Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by BadMoFo, May 29, 2008.
I'm sure many here would have flip-flopped the two.
Notice a trend here.....
I think this is the year we will see A.D. blossom in the 2nd year in the "system" ..
Although I like Watson, didn't he only catch 49 balls in 2006 without Welker and Moss? Yeah, he missed three games, but do you really think he would have averaged 7 catches in those games when he only had one game that entire season when he caught 7 balls.
Overrated: Pete Prisco
Underrated: Mike Reiss
I'm so glad that there are writers who can sum up a player's value on a single stat at each position (e.g., # of pass receptions, # of sacks). It is that type of insight that us football fans could never figure out on our own that makes me appreciate writers like Prisco. What would we ever do without him, how would we ever understand this complex game?
To be fair, I don't think anyone here can really say AT gave them what was really expected last year.
Granted, with Colvin going down he had to adapt and still had a solid year, but not the All-Pro performance we would have wanted.
This year though, should be another story.
Prickso's a tool anyway.
He had the two right names but flipped them! Lets be honest: Ben Watson is overrated. He isn't particularly a good blocker and isn't having great wide receivers supposed to get you MORE catches. Honestly, for the offense of the Pats had, Gaffney and Stallworth put up modest stats meaning that really it was only Welker and Moss on the reads consistently above Watson.I mean, come on. Moss takes the safety in a back peddle consistently and Welker demands so much attention - it should be a field day for Ben. Plus, he is on a team that is hucking the ball all over the place in the most proficient offense ever. Passing when their up 4 touches for cyring out loud. Finally, I think Bill came to the same conclusion I am making when he drafted Dave Thomas and Garrett Mills back to back when everyone else thought the Pats needed D (arguably costing him 2 Manning 14 point 4th quarters by the way). Maybe he was indicating something we didn't know? I don't want to be controversial or anything but if they could have picked an off-season ago which first round TE they had under an existing contract in a dream world, we all knew it would have been Daniel.
Watson could be gone tomorrow and Dave Thomas would probably fill those shoes no problem.
Underated... Shalize Manza Young and Mike Reiss..
Speaking of overrated.....in SB 36, didn't several Rams say, " Tom Brady....... overrated"?
100% agree. Watson seems to be that player that always seem to almost make the big play, but rarely does. Very frustrating.
AT on the other hand had a very good year considering all the things they asked him to do. I think all that work and learning will play big dividends this year.
I have an issue with this statement as if you are a OLB in a 3-4 your success is measured by qb pressure and sacks and in as ILB by yrds per game .
so you says he did not deliver yet do not explain that when he was inside pats run defence was giving 83 yds/game and moving him outside resulted in 113 yds/game.
could you please explain how his inside presence or absence did not contributed to this.
I have a soft spot for Watson, because of that one play in Denver in 2006... even though it didn't go our way, it was one of the most satisfying hussle play body slams I've ever seen!
But overall, I agree, I always expect more from him. I think maybe though, Welker takes some of the typical "TE" catches away from him. With a top flight WR pulling the coverage deep, usually the TE is open underneath, but this past year it was Welker almost every time.
Whatever. THere was nothing in the statement you quoted about how to measure success. Those are your own misguided measuring sticks. The poster said Thomas did not perform as expected.
And he didn't. Not even close. Thomas was supposed to be the best FA available, and we were overjoyed that we got him. Except for a great play against the Chargers, he did not live up to the $$$ we spent on him.
I'm hoping he will do better this year, but so far we might as well have had Monty Beisel out there and Thomas.
Wow. Thomas performance last year was equivalent to Monty Beisel in your mind.
That is the most ridiculous thing I've ever seen posted on this board which is saying a lot.
The problem with talking heads evaluating Watson is they have that same soft spot for the same reason. They can't imagine how someone athletic enough to catch Bailey coming across the field for 98 yards hasn't had more of an impact as a TE. What they fail to account for is the pressure that led to that pick was the result of a missed block by the same TE. Early on we saw him run over coverage after making a catch. Saw less and less of that as he was coached to do what is fully expected of a TE in this offense - pick up the block and run precise sight adjusted routes. He still has to think too much about what he's being asked to do here. Some guys can't play to their potential if they have to think about what they are doing as they do it as opposed to it becomes instinctive.
I am open to new ideas so can you explain why i am wrong and how you measure the success of a OLB and ILB . i would like your opinion so maybe i can clear my misconceptions.
I assumed as he played the strong side ILB his responsiblity might have been to collaspe the pocket by taking gaurd and clogging the running on the strong side along with vince wilfork. I might be wrong completly .maybe my assumption are wrong but i saw him collapse the pocket with great success .he playing the strong side was effective enough to prevent extra help on the weak side of the OL leading single gaurd play on ty warren and to vrabel effectiveness. when he got moved out brushi moved to the strong side and was a less effective as he is not a strong side lb and as the gaurd can handle him reducing the effectiveness of the wilfork and hence strengthing the weak side of the OL leading to vrabel sack numbers go down.
again, i might be totally wrong and am open to your thoughts.
Kind of depends on who is the we doing the assessments. He may not have done what fans and talking heads expected, but then they would not have had him inside for most of the season, either. I think that is what Bill envisioned him doing, or at least developing the ability to do last season even after sustaining a foot injury, and he wasn't signed to play OLB, although he now may well.
Excessively lauding or critiquing players absent actual knowledge of what the organization's expectations of them were based on actual scheme assignments is something of a fool's passtime. Personally I would prefer to see them assemble a higher functioning OL than continue to try and pound square peg TE's into round holes. Ditto converting FA's to suit the scheme as opposed to signing guys who only need to learn the system and not a new position to boot. But I also realize the guy making those decisions has 5 rings to my none, not to mention yours and Prisco's.
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