for his retirement.

And by reporting by week 10 he is subject to the 120% increase in the total cost of tagging him in 2008. That would presently be $9.3M. And if you think he hurts his FA value by holding out, then you should also assume he increases his chances of not being retagged at that price. Because if he were, and he sensed his market had slipped, he could sign that tag on the day it was slapped on him and simple make himself untradeable by refusing to reach a long term agreement with anyone willing to trade for him. No one would take him for much in trade if they had to pay the that tag salary and had no hope of signing him themselves.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

let him sit his ass out and then next year franchise him again to set an example weve won with worse at DB. SAMUEL WILL NOT GET A LONG TERM DEAL WITH THE PATRIOTS WE DONT VALUE DBS MUCH IN OUR SYSTEM.

Really...when? In 2001 and 2003 our starting LCB was Ty Law. In 2004 it was Asante Samuel. I don't think he'll get a deal here either, but just sayin...

 

[slash83]

Really...when? In 2001 and 2003 our starting LCB was Ty Law. In 2004 it was Asante Samuel. I don't think he'll get a deal here either, but just sayin...

just saying I still think were superbowl contenders even if Asante doesnt play this year. Even tho id still love to have him

 

[lapatsfan]

The Pats didn't overpay for Ty Law or Branch. IMO, they will not overpay for Asante either.

 

[TruthSeeker]

I can't see a deal happening in July; that's just too much of a stretch. Why would Samuel change his position? The Patriots certainly won't be changing their offer very much.

I also don't understand why not having Samuel on the roster is considered such a distraction. He's a free agent! It's not like he's under contract to the Patriots (like Deion Branch was). You play whoever is on the field and don't worry about the rest - whether it's injury, discipline, a holdout (which Samuel is not since he's not under contract) or a free agent you want to sign.

Finally, I don't understand the need to "punish" Samuel should he decide he wants to sign the tender offer made by the Patriots and report at some time during the season. What does that accomplish? He was a free agent! He didn't have to sign with the Patriots or with anybody. If he doesn't want to play football, he doesn't have to. It's not like he's under contract or something. Should he agree to the tender offer, that's when they should start to use his skills for the benefit of all. I'm figuring week 3.

 

[shakadave]

Really...when? In 2001 and 2003 our starting LCB was Ty Law. In 2004 it was Asante Samuel. I don't think he'll get a deal here either, but just sayin...

Right! (Law was even our starter for some of 2004.) We've hardly ever beaten the Manning Colts without Law. I wish we "overpaid" for him last year and/or the year before.