Welcome to PatsFans.com

Pimple or person? Person or pimple?

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by Real World, Nov 25, 2006.

  1. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2006
    Messages:
    27,344
    Likes Received:
    302
    Ratings:
    +817 / 7 / -2

    Before I make my point, let me first say that I in no way mean to be insensitive to the lost baby. Now to my point...

    Hmmm....wait a minute, so it's a person then, or is it a pimple? What I can't understand about this Banana Republic is that we permit the termination of unborn children as a convenience, while not citing it murder, yet, when the same unborn child is slain, it's considered murder. Is it me, or is there something kinda wrong going on here? Hmmm.....


    Unborn baby among three Mass. holiday road fatalities

    By Steven Ryan and Tyler B. Reed/ Boston Herald/Metrowest Daily News
    Saturday, November 25, 2006

    A Framingham man faces motor vehicle homicide charges in a Sherborn crash that killed an unborn baby.

    Alessandro Verli, 32, faces charges of motor vehicle homicide, operating to endanger and failure to keep right in the Wednesday afternoon accident, said Kate Norton, spokeswoman for the Middlesex District Attorney’s Office. Verli hit a car driven by a woman who was 8months pregnant, killing the unborn baby, police said.

    “She lost the baby as a result of the accident,†Norton said. She would not release the name of the female driver.


    http://news.bostonherald.com/localRegional/view.bg?articleid=168936
     
  2. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2005
    Messages:
    25,329
    Likes Received:
    135
    Ratings:
    +356 / 9 / -13

    Bingo, if the same baby is murdered in a doctors office with a Partial Borth Abortion it is a choice, to the same state, madness.
     
  3. sdaniels7114

    sdaniels7114 Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2006
    Messages:
    5,738
    Likes Received:
    7
    Ratings:
    +7 / 0 / -0

    MA law doesn't permit Abortion on demand at 8 months. Only health exceptions are allowed after the fetus becomes viable and that happened to this child way before the accident. Exactly 8 months pregnant is like 2 weeks short of the due date. I don't think that's even considered pre-mature.
     
  4. QuiGon

    QuiGon Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2006
    Messages:
    6,123
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    It is one of the dirty little secrets of the pro-abortion movement... they are terrified of any sort of legal recognition to unborn children - even unborn children of planned and wanted pregnancies. For example, they vehemently oppose any sort of criminal prosecution for manslaughter or murder when a pregnant woman is assaulted and loses her baby.
     
  5. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2005
    Messages:
    41,150
    Likes Received:
    250
    Ratings:
    +967 / 2 / -9

    In the housing projects of Chicago & Detroit if they can't find a "butcher doctor" to abort them in eight months then they give birth and throw the baby in a dumpster. It isn't politically correct to make a big deal out of this though so it's usually buried on page 387 of the dailey paper.

    Many laws in America and even the Constitution need changing, the founding fathers who wrote the constitution could never in their wildest dreams envision the f-cking zoo that we now call America.
     
  6. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2005
    Messages:
    25,329
    Likes Received:
    135
    Ratings:
    +356 / 9 / -13


    How does one define 'health of the mother'. maybe mom is depressed and her doctor decides the remedy is an abortion?

    What about 7 month old viable babies?
     
  7. wistahpatsfan

    wistahpatsfan Pro Bowl Player

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2005
    Messages:
    15,626
    Likes Received:
    11
    Ratings:
    +13 / 0 / -1

    #75 Jersey

    Personally, I think it's wrong to have an abortion. I also think it's wrong to keep kids indoors or under adult supervision at all times. Neither view reflects the reality of today's cultural viewpoint. Abortion is real and people's fears that there's a kidnapper around every corner is real (even if it's unfounded). If I let my kids roam the neighborhood all day long all weekend long, I'm considered irresponsible, even though that's how it was in the 70's. As I get older, I realize that no matter how much you want to, you can't turn back time and some things you have to accept - like football games that end at midnight and abortion.
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2006
  8. sdaniels7114

    sdaniels7114 Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2006
    Messages:
    5,738
    Likes Received:
    7
    Ratings:
    +7 / 0 / -0

    http://www.mass.gov/legis/laws/mgl/112-12m.htm

    What the link says:

    "Chapter 112: Section 12M. Abortion; pregnancy existing for 24 weeks or more

    Section 12M. If a pregnancy has existed for twenty-four weeks or more, no abortion may be performed except by a physician and only if it is necessary to save the life of the mother, or if a continuation of her pregnancy will impose on her a substantial risk of grave impairment of her physical or mental health."

    40 states have a law similar to this. The range of when viability occurs runs from 20 to 27 weeks, or always well before the 8th month. You'll have to look at the case law to understand exactly what "grave impairment" means; but something tells me that being really bummed out doesn't meet the standard. Anyway this thread was started on the premise that the deceased baby could have been aborted without violating the law if the mother wanted it so and that just isn't true.
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2006
  9. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2006
    Messages:
    27,344
    Likes Received:
    302
    Ratings:
    +817 / 7 / -2

    So then it's a person at & after 24 weeks, but it's a pimple before that? I just want to make sure I understand is all.
     
  10. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    18,711
    Likes Received:
    258
    Ratings:
    +467 / 18 / -17

    You should try to get some perspective on how women who have had abortions regard the fetus. To refer to it as a pimple sounds like nothing more than a rant by an insensitive clod. You ought to realize that for the overwhelming majority of women who've had abortions, the decision did not come easily. Try to picture a situation that could happen to you where you'd be confronted by two very difficult moral choices. Do you think there's always a clearly correct answer?
     
  11. Holy Diver

    Holy Diver Pro Bowl Player

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    10,834
    Likes Received:
    15
    Ratings:
    +23 / 0 / -0

    #80 Jersey

    I believe its a crime because she was planning on HAVING the baby.

    now...

    You might have a point if she was hit on her way to the abortion clinic to have the fetus removed.
     
  12. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2005
    Messages:
    41,150
    Likes Received:
    250
    Ratings:
    +967 / 2 / -9

    The world should go to work on PREVENTING PREGNANCY then there would be no need for abortion.

    If Preventing Pregnancy should ever really get to be a major factor throughout the world and the Catholic Church and other religions objected to it, they should all be politely but firmly told to mind their own
    f-cking business and stay out of peoples personal lives.

    If something isn't done to slow the population growth housing projects will soon be going up in Yellowstone National Park.

    If some "whackos" are to stupid to use the new birth control they should be sterilized.
    :bricks:
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2006
  13. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2006
    Messages:
    27,344
    Likes Received:
    302
    Ratings:
    +817 / 7 / -2


    ROFL!

    Everyone knows my stand on abortion. Incase some of you do not, this is it.

    Abortion = murder. Pretty simple. Abortion is legal via Roe V. Wade, and is an extremely controvertial issue in this country. I am not a pro-life flag waver. I do not vote along the lines of a candidates abortion position. I beleive that in extreme cases abortion is clearly warranted, i.e. raped, incest, medical complications, etc. I am not supportive of any measures that would exclude these instances from being a legitimate. I value life. I do not believe in murder for convenience. I do believe in individual accountability. Abortion is not a "right" or "choice" arguement for me. It is murder for convenience. Those who do not want the baby, should give it up for adoption, or should use their brains before fukcing.

    As for being more "understanding" of the poor women who just shop-vac'd her baby, how about you being more understanding of the dead babies life? I would certainly feel compassion for a would be mom who had to choose an abortion for any of the reasons I mentioned above. However, I refuse to feel sorrow for some bimbo who slept with some random man, got pregnant, and decided to flush the baby down the proverbial toilet cuz she didn't want it. Sorry, but people in such a postion deserve criticism, not compassion. I found it funny how some people, including yourself, were upset that the discarded fetuses were tossed in the trash in Brittain. Typical.

    I posted this article because I was curious to see how people would reply, and also wanted to gain some perspective about the law itself. To me, it seems a tad inconsistent to call an unborn child a person, yet to then permit this "persons" murder via abortion. If some of you feel that an unborn is a person at a specific point in the pregnancy, then I'd like to hear when the deadline is. Maybe some of you feel as if it is only a child if it's a "wanted" pregnancy. I would be supportive of such laws that protect the unborns lives when a crime is committed, it's just that doing so seems hypocritical when the same unborn child can be killed at will legally.
     
  14. Holy Diver

    Holy Diver Pro Bowl Player

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    10,834
    Likes Received:
    15
    Ratings:
    +23 / 0 / -0

    #80 Jersey

    not quite true:

    the United States is now the only industrialized country in the world with a fertility rate at or above replacement level (the 2.1 births per women per lifetime required for population stability). Fertility rates in less developed countries have dropped dramatically over the last 40 years and now average 3.6 children, compared with only 1.6 in more developed countries. In fact, there are already 21 less developed nations that have fertility rates below replacement level, including Mexico, China and Thailand. Several others' rates have fallen rapidly to near replacement level and continue to drop: Brazil, from 6.25 to 2.25; Turkey, from 6.9 to 2.2; Tunisia, from 7.2 to 2.3; Indonesia, from 5.6 to 2.7.
     
  15. Real World

    Real World Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2006
    Messages:
    27,344
    Likes Received:
    302
    Ratings:
    +817 / 7 / -2

    I wish that the repurcussion of getting an abortion was the subsequent inability to ever have children again. I can guarantee you that if that were the case, no one would get an abortion, and condom sales would go up 10 fold.
     
  16. sdaniels7114

    sdaniels7114 Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2006
    Messages:
    5,738
    Likes Received:
    7
    Ratings:
    +7 / 0 / -0

    I saw on the Colbert Report that scientists are getting close to being able to transplant a womb. Not just from woman to woman but even from women to men:eek: Yes, very soon men will be able to get pregnant and give birth. He didn't say specifically, but I'm pretty sure a C section is the only way out.

    Seriously, my man Stephen would never lie to me:D

    Once that procedure is mastered a lot of people are gonna have to put up or shut up.
     
  17. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2005
    Messages:
    41,150
    Likes Received:
    250
    Ratings:
    +967 / 2 / -9

    Imagine Uncle Teddy being pregnant with Michael (Tub Of Sh!t) Moore's kid.

    Close your eyes then picture Michael Moore and Uncle Teddy having sex in a hot tub. :singing: :singing:
     

Share This Page

unset ($sidebar_block_show); ?>