Poll: Is Gronk already at Tony Gonzalez level?

[Haley]

I think there is no question that if Gronk can figure out how to make it out onto the field for most games he will easily surpass every TE to have ever played the game in likely every facet. However, he still has to prove he can get out onto the field for the majority of games, particularly playoffs. Personally, I don't like to check off a box until the task is complete. All Gronk needs to pass is an attendance test to become the GOAT but in my mind, he still needs to pass that test. I mean what would happen if he stopped playing football tomorrow and never came back? Would he still be better than Tony G? In my mind he would not be, so I think the jury is still out until he gets those attendance checkmarks and gold stars.

 

[Rob0729]

When healthy, Gronk is the greatest TE in history hands down. He is far more complete than Gonzalez (far better blocker). He is uncoverable which Gonzalez, as good he was, could be covered at least at times.

My only fear is he could be like Terrell Davis who might have made an argument to be considered the greatest RB of all time if not for injuries destroying his career. If Gronk can stay healthy, he will be considered the greatest TE in league history with #2 not even close.

 

[Rob0729]

Gronk to me is a hyper-athletic version of Mark Bavaro in the sense that he is the best at his position in the league in both requirements of playing it. Gonzales was a great receiver but he played the game like a basketball player, not a football player. I think Jimmy Graham is a more apt comparison to Gonzales but I totally get where you're going.

If Gronk can have longevity he will be to tight end what LT was to outside linebacker.

Gonzalez did lead the way for the more receiver type TEs (Gates is in that group too), but he was a far better blocker than Jimmy Graham. Graham really brought that type of TE to the extreme where he is just a really big WR who plays the TE role.

 

[Jackson 2]

I don't know if Gronk catches Gonzalez, because of health reasons, but skills yea he's by far the best TE on the planet.

I cringe when people try to argue Jimmy Graham, almost the same way when the Brady- Manning argument comes up. No...just no..

Agreed. Not to denigrate Graham, who is an excellent receiver, but he's not Gronk by a long shot. He doesn't block like Gronk, his catch radius, while abnormally large, isn't as large as Gronk's and at times he's been shut down by one guy (see Talib.). To my knowledge, that's never happened to Gronk.

 

[stinkypete]

Gronk is, when healthy, the greatest TE who has ever played the game. He is the most physically dominant receiving TE the game has ever seen and an elite run blocker. Health and longevity are irrelevant here.

There is a short list of non-QBs who, for short periods of time, have singlehandedly dominated all competition to the point where the competition seemed laughable. Recent examples: Megatron, JJ Watt, peak Revis, Ed Reed, Ray Lewis and Troy Polomalu in their primes, Randy Moss in '98 and '07, Barry Sanders.

Gronk in 2011 form is as devastating a football player as anyone on this list, and he appears to be near full powers.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

Would Gronk make the HOF today if he retired? Probably not. I don't think the numbers are quite there yet. Tony Gonzalez is going to be in HOF, however. If gronk stays healthy and he is fortunate enough work with strong QBs for the rest of his career after Brady, he is a shoo in for canton. Ability and skill-wise, gronk > gonzalez.

 

[SalemPats]

Tony G was incredible. But, Gronk is a different animal. He's a freak.

 

[primetime]

Gonzalez did lead the way for the more receiver type TEs (Gates is in that group too), but he was a far better blocker than Jimmy Graham. Graham really brought that type of TE to the extreme where he is just a really big WR who plays the TE role.

Not sure it was Gonzalez. Sharpe and Coates came before him, and both of them were superior receivers and mediocre blockers, whereas most tight ends were superior blockers and mediocre receivers. Gonzalez, like Gronk, was the best receiving and blocking tight end in the league in his prime. Gates started off as a Graham-type who couldn't block but learned to block as his career went on and is now one of the better blocking tight ends in the league.

 

[Ring 6]

Bavaro didn't have a great QB throwing him the ball and was always injured. Belichick says he should be in the HOF. Injuries really derailed him.

You are what you are regardless of who is throwing you the ball. Your argument seems to be saying its a statistical comparison, which wasn't my point, but statistically they are miles apart.
This idea that you can't catch a pass unless the goat throws it is silly. Simms is borderline HOF.

As far as always injured, well, no. He played 6 years with the Giants, and did not miss a game the first 4. He missed 9 in year 5 and 1 in year 6. That is basically one injury.
He went on to play 16, 16 and 12 his final 3 non-Giant years.

There is just no comparison at all of Bavaro to Gronk as a receiver. Its about the same as Frank Gore to Jim Brown.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

You are what you are regardless of who is throwing you the ball. Your argument seems to be saying its a statistical comparison, which wasn't my point, but statistically they are miles apart.
This idea that you can't catch a pass unless the goat throws it is silly. Simms is borderline HOF.

As far as always injured, well, no. He played 6 years with the Giants, and did not miss a game the first 4. He missed 9 in year 5 and 1 in year 6. That is basically one injury.
He went on to play 16, 16 and 12 his final 3 non-Giant years.

There is just no comparison at all of Bavaro to Gronk as a receiver. Its about the same as Frank Gore to Jim Brown.

I never compared Bavaro's catching ability to Gronk's. I said both are as COMPLETE a TE as I ever saw. Belichick who witnessed both players says the same thing about Bavaro.

http://itiswhatitis.weei.com/sports...ll-belichick-thinks-the-world-of-mark-bavaro/

Bavaro also played in a different era, an era where teams ran the ball more than they do today. The fact that bavaro didn't miss any games doesn't mean he wasn't injured. This was a guy who broke his jaw, got wired up and contnued to play in the same game. You wouldn't see that in today's NFL.

 

[primetime]

Simms is borderline HOF.

That's a stretch. He was above average for a long time but certainly not a Hall of Famer.

 

[Ring 6]

I never compared Bavaro's catching ability to Gronk's. I said both are as COMPLETE a TE as I ever saw. Belichick who witnessed both players says the same thing about Bavaro.

http://itiswhatitis.weei.com/sports...ll-belichick-thinks-the-world-of-mark-bavaro/

Bavaro also played in a different era, an era where teams ran the ball more than they do today. The fact that bavaro didn't miss any games doesn't mean he wasn't injured. This was a guy who broke his jaw, got wired up and contnued to play in the same game. You wouldn't see that in today's NFL.

Then why are you arguing? If you agree he does not compare to Gronk as a receiver then we agree, and therefore there would be no reason to blame his QB or the era, as if you are saying he is.

 

[Ring 6]

That's a stretch. He was above average for a long time but certainly not a Hall of Famer.

Borderline. Hell Warren Moon is in.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

Then why are you arguing? If you agree he does not compare to Gronk as a receiver then we agree, and therefore there would be no reason to blame his QB or the era, as if you are saying he is.

You were the one who disagreed with me. I said gronk and Bavaro are complete TEs. You argued with me by responding that Gronk is the better receiver.

 

[Ring 6]

You were the one who disagreed with me. I said gronk and Bavaro are complete TEs. You argued with me by responding that Gronk is the better receiver.

No you said Bavaro and Gronk we alike, and I pointed out that Gronk is a far superior receiver.
That isn't arguing.
Do you disagree?

 

[SHOWTIME15]

No you said Bavaro and Gronk we alike, and I pointed out that Gronk is a far superior receiver.
That isn't arguing.
Do you disagree?

I agree that Gronk is the better receiver. I think I was pointing out, however, that it is difficult to compare stats across eras. No question Gronk is playing in a more pass-friendly era with a superior QB. My point was they Gronk is as complete a TE since bavaro. Gronk may be the better receiver, but Bavaro the better blocker.

 

[Ring 6]

I agree that Gronk is the better receiver. I think I was pointing out, however, that it is difficult to compare stats across eras. No question Gronk is playing in a more pass-friendly era with a superior QB. My point was they Gronk is as complete a TE since bavaro. Gronk may be the better receiver, but Bavaro the better blocker.

But I am not comparing stats, I am comparing players. You agree, yet seem to want to argue still.
I do not agree that Bavaro was a better blocker.

I do agree that Bavaro was a complete TE and one of the best of his era.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Gronk is already better than Gonzalez. I doubt he'll have Gonzalez' longevity, but right now he's without a doubt better than Gonzalez was at any point in his career.

 

[PatsFanSince74]

My thoughts:
Gronk is the best TE in the NFL today and, if he stays healthy, should be on the short list for MVP for 2014, but we can't compare him to Gonzalez at this point. From 1998 until he retired, Gonzalez started all but two games his teams played (16 starts in all but two of 16 seasons, when he started in 15), putting up consistently strong to great numbers. Gronk has only started all 16 games once and has played 26 games since 2012. So, "hopefully in the future" is my answer.

Anybody that BB says belongs in Canton has to be great, but Bavaro had injury issues too. That said, I'd take Gronkowski over him without a doubt.

 

[Wheelman]

I cringe when people try to argue Jimmy Graham, almost the same way when the Brady- Manning argument comes up. No...just no..

I feel the exact the same way! Everytime I hear someone praise another tight end I ask, Can he block? This is what make Gronk so elite. A true tight end is an elite player like Gronk. Anyone who can't do both at a good level is either a glorified blocker or a glorified receiver.