Pats send letter to Mankins, will reduce tender if he doesn't sign by the 15th

[NE39]

If a RFA does not sign the tender by the 15th, the teams can reduce the tender to 110% of his prior year salary. In Mankins case, that means he loses $1.54M on his tender amount.

The Denver Post has an article about the Broncos sending such a letter to Elvis Dumervil. It mentions the following:

The union source said New England's Logan Mankins and San Diego's Vincent Jackson along with Marcus McNeill were among unsigned restricted free agents who received similar letters.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

You mean that at least 2 other teams are real meanies like BB and cheap bastids like Kraft! Say it ain't so!

 

[Rob0729]

Virtually every team that has a RFA who hasn't signed their tender will do the same thing. It is a bargaining chip to get their player into camp. Why wouldn't teams use it?

 

[Gwedd]

Well,

It's gonna be an interesting week. My money says he signs, but you just never know.

 

[Kontradiction]

Now we get to see if the reports of Mankins being "furious" were really true...

 

[Rob0729]

Well,

It's gonna be an interesting week. My money says he signs, but you just never know.

I think Vincent Jackson or Marcus McNeil actually intend to sign their tender and then sit out because their daily fine for sitting out will still make them more than if they have their tender drop.

 

[Gwedd]

Now we get to see if the reports of Mankins being "furious" were really true...

You know, I was thinking the same thing. After awhile, you just accept all the crap that being tossed out about the Patriots, and don't worry about it. Eventually the truth will play out, and like as not, the talking heads in the studios are way off the mark.

 

[WhiZa]

If a RFA does not sign the tender by the 15th, the teams can reduce the tender to 110% of his prior year salary. In Mankins case, that means he loses $1.54M on his tender amount.

The Denver Post has an article about the Broncos sending such a letter to Elvis Dumervil. It mentions the following:

reducing by 110% will actually increase the salary. What am I missing?

 

[Rob0729]

reducing by 110% will actually increase the salary. What am I missing?

Mankin's salary was $1.4 million last year which makes his reduced to $1.54 million if they reduced tender (which is 110% of the $1.4 million). His current tender if he signs it is $3.268 million. So he will lose about $1.768 million if the Pats reduce his tender.

 

[mgteich]

The danger in signing is that the player can then be traded to whoever the team chooses. The player loses leverage. He would still have the leverage of sitting out for the entire preseason and perhaps a game or two.

In any case, if the situation is that bad with a player, he has no reason to cooperate with the team. The players loses money only if the team decides not to do anything and accept that the player will not be available until after Labor Day, and will be playing the season with a chip on his shoulder. In the end, the player won't lose anything by not signing. The team will cave and signhim to a new one year contract (with no franchise) or trade him to a team that the player accepts, with the player having received permission to negotiate with the new team.

In any case, the choice for the player is to give up leverage now and play for the RFA amount or to take a stand.

I think Vincent Jackson or Marcus McNeil actually intend to sign their tender and then sit out because their daily fine for sitting out will still make them more than if they have their tender drop.

 

[Ring 6]

The danger in signing is that the player can then be traded to whoever the team chooses. The player loses leverage. He would still have the leverage of sitting out for the entire preseason and perhaps a game or two.

In any case, if the situation is that bad with a player, he has no reason to cooperate with the team. The players loses money only if the team decides not to do anything and accept that the player will not be available until after Labor Day, and will be playing the season with a chip on his shoulder. In the end, the player won't lose anything by not signing. The team will cave and signhim to a new one year contract (with no franchise) or trade him to a team that the player accepts, with the player having received permission to negotiate with the new team.

In any case, the choice for the player is to give up leverage now and play for the RFA amount or to take a stand.

The danger im not signing is not getting paid. I dont know how you gain bargaining power by being held to a 1.5 mill salary instead of 3.2mill, and only have the threat of quitting, missing this year, being subject to a lockout next year, and being right back in the same boar whenever you unsig your heels.
Its really a lose/lose.
By the way, if its all about money, it wont help the player to sit out camp, miss games and then have a bad season and damage his market value.

 

[mgcolby]

The danger in signing is that the player can then be traded to whoever the team chooses. The player loses leverage. He would still have the leverage of sitting out for the entire preseason and perhaps a game or two.

In any case, if the situation is that bad with a player, he has no reason to cooperate with the team. The players loses money only if the team decides not to do anything and accept that the player will not be available until after Labor Day, and will be playing the season with a chip on his shoulder. In the end, the player won't lose anything by not signing. The team will cave and signhim to a new one year contract (with no franchise) or trade him to a team that the player accepts, with the player having received permission to negotiate with the new team.

In any case, the choice for the player is to give up leverage now and play for the RFA amount or to take a stand.

They can't sit out past August 10th or they lose a year of eligibility. The rule is not week 10 this season.

 

[signbabybrady]

For the record and it may be splitting hairs but according to this the team's not sending a letter stating its intent to reduce his salary but sent a letter informing him of their right to do so if he does not sign by said date.

Anyone have any clue how this actually works. When would the patriots have to decide to lower the tender? Because if there is no time table and no rule that have to they could use it as a sort of olive branch. Dont reduce the salary and let the deadline pass and then you can tell him that he is important enough to you that you didn't do this despite it being well with in their rights.

 

[spacecrime]

They can't sit out past August 10th or they lose a year of eligibility. The rule is not week 10 this season.

Not if they don't sign their tender. That non-CBA rule is for players who sign their tenders. As long as they don't sign, they can sit out. But they cannot sign and sit, because they will still be the team's property next year.

 

[spacecrime]

For the record and it may be splitting hairs but according to this the team's not sending a letter stating its intent to reduce his salary but sent a letter informing him of their right to do so if he does not sign by said date.

Anyone have any clue how this actually works. When would the patriots have to decide to lower the tender? Because if there is no time table and no rule that have to they could use it as a sort of olive branch. Dont reduce the salary and let the deadline pass and then you can tell him that he is important enough to you that you didn't do this despite it being well with in their rights.

I believe the old tender is null and void if Mankins doesn't sign by June 15. At that point the Pats can let him be a FA or re-tender him, but the tender has to be at least 110% of his last year's salary. There no longer is a first and third round pick compensation amount because the time for him to get a deal done with another team has passed. He is now basically an ERFA.

 

[signbabybrady]

Not if they don't sign their tender. That non-CBA rule is for players who sign their tenders. As long as they don't sign, they can sit out. But they cannot sign and sit, because they will still be the team's property next year.

There must be a date for players who don't sign too. If you are unsigned you can not accrew a year of eligibility that is a no brainer. But it also doesn't make sense for a date to be preseason for unsigned guys as then no journeymen or end of the line guy who has to wait for an injury could accrew a season.

 

[signbabybrady]

I believe the old tender is null and void if Mankins doesn't sign by June 15. At that point the Pats can let him be a FA or re-tender him, but the tender has to be at least 110% of his last year's salary. There no longer is a first and third round pick compensation amount because the time for him to get a deal done with another team has passed. He is now basically an ERFA.

Oh OK that makes sense. Now another question as it relates to my olive branch rather than a reduction.

If they re-tender on the 15th and decide not to take advantage of the rule and leave the tender as is and Mankins still decides not to sign can they wait a week and see if a caves and then lower it or is it a one time window to lower the offer?

 

[mgcolby]

Not if they don't sign their tender. That non-CBA rule is for players who sign their tenders. As long as they don't sign, they can sit out. But they cannot sign and sit, because they will still be the team's property next year.

Ah thanks for the explanation. The way the Sirius guys were talking I thought it was a built in uncapped rule in the CBA to prevent long hold outs during the uncapped year.

Either way I would be shocked if they all didn't sign their tenders. Especially after Otogwe.

 

[spacecrime]

In any case, the choice for the player is to give up leverage now and play for the RFA amount or to take a stand.

What does that mean? His choices are:

1. sign now and play 16 games for $3.2 million
2. sign later (before the start of the season) and
play 16 games for about $1 million,
3. sign week 10 and play six games for about $400 thou, or
4. not sign anything, don't play this year, and hope there is
a CBA signed so he will be a FA in 2011 (No CBA means
he will still be a Patriot because dtill he won't have enough
years to be an UFA (does not gain a year of eligibility)

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Oh OK that makes sense. Now another question as it relates to my olive branch rather than a reduction.

If they re-tender on the 15th and decide not to take advantage of the rule and leave the tender as is and Mankins still decides not to sign can they wait a week and see if a caves and then lower it or is it a one time window to lower the offer?

The 15th is the deadline for a team to extend a qualifying offer, so that is a one time window. I believe if they rescinded it even for a moment thereafter to change the numbers, the player in that instant would become a UFA...in which case the answer would be no. You either extend him at the rate he was originally tendered or 110% of his 2009 salary as a minimum BY JUNE 15th or he is a UFA.