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Private pay shrinks to historic lows

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by Real World, May 25, 2010.

  1. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    Welcome to the growing welfare state. At some point, the numbers will basically cause this country to crumble. It's simply inevitable at our current pace.


    Private pay shrinks to historic lows

    PAY SCALE

    [​IMG]

    By Dennis Cauchon, USA TODAY

    Paychecks from private business shrank to their smallest share of personal income in U.S. history during the first quarter of this year, a USA TODAY analysis of government data finds. At the same time, government-provided benefits — from Social Security, unemployment insurance, food stamps and other programs — rose to a record high during the first three months of 2010.

    Those records reflect a long-term trend accelerated by the recession and the federal stimulus program to counteract the downturn. The result is a major shift in the source of personal income from private wages to government programs.

    The trend is not sustainable, says University of Michigan economist Donald Grimes. Reason: The federal government depends on private wages to generate income taxes to pay for its ever-more-expensive programs. Government-generated income is taxed at lower rates or not at all, he says. "This is really important," Grimes says.


    Private pay shrinks to historic lows - USATODAY.com
     
  2. apple strudel

    apple strudel Banned

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    Um, that's because of unemployment guys. We lost 8 million jobs and all of those people (even the Republicans!) signed up to get unemployment checks. The statement about sustainability is fatuous because unemployment is finite. Sounds like a pretty lazy analysis that doesn't call out a lot of contributing factors, and the real devil in this story is corporate layoffs. Sigh.
     
  3. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    Reading is fundamental.

    Even if you didn't read the article, the posted chart shows a trend spanning over 10 years time. Were it spanning the last 1, 2, or even 3 years, then I'd lend credence to that which you are saying. However, this is a long term trend bud. One that shows no sign of slowing, as the welfare state continues to grow. Welfare on all levels mind you.
     
  4. apple strudel

    apple strudel Banned

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    The chart is essentially flat from ~2002 to 2007. Then it jumps. The other thing this analysis totally fails at is controlling for social security since boomers are now representing a larger percentage of the population. Of course percentages like this would go up with an older population. It's a crap analysis. :ugh:
     
  5. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign Hall of Fame Poster

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    You're right! And add in the legacy costs of baby-boomers who were employed by the gov't and you have....

    UNSUSTAINABILITY! :ugh:
     
  6. khayos

    khayos In the Starting Line-Up

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    Why is it crap? It clearly demonstrates that government spending is going up and private pay as a percent is going down. That strikes me as a problem if the trend continues.
     
  7. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    The Democrats are counting on climate control and health care reform to jump start the economy by creating new business sectors that, at least initially, should generate a lot of new work and a lot of investment by venture capitalists. This is more or less the same strategy that Kennedy engaged in with NASA, that Reagan engaged in with the defense shield, and that Clinton engaged in with the tech sector. It takes a few years to see if this kind of approach takes hold, so right now I think the administration is in a holding pattern, trying to prop up the economy while these new sectors get underway.
     
  8. apple strudel

    apple strudel Banned

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    Because some idiot in the article said the same thing at the same time pointing out that part of the problem is unemployment insurance which is, by definition, not going to continue for individuals. The only way unemployment insurance remains a problem is if layoffs continue, which the evidence shows is not happening. I'll overlook the part about SS in this post because I already explained that.
     
  9. khayos

    khayos In the Starting Line-Up

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    So you think private pay as a percent will eventually go back up?
     
  10. apple strudel

    apple strudel Banned

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    Almost by definition as unemployment benefits dry up in the short term, and as the boomers start to die in the medium term, and not accounting for new entitlement programs. It might be a legitimate discussion if we were talking about new permanent entitlements like health care, but we're not.
     
  11. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    That chart sure looks flat to me. :rolleyes:
     
  12. apple strudel

    apple strudel Banned

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    Let me help you out, genius. Like I said the chart for gov benefits is essentially flat from 2002 to 2008 (I was wrong about it being 2007). And when did people start losing jobs? Hmm? I'm waiting. What other entitlements did people start receiving en masse in 2008? Hmm? i'm waiting. Here's a crappy graphical aid for the impaired. The red line is perfectly horizontal. The USA Today is stupid, and believing what you read blindly is also stupid.

    [​IMG]
     
  13. Wolfpack

    Wolfpack Banned

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    This is indeed one of the most frightening facts to come down the pike in quite a while. It's no wonder the liberals in here have no clue how serious this is.
     
  14. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

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    No wonder the economy and unemployment are going nowhere. Spain has admitted their 'green economy' obama wants to emulate is a total failure that they are jettisoning.


    Emulate Spain’s Green Economy? No Thanks, Mr. President - Planet Gore - National Review Online



    http://www2.nationalreview.com/dest/2010/05/21/b50ff742eaaae60a7947b5d32d019fad.pdf
     
  15. apple strudel

    apple strudel Banned

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    Librul. Librul. But neither you nor the right-wingers in this forum have shown even basic comprehension of what these numbers mean. Do you really take your posts seriously, or have you managed to perfectly mimic the tone of the brain-dead political poster? I mean, at least that would be interesting. :ugh:
     
  16. khayos

    khayos In the Starting Line-Up

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    Spain. Greece. Portugal. I wonder how their charts line up?
     
  17. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    Apple, this isn't an Obama problem. It's a welfare state problem. This is the result of decades of misguided, unsustainable, penny cheap, dollar foolish, welfare policies. Look around the globe. This is happening all over.
     
  18. apple strudel

    apple strudel Banned

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    Still sounds like a layoffs and unemployment problem to me. We laid of 8 million people and all of them, including the Republicans, took unemployment checks. Actually it sounds like a regulation problem given the causes leading up to the epic bed sh1tting from Wall street.
     
  19. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

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    If it were simply an unemployment, or layoffs problem, then wages wouldn't have declined during the mid-decade boom. Like in the other thread, I see what you're trying to say. In leaner times, each measure used in the chart will move in a negative direction. That the problem compounds when the economy is down. Absolutely. However, the chart shows that even in good times, there is lateral move at best.
     
  20. apple strudel

    apple strudel Banned

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    The slight or gradual decline in the top bar between 2002 and 2008 is due to retirement - not all retirement income is public. Don't forget the baby boomers here. Marketplace was talking about it this evening and they said essentially the same thing, but they also made the same mistake about pretending like it was an ongoing problem, which in my view it isn't necessarily. It's just a reflection of mass layoffs and increasing retirement.
     

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