Possible movement in negotiations?

[BlueThunder]

:rocker::rocker:

I think the outburst by Moss after the game 1 win had a huge factor in the lack of an uproar when he was dealt.

I Agree with the above .:rocker:

 

[TruthSeeker]

If you'd like to assume that Snyder just a reckless fan trying to buy a championship, it's not surprising. I'll go with the more rational assumption; that a savy business man who is raking in the dough in the NFL is simply being a savy business man.

Since when did Snyder become a savvy NFL businessman? Certainly his team has not had much in the way of success on the field since he took over.

The Redskins have been an extremely popular franchise for decades. I think that they'd still be popular if Snyder didn't throw huge signing bonuses at underperforming players. But maybe that's just me.

 

[Rob0729]

Since when did Snyder become a savvy NFL businessman? Certainly his team has not had much in the way of success on the field since he took over.

The Redskins have been an extremely popular franchise for decades. I think that they'd still be popular if Snyder didn't throw huge signing bonuses at underperforming players. But maybe that's just me.

Snyder is a savvy NFL businessman. No one including Kraft or Jerry Jones have created more marketing opportunities for their teams than Snyder. Snyder does benefit from having the largest stadium in the league by 10,000 seats which was built before he bought the team, but he does do a great job marketing.

He is a horrible player/personnel guy and GM though. He deals with that portion like a fan. He chased Steve Spurrier because he was a hot commodity eventhough most football people knew that the Fun and Gun offense wouldn't work in the NFL. He hired Gibbs because he watched Gibbs win four Super Bowls as a teenager and young adult rooting for the Skins. He goes after flashy high ticket free agents because he has the money and he has a fantasy football mentality towards the game. He also didn't ever have a draft pick he wouldn't love to trade away either.

I think Snyder should have done from the beginning what he did last year - hire a proven player/personnel guy like Bruce Allen and proven coach like Mike Shanahan (although I wouldn't have chosen Shanahan personally and would have pushed for either Cowher or Gruden). I think with Allen calling the shots, the Redskins finally have a chance to make smart personne;l decisions.

As I said in a previous post, Kraft learned the lesson more than a decade ago letting the football guys make the personnel decisions and he and his son make the business decisions. It looks like it took Snyder a decade to figure it out, but he may just have. I wonder if Jerry Jones will ever learn that lesson? I guess his luck early in his ownership (the ridiculous Walker trade) has clouded his mind to think he is a great personnel guy.

 

[Deus Irae]

Not sure what other venue is in Washington that would draw sporting fans....
He may be making money in spite of himself....:bricks:

Well, the Nationals of MLB and the Capitals of the NHL would be two examples of teams with other sports venues to draw in the fans.

 

[Rob0729]

Well, the Nationals of MLB and the Capitals of the NHL would be two examples of teams with other sports venues to draw in the fans.

There's the Washington Wizards too, but the Redskins are and have been the clear #1 team in that area forever. It is kinda like the Sox in this area before the Brady/Belichick era.

 

[BlueThunder]

yeah...those Nationals are really big draws.....


Like Boston's Celtics and Sox ....


Boston has been a 4 sport town for quite a while.......but I'll agree that the Pats were doormats for awhile....and I had to endure blackouts and listen to games on the radio....

Someone here just loves controversy...and he'll google his butt off to make others look less intelligent than him.......

 

[Deus Irae]

There's the Washington Wizards too, but the Redskins are and have been the clear #1 team in that area forever. It is kinda like the Sox in this area before the Brady/Belichick era.

Doesn't the D.C. area also have a soccer team?

 

[PATSNUTme]

And this little tidbit about an 8 game season.

Report: The NFL is making plans for a regular season as short as eight games - NFL News | FOX Sports on MSN

If this happens I'm going to be royally pissed. I plan to protest by watching all non Patriots games with a patch over one eye.

 

[townes]

And this little tidbit about an 8 game season.

Report: The NFL is making plans for a regular season as short as eight games - NFL News | FOX Sports on MSN

If this happens I'm going to be royally pissed. I plan to protest by watching all non Patriots games with a patch over one eye.

I was planning on buying a nice new flat screen for the comiong season but I don't know if i can even watch an 8 game season and wonder if it will kill my desire to continue following football altogether, and that's coming from someone who schedules work around Patriot games.


As difficult as it is for me to imagine the NFL killing my interest in football that kind of lost season may be enough to do it. If this were the case i think that actually extending the season into April/May would be a better resolution than simply killing off those games, and given their control over the stadiums they play in i really don't see why that couldn't be accomplished. Better to have a full season and truncated offseason next year than to simply wipe away 8 games, which would make this season completely pointless and worthless. I really don't care who wins a half season.

 

[willard]

I was planning on buying a nice new flat screen for the comiong season but I don't know if i can even watch an 8 game season and wonder if it will kill my desire to continue following football altogether, and that's coming from someone who schedules work around Patriot games.


As difficult as it is for me to imagine the NFL killing my interest in football that kind of lost season may be enough to do it. If this were the case i think that actually extending the season into April/May would be a better resolution than simply killing off those games, and given their control over the stadiums they play in i really don't see why that couldn't be accomplished. Better to have a full season and truncated offseason next year than to simply wipe away 8 games, which would make this season completely pointless and worthless. I really don't care who wins a half season.

Does the scheduling of the Super Bowl determine the end of the season?

 

[PatsFanSince74]

And this little tidbit about an 8 game season.

Report: The NFL is making plans for a regular season as short as eight games - NFL News | FOX Sports on MSN

If this happens I'm going to be royally pissed. I plan to protest by watching all non Patriots games with a patch over one eye.

Joe Gibbs went to the HOF in part on the strength of a Lombardi that was won after a nine game season. Let's face it, if they play a shortened season they'll still be giving away the bling in February. I'd just as soon see the Pats win it as anyone else.

 

[Ring 6]

It should have declined dramatically, considering the team's actual performance. Their stadium should be almost empty on Sundays. Unfortunately, the sheep are too enamored with all the shiney, big-name players and keep buying tickets and Redskins merchandise. How many other teams that have sniffed a superbowl in almost 20 years are in the top 10 list of NFL earners?

The Redskins have a long and storied history. That history, like the Steelers started as a complete doormat. As of the late 60s the Redskins and Steelers were 2 of, it not THE 2 least successful franchises on the field.
However, both built huge and loyal fanbases. The Redskins controlled a huge area of the country as the 'local' team in the early years of the league.
Fan bases in the NFL tendto be built by 2 factors. 1) Who is your local team and 2) Who does your father root for.
There are generations and generations of Redskins fans. There are probably more fans who 'inherited' their fanship from Skins fans that were fans before the Bucaneers were even a team than there are Bucaneer fans.
A few years of medicority isnt driving loyal fans away, and a few big names signings isnt bringing enough in to make much of a difference.

 

[NEGoldenAge]

The Redskins have a long and storied history. That history, like the Steelers started as a complete doormat. As of the late 60s the Redskins and Steelers were 2 of, it not THE 2 least successful franchises on the field.
However, both built huge and loyal fanbases. The Redskins controlled a huge area of the country as the 'local' team in the early years of the league.
Fan bases in the NFL tendto be built by 2 factors. 1) Who is your local team and 2) Who does your father root for.
There are generations and generations of Redskins fans. There are probably more fans who 'inherited' their fanship from Skins fans that were fans before the Bucaneers were even a team than there are Bucaneer fans.
A few years of medicority isnt driving loyal fans away, and a few big names signings isnt bringing enough in to make much of a difference.

Twenty years is a lot more than a few years. Back then, the 49ers had a massive fan base too . Winning certainly draws many fans, but so does signing big names. If you do neither, you start shedding fans. Its OK that some people don't believe that

 

[Wolfpack]

I was planning on buying a nice new flat screen for the comiong season but I don't know if i can even watch an 8 game season and wonder if it will kill my desire to continue following football altogether, and that's coming from someone who schedules work around Patriot games.


As difficult as it is for me to imagine the NFL killing my interest in football that kind of lost season may be enough to do it. If this were the case i think that actually extending the season into April/May would be a better resolution than simply killing off those games, and given their control over the stadiums they play in i really don't see why that couldn't be accomplished. Better to have a full season and truncated offseason next year than to simply wipe away 8 games, which would make this season completely pointless and worthless. I really don't care who wins a half season.

+1. I just don't see myself watching NFL football if the season doesn't even start until late October or early November.

 

[Rob0729]

Twenty years is a lot more than a few years. Back then, the 49ers had a massive fan base too . Winning certainly draws many fans, but so does signing big names. If you do neither, you start shedding fans. Its OK that some people don't believe that

Singing big names without winning (or more importantly success with these big names panning out) is a very short term fix. I'm sure Redskins fans are buying season tickets this year because the Redskins signed Haynesworth two years ago and eventhough he has been a bust and malcontent in DC he was an expensive high priced free agent.

Seriously, go to the Redskins boards and you will see than a large portion of the Redskins fanbase thinks Snyder is the AntiChrist and wish Jack Kent Cooke could come back from the grave and kill him and take over the team again. The Redskins fans haven't bought into the getting high priced free agents for years because they have over a decade of evidence that it doesn't work while teams that rarely if ever go the high priced free agent route have multiple rings (The Pats with three, the Steelers with two, Green Bay with one, and the Colts with one all of which almost never get marquee free agents).

You can keep on saying big name free agents is a good business strategy for Snyder, but you have provided no evidence that it does. In fact evidence shows it doesn't since Snyder is immensely unpopular in the DC area.

Why is Dan Snyder So Reviled? - Monte Burke - The Owner

And as for the 49ers, they are an unique situation. Californians are fairweather fans and the 49er fanbase has never been all that loyal. You look at most Californian teams and they are only popular when they are winning. Too much of a transient population. And the bay area is already divided between 49ers and Raiders fans.

The fact of the matter is the Redskins fans are sick of losing. Any big name free agent they sign now, Redskins fans assume will be a bust and a waste of money. They think Snyder is an incompetent idiot. You keep on buying Ferraris and their engines always explode after the first 100 miles, and you get sick of owning Ferraris pretty fast. Allen built the Raiders' team of the early 2000s based mostly on low priced free agents and developed talent. When he came to Tampa, he let high priced guys like Warren Sapp and John Lynch go and developed guys. Granted Allen isn't the best GM out there, but far better than Snyder and Vinny Cerrato.

They are loyal to the team, but tired of Snyder and his act. That is probably why after a decade, he finally hired a competent GM to run the personnel. Ironically, this GM is against signing high priced free agents and more in favor of developing talent.

 

[Ring 6]

Twenty years is a lot more than a few years. Back then, the 49ers had a massive fan base too . Winning certainly draws many fans, but so does signing big names. If you do neither, you start shedding fans. Its OK that some people don't believe that

You are confusing how often they are on TV, and how invovled and excited their fan base is with the size of the fan base.
The 49ers don't compare to the Redskins in historical fan base size. Fans, particularly those that spend, are lifelong fans.

 

[NEGoldenAge]

You are confusing how often they are on TV, and how invovled and excited their fan base is with the size of the fan base.
The 49ers don't compare to the Redskins in historical fan base size. Fans, particularly those that spend, are lifelong fans.

Niners used to be huge, whether you wish to acknowledge it or not. If we can't agree on the facts, we really can't have a meaningful conversation on the subject.

 

[italia44]

Singing big names without winning (or more importantly success with these big names panning out) is a very short term fix. I'm sure Redskins fans are buying season tickets this year because the Redskins signed Haynesworth two years ago and eventhough he has been a bust and malcontent in DC he was an expensive high priced free agent.

Seriously, go to the Redskins boards and you will see than a large portion of the Redskins fanbase thinks Snyder is the AntiChrist and wish Jack Kent Cooke could come back from the grave and kill him and take over the team again. The Redskins fans haven't bought into the getting high priced free agents for years because they have over a decade of evidence that it doesn't work while teams that rarely if ever go the high priced free agent route have multiple rings (The Pats with three, the Steelers with two, Green Bay with one, and the Colts with one all of which almost never get marquee free agents).

You can keep on saying big name free agents is a good business strategy for Snyder, but you have provided no evidence that it does. In fact evidence shows it doesn't since Snyder is immensely unpopular in the DC area.

Why is Dan Snyder So Reviled? - Monte Burke - The Owner

And as for the 49ers, they are an unique situation. Californians are fairweather fans and the 49er fanbase has never been all that loyal. You look at most Californian teams and they are only popular when they are winning. Too much of a transient population. And the bay area is already divided between 49ers and Raiders fans.

The fact of the matter is the Redskins fans are sick of losing. Any big name free agent they sign now, Redskins fans assume will be a bust and a waste of money. They think Snyder is an incompetent idiot. You keep on buying Ferraris and their engines always explode after the first 100 miles, and you get sick of owning Ferraris pretty fast. Allen built the Raiders' team of the early 2000s based mostly on low priced free agents and developed talent. When he came to Tampa, he let high priced guys like Warren Sapp and John Lynch go and developed guys. Granted Allen isn't the best GM out there, but far better than Snyder and Vinny Cerrato.

They are loyal to the team, but tired of Snyder and his act. That is probably why after a decade, he finally hired a competent GM to run the personnel. Ironically, this GM is against signing high priced free agents and more in favor of developing talent.

6 paragraphs of concise,logical,gold:rocker:

 

[mgcolby]

It should have declined dramatically, considering the team's actual performance. Their stadium should be almost empty on Sundays. Unfortunately, the sheep are too enamored with all the shiney, big-name players and keep buying tickets and Redskins merchandise. How many other teams that have sniffed a superbowl in almost 20 years are in the top 10 list of NFL earners?

I have not met a single Redskins fan that is happy with Snyder, nor have I met a single Redskins fan that is enamored with the shiney, big name players. Every one of them is sick of the dog and pony show. They keep buying tickets because they love their team. I realize that by doing that they don't prove anything to management. But I do know their ticket sales are down, their 100,000+ waiting list is a joke. I signed up for it just to ask a question, I was on the list for two seasons before I was offered regular seats.

In addition I was at FedEx Saturday night and they removed a huge (50% or better) section of seats in the upper deck of an End Zone.

 

[Ring 6]

Niners used to be huge, whether you wish to acknowledge it or not. If we can't agree on the facts, we really can't have a meaningful conversation on the subject.

I agree, so you should recognize the facts.
Its not a matter of acknowledging your opinion, its a matter that your impression does not apply here, the facts are that the Redskins have a much larger, and more loyal fan base. Perhaps the bandwagon in SF clouds your perspective, but to compare the staunch fan bases of the Redskins and 49ers and pretend they are even close to the same thing is foolish.