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Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by pats1, Apr 18, 2008.

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  1. pats1

    pats1 Moderator PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Last edited: Apr 18, 2008
  2. bruschifan1

    bruschifan1 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    sigh... too bad all of us in RI never get to watch it. :-(
     
  3. Dbrooks55

    Dbrooks55 Rookie

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    thanks for the info I will make sure I watch
     
  4. MoLewisrocks

    MoLewisrocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Recap of what I recall:

    Zolak and Reiss were the guests. Both think the team will trade down. Zo is convinced Ryan will fall to them. Reiss was a little out in left field as he sometimes is - said he almost believes the team would have been better off losing #7 and retaining #31...regardless of whether they have to move down at 75 cents on the dollar as he put it, that is assinine...

    FWIW BB said FA is pretty much over...on to the draft and camps. Said if they can't move down they have identified a couple of players they would be comfortable taking there and they believe at least one or two of those will be there. Reiterated his belief that the combine is just a test, some guys test better than they perform and others perform better than they test. Said it all comes down to game tape.

    Then Mayock was on. He said the value corners will be available in the second and third. Mentioned Cason. Said their measurables are on par with the guys who will go in the first. He thinks the Patriots will go OL or DL if they draft at 7, said Chris Long would project to be Mike Vrabel while Rivers would play inside and not outside here. Mentioned Albert.

    There will be a post draft All Access on the Tuesday after the draft.
     
  5. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    Yeah, that's just retarded. If #7 is such a burden I'm sure plenty of teams would happily trade a lower #1 straight up for it.
     
  6. SpiderFox53

    SpiderFox53 Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    While I didn't watch it, I feel that Reiss just meant that 31 would have been easier to deal with than 7 will be. Which is true. Yes they will get better value (hopefully) with 7 but with all the various things that can happen, 31 would definately be less cumbersome.
     
  7. vyrago

    vyrago 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

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    Agreed, but from the look on his face it appeared to me that Reiss didn't say exactly what he meant--at least I hope that's the case since what he said was pretty stupid.
     
  8. BionicPatriot

    BionicPatriot In the Starting Line-Up

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    If the Patriots were drafting 31, they wouldn't have near the talent coming in either. You gotta spend money to get value. Whoc ares if a young rookie is expensive? IF, IF they drafted a young stud LB who proved to be the cornerstone, is it a bad pick? It's a blessing and a possible curse, all depends how you use it. You can and if your any good, will find all pro talent in the top 10. The 1 tear they drafted so highly, they landed Seymour. Look at the top 10 talent in just recent years. I think for a team so loaded with only some needs it helps a lot.
     
  9. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    Easier to deal with in what way ? The contract ? Sure. But in no way, shape or form would we be "better off" with #31 and Reiss should hang his head in shame based on what he apparently said.
     
  10. MoLewisrocks

    MoLewisrocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Couple of weeks ago he took Talib at #7. Mike is what he is and I wouldn't trade that even to get Breer back from the DMN...because much as I enjoyed his X's and O's critiques, he's just a reporter and fan working off a broadcast feed with no insight into all the rest of what goes into a coaches game review. I don't value mike for his opinions, just for his dogged and generally level headed approach to factual reporting. There is a little bit of naivete and a tendancy toward overcautiousness/seriousness with Mike, but it's a fair trade off versus the double whammy of loudmouthed arrogance and ignorance that so many of our local mediots earn their living off of.

    I know lots of fans value opinion, but for me unless it's genuinely informed I'll develop my own, thanks...

    There are concerns about overpaying for high draft picks if you botch the pick, and there are team who would be better off if fate made their decisions for them, but we aren't one of those teams. Belichick and Pioli didn't get us this far by taking the least cumbersome approach to teambuilding.
     
  11. pats1

    pats1 Moderator PatsFans.com Supporter

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    His opinion of Talib was based off this:

    http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/reiss_pieces/2008/02/pats_meet_with.html

    (The last sentence is the key)
     
    Last edited: Apr 20, 2008
  12. pats1

    pats1 Moderator PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Just for nothing is taken out of context, here's a transcript:

    Lynch: "Are the Patriots in a position of strength right now, as opposed to the last few years?"

    Zolak: "Absolutely. 100%. And you talk to Coach Belichick at the meetings, at the league meetings, and he said 'Well, we usually don't focus on a group of guys that we know are going to be gone at the top of that first round.' Now all of the sudden he's gotta pay a lot of attention there. Like I said, who knows who falls? What if Jake Long falls? What if Chris Long falls down there? Or, if the phone is ringing off the hook for Matt Ryan, they need to see what 8, 9, 10, and 11 behind them need, because those are the teams that are going to be calling them if one of those players, key players, falls to them at 7."

    Reiss: "I look at it a little bit differently. I actually think they almost would have been better if the league took away this pick and kept them with the 31st, just because I think that's where the true value of the draft really is."

    Lynch: "Really?"

    Reiss: "And I know that's--"

    Zolak: "Yeah, just take both away, penalize them--"

    Reiss: "I know that's extreme thinking, but I do feel strongly. And again, when you look at the numbers, this player that comes in is probably going to be the second or third highest paid player on this team. And, to me, this isn't a position of strength, because it's a 50-50 proposition on draft picks -- some of them work, some of them don't, history tells us that. Now I know the Patriots have a pretty good history with the draft picks, but I'm just not a fan of these top ten picks."

    ...Now, let's keep in mind Reiss is probably more connected to the Pats, especially Belichick, than any other writer out there. Secondly, I think Reiss' belief (at least partly) that the greatest value in the draft may be in the later part of the first round comes from Belichick's pre-draft press conf conference:

    http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/reiss_pieces/2008/04/belichick_talks.html

     
    Last edited: Apr 20, 2008
  13. mcsully

    mcsully In the Starting Line-Up

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    good find pats1 .. Thanks for the info..


    Still i think there is a chance for the pats to trade down once maybe twice in this draft.. This is a VERY DEEP draft in a lot of areas (rb, OL, LB, DB)
     
  14. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    If he wants to say pick #31 holds more value than pick #7, great, more power to him.

    But to say this :

    makes him a total moron because we can easily trade down to that area and get something even if it's WAY below chart value.
     
  15. PatsWickedPissah

    PatsWickedPissah PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Disable Jersey

    My point from the beginning (and I'm no draftnik) is that Belioli will not be constrained by traditional draft point formulae. They're secure enough in their positions to 'give away' a few points to get the deal they want done. Even Reiss should know this. :p
     
    Last edited: Apr 20, 2008
  16. pats1

    pats1 Moderator PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Well again, I think Reiss is referring to BB's pre-draft press conference:

     
  17. ForThoseAboutToRock

    ForThoseAboutToRock Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    #50 Jersey

    My feeling is that if the 7th pick were taken away last September, we'd have possibly seen a modified approach to free agency since they knew they wouldn't have to plan to bring in a huge top 10 pick type contract. Since they've already done all that planning w.r.t. the cap, I don't think it's fair to say that if they really wanted the value of the 31st pick, they could just trade down. With this in mind, maybe Reiss is correct that, if given the preference of which pick were confiscated back in Sept, the front office would have held onto the late 1st rounder and the flexibility that it allows a team.

    I personally don't think that would be the case, I think Reiss is just on a mini-crusade to explain to casual fans that picking higher isn't necessarily the best thing a team could ask for these days.
     
  18. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    I understand the point he's trying to make and it's valid. But he expressed it REALLY badly; even with the word "almost" in there.
     
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