Pats workout Gohlston

[Keegs]

Sometimes I wonder if there really is a draft talk forum:

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england-patriots/messageboard/showthread.php?t=79879

I was wondering the same thing. I just clicked that link and it worked.

so don't worry... there is a draft forum.

 

[Nitro]

Gholston is GONE by pick 7 - In fact several mocks have him going #1 to Miami

I've never seen one of those wrong.. ever.

 

[Seneschal2]

Ahhhh - just love the forum police.

Get a grip - as we get close to draft day, no reason draft posts cannot be in here.

Listen up tough guy. I have no real issue with the OP at all. If anyone wants to post draft-related topics in the main forum -- that's fine by me. As far as I'm concerned, the more participation on draft topics the better. However, proper board etiquette is to check to see if a topic has already been posted before you start any thread -- hence my post. There is a draft forum, where this topic was posted much earlier. Not really that important for you fgssand, to become involved.

 

[Seneschal2]

fgssand -- see what you started...

You casted a spell...

I do agree now that we are a little over a month away from the draft that draft talk is no longer a fringe discussion topic and the primary top for all Pats fans and deserves to be discussed on the main board.

I propose that draft discussion should be fair game for this board from now until at least a week after the draft.

I was wondering the same thing. I just clicked that link and it worked.

so don't worry... there is a draft forum.

 

[mcsully]

theres 5 studs that would be awesome for us, Chris Long, Jake Long, Darren McFadden, Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie, and Vernon Gholston. We are pretty much guaranteed a shot at 2 of them at the seventh pick, since Matt Ryan, Glenn Dorsey, and Sedrick Ellis at least two of them will go top 7, and that will push two of the 5 studs down to us. Most likely it will be McFadden, Cromartie, and Gholston availible at 7 for us, id love any one of them.

We are guaranteed to get a stud no matter what which is a good thing no matter who goes where.

I agree with you about 4 out of the 5 but Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie is nothing more than a work out warrior, with good physicals stats, who had a good senior bowl game..
His body of work on college isn't great. Had only 2 INT's against a low level of competition AND I read (need to find) that he was constantly burned by WR's that will never get the chance to step on the field in the NFL..

 

[SammyBlueCat]

McFadden would have a better chance getting drafted by the Bruins than the Patriots.

Good one! Anyways Gholston seems like a "can't miss" draft pick if there is such a thing so someone else will take him.

 

[BRiZ]

I agree with you about 4 out of the 5 but Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie is nothing more than a work out warrior, with good physicals stats, who had a good senior bowl game..
His body of work on college isn't great. Had only 2 INT's against a low level of competition AND I read (need to find) that he was constantly burned by WR's that will never get the chance to step on the field in the NFL..

Gholston is about as close to a workout warrior as you can get. His physical stats are off the charts but the athletism to back it up is not all there. I would be more worried drafting Gholston and making him an OLB than drafting Cromartie who will be a shutdown corner. Cromartie isnt all physical stats he has the athletic game to back it up. Regardless they both have so much upside and nothing the Pats coaches cant mold into great players so id be happy with either one of them. 5 Studs , Long, Long, McFadden, Cromartie, Gholston. Dorsey too but i just cant see where we fit him on the Dline unless we move to a 4-3.

 

[mcsully]

Gholston is about as close to a workout warrior as you can get. His physical stats are off the charts but the athletism to back it up is not all there. I would be more worried drafting Gholston and making him an OLB than drafting Cromartie who will be a shutdown corner. Cromartie isnt all physical stats he has the athletic game to back it up. Regardless they both have so much upside and nothing the Pats coaches cant mold into great players so id be happy with either one of them. 5 Studs , Long, Long, McFadden, Cromartie, Gholston. Dorsey too but i just cant see where we fit him on the Dline unless we move to a 4-3.

Gholston had 14 sacks last year.. Just as many as long. The year before he had 8.5 sacks, 1 int, and 15 tackles for losses.. I'd hardly say he is a work out warrior.. He has a strong college background in a big time school that played against top level competition..

I remember the talk about Tebucky Jones and how he is athletic enough to make the switch.. I would wager my salary for a month that he isn't picked..

 

[BRiZ]

Gholston had 14 sacks last year.. Just as many as long. The year before he had 8.5 sacks, 1 int, and 15 tackles for losses.. I'd hardly say he is a work out warrior.. He has a strong college background in a big time school that played against top level competition..

I remember the talk about Tebucky Jones and how he is athletic enough to make the switch.. I would wager my salary for a month that he isn't picked..

nobody is disputing Gholstons passrushing abilities its his athletism out in space and in coverage. Does he have the total game to be a complete outside linebacker? Hes looked a bit funky in drills when asked to play linebacker, but not something i dont think cant be improved on. You want to get a great athlete and good football player first and formost i dont put too much stock into stat sheets they can be misleading. Vrabel had 12 sacks this year but half of them were garbage.

 

[signbabybrady]

Listen up tough guy. I have no real issue with the OP at all. If anyone wants to post draft-related topics in the main forum -- that's fine by me. As far as I'm concerned, the more participation on draft topics the better. However, proper board etiquette is to check to see if a topic has already been posted before you start any thread -- hence my post. There is a draft forum, where this topic was posted much earlier. Not really that important for you fgssand, to become involved.

blah blah blah

 

[mavfan2390]

proper board etiquette

You're like the strict principal that ruins prom by choosing every song.

 

[JDP111]

BTW-- I was the genius that coined the phrase "intensive purposes" in an old post. Lay it on me!!

 

[Handel]

Gholston can legitimately be gone

1-Miami
2-St-Louis
4-Oakland
6-Jets

 

[RussFrancis]

Imo, the one and only team currently in the top 6 that would take Gholston would be the Jets.

Miami would not take him over Chris Long. Theyre similar players, but Long is far more tenacious with a HOF pedigree. St Louis absolutely must take Jake Long if Miami doesnt because theyve got a $10mil franchise QB and Steven Jackson to think of. Oakland is paying defensive players thru the roof already, and they have a young stud SEC QB. Theyre matching that guy with a young stud SEC RB. They'll go McFadden. That leaves us with the Jets. If they really want him, Gholston is theirs. Personally, I think he's theirs.

 

[Keegs]

BTW-- I was the genius that coined the phrase "intensive purposes" in an old post. Lay it on me!!

haha sorry man.

and don't worry...

I searched "intensive purposes" on this forum and there are threads going back to early 2006 with several people using that phrase and nobody saying anything (for the most part).

People say that on here more than you would think.

 

[patsfaninpa]

Imo, the one and only team currently in the top 6 that would take Gholston would be the Jets.

Miami would not take him over Chris Long. Theyre similar players, but Long is far more tenacious with a HOF pedigree. St Louis absolutely must take Jake Long if Miami doesnt because theyve got a $10mil franchise QB and Steven Jackson to think of. Oakland is paying defensive players thru the roof already, and they have a young stud SEC QB. Theyre matching that guy with a young stud SEC RB. They'll go McFadden. That leaves us with the Jets. If they really want him, Gholston is theirs. Personally, I think he's theirs.

I think the Raiders go OL. I remember reading Madden's book and it said that he and Davis would argue over whether cb or ol was the most important position. They disagreed. But, each thought the other was the 2nd most important. They won the Super Bowl with some pedestrian rb's before M.Allen. C.Davis and K.King.

I think they will take J.Long or R.Clady. I have Top 3
MIAMI - C.LONG
ST.L - V.Gholston
Atl - G.Dorsey
Oak - J.Long
KC - M.Ryan
NYJ - Trade out. Maybe S.Ellis if they don't. He can play NG and maybe Jenkins can play strongside DE in 3-4. I don't think they'll take D.McFadden.
NE - I think we take R.Clady unless we can trade out. I'm hoping we trade out. Some people really like A.Talib. I guess he's a possibility. But, who knows.

 

[RussFrancis]

Well, if Jake Long slides to 4, then Id be in full agreement. That would probably be a no-brainer. I dont see Jake Long 'falling' to 4. 6'7 315 with 37rep-strength is a trench dominator you dont pass on if youre picking in the top 3. Like I said, he'll go the Rams if Miami doesnt take him. When your best player is your RB, and youre paying a franchise QB $10mil a year, you MUST protect those guys. The Rams take the dominant Olineman without hesitation. They saw what happened to Cleveland last year after they did the same.

 

[sebman2112]

What Briz said about Gholston is true, and I don't think he's a "can't miss" prospect, when you're projecting him as an every down 3-4 OLB in NE's system.

He's raw, and needs some work on his tech (even Vrabel has said this). Vernon also looks a little awkward in coverage, and that's an area of his game that could use development. For NE that translates to Gholston's likely being little more than a situational pass rusher in year one. With some work he could develop into an every down 3-4 OLB, but I don't think NE likes the idea of taking a project in the top ten, and I don't think his developing that coverage ability should be thought of as a sure thing.

Remember, the Patriots aren't running Wade Phillips' rush happy 3-4, where the OLB's seemingly rush the passer on every down. Colvin and Vrabel frequently dropped into coverage over the past few years, and not simply out to the immediate flats either. So, for NE's style of defense, Gholston would be a project.

I do think he could get selected by some of the 4-3 teams who will be on the clock before NE, and that it's a toss up as to whether or not Al Davis would take him at 4th overall. Also, I think the Jets would take DMac over Gholston, if both were still available. They could then take Avril in the second round, who's among the best 3-4 LB prospects in the draft.

Also, Chris Long is still the better 3-4 OLB conversion, and I'm more confident in his being able to develop the coverage ability needed to become an every down OLB for NE. He's more fluid, and agile than Gholston, even while coming in at a heavier weight, and he's better against the run. He's most likely going somewhere in the top 1-4 though.

So, I think it's either Clady at 7th (if available), or trade down. Some people are saying "I hope Dorsey falls to NE, so they can find a trading partner".
That could be true, but the only thing I worry about in that situation is BB's tendency of drafting big uglies...

Edit: I forgot to add that Gholston's represention (Condon) also makes him a less likely Patriots candidate. And an FYI, Vernon seems to favor playing in a 4-3 defensive front.

 

[NePatriots]

Gholston is a bad bad man. He abused Jake Long like it was his job... continually got into his pads.

 

[TealSox]

Re: Pats workout Gohlston (2009)

Geez, I think I was even excited about this guy.