Pats Eye Welker (Reiss)

[zippo59]

Funny. If I'm not mistaken, we built a dynasty on second/third receivers. Troy Brown, David Givens, David Patten. Deion Branch was the only guy who you could make an argument was a premier receiver, and he didn't really show that in Seattle this year. Sure, the Colts won the Super Bowl with Reggie Wayne and Marvin Harrison, but the Chargers had Keenan McCardell and Eric Parker... it's clearly not a necessity.

We also drafted our impact receiver last year. His name's Chad Jackson. You may have heard of him? Unfortunately he is hurt now, and may never develop into what he could have, but you never know. Maybe we should see how that turns out instead of blowing a first day draft pick on a receiver again. Welker is a young, but proven commodity who is a great special teams player and caught 67 passes last year. That would have made him the top receiver on the Patriots.

If what you are saying is true then what was the problem with the WR's last year?

And when I say impact receiver I don't mean 1200+ yard guy I mean 900-1000 yard guy.

 

[hwc]

I've thought all along that the Pats would make a serious play for Welker. He would be a perfect signing.

For all of you nay-sayers about a second round pick. Ask yourselves this: Would trading a second round pick for Troy Brown after 3 seasons in the league have been a good trade?

Wes Welker is Troy Brown. They are the same player.

BTW, we aren't talking about some stiff. The guy had 67 catches last year. That's more than anyone on the Pats roster had last season.

 

[Lampshade]

I've thought all along that the Pats would make a serious play for Welker. He would be a perfect signing.

For all of you nay-sayers about a second round pick. Ask yourselves this: Would trading a second round pick for Troy Brown after 3 seasons in the league have been a good trade?

Wes Welker is Troy Brown. They are the same player.

Same could be said of Derek Mason.

 

[primetime]

If what you are saying is true then what was the problem with the WR's last year?

And when I say impact receiver I don't mean 1200+ yard guy I mean 900-1000 yard guy.

Because Troy Brown is leaning heavily towards retirement, Jabar Gaffney is a #4-5 (not a #2-3) receiver who can occasionally make the big play, and Chad Jackson is still unproven. Reche is fine, I like him alot. A couple big drops were killers but his play all year made up for that. Welker has sure hands, runs great routes, and has above average speed.

Good luck finding a 900-1000 yard guy in the draft. Or even free agency. The only legitimate one of those was Drew Bennett, and he's now a Ram. Maybe Kevin Curtis, but he's another guy who has been a #2-3 his whole career. Eric Moulds has definitely lost a step, but he's a possibility. Joe Horn is too old, Antonio Bryant too inconsistent.

 

[zippo59]

How do we know that Welker isnt going to be an 80-90 catch guy someday? He has done nothing but improve every yr. and is only going to be getting better. He would be a good plug for us as we lose troy and wait for Jackson to return. Look who Welker had throwing to him in Mia. He didn't have ****, and he was playing opposite of a very inconsistent Chambers this yr. Brady could do alot with a young guy like welker.

Look how good gaffney and caldwell looked in comparison to their previous yrs. Our system just makes so-so players that much better. Besides, for all of the crying in regards to the need of "IMPACT" receivers, we sure did get pretty far in the playoffs with the ones weve currently got.

I'm sorry, have I been mistaken or have a lot of people around here been calling for a major upgrade at WR?

 

[zippo59]

Because Troy Brown is leaning heavily towards retirement, Jabar Gaffney is a #4-5 (not a #2-3) receiver who can occasionally make the big play, and Chad Jackson is still unproven. Reche is fine, I like him alot. A couple big drops were killers but his play all year made up for that. Welker has sure hands, runs great routes, and has above average speed.

Good luck finding a 900-1000 yard guy in the draft. Or even free agency. The only legitimate one of those was Drew Bennett, and he's now a Ram. Maybe Kevin Curtis, but he's another guy who has been a #2-3 his whole career. Eric Moulds has definitely lost a step, but he's a possibility. Joe Horn is too old, Antonio Bryant too inconsistent.

I don't see how you can peg Gaffney as a 4-5 but then say Welker could be an impact receiver. Gaffney put up better receiving numbers than Welker on equally crappy if not crappier teams.

 

[holyredeemer]

I'm sorry, have I been mistaken or have a lot of people around here been calling for a major upgrade at WR?

Oh, sorry, I messed up on that by quoting you. I wasnt implying that you were crying or whining, I just meant alot of people in general. Sorry.

 

[DaBruinz]

Personally, I'd like the Pats to trade their 2nd and their 6th to Miami for Welker and Miam's 3rd.

 

[zippo59]

I know people like to root for Welker because he'd the underdog with a lot of fight, I just don't want people to make him into something he's not.

When I watch him play he reminds me a lot of Tim Dwight, and I don't see a lot of people wishing that he had stayed.

The difference being that when Dwight played here we had Branch and Givens so we didn't need him to be a major receiver.

Last year Chambers was terrible and Booker was average, so Welker was relied on a lot more than I'm sure the coaches would have liked.

 

[hwc]

You don't need Welker to be an 80 or 90 catch guy. In addition to being a lethal slot receiver, he's an outstanding KR and PR guy. Don't you guys remember the grief he has caused the Pats? If I recall, they simply couldn't tackle the guy and finally resorted to squib kicks to keep the ball out of his hands.

Don't think "fantasy football". Think about the contribution from 53 different players. Deon Branch at 6 million a year? Or Wes Welker at, what, maybe half of that?

 

[primetime]

I don't see how you can peg Gaffney as a 4-5 but then say Welker could be an impact receiver. Gaffney put up better receiving numbers than Welker on equally crappy if not crappier teams.

Gaffney had 55 catches his best year, and had to be used as a top target because of the crappiness of the rest of the receivers on the team, besides Andre Johnson. Welker played behind Chambers and Booker, as well as McMichael. Clearly he had to be pretty good at getting open if he was getting passes instead of those guys, who are all very good receivers.

 

[Ghost of Ben Dreith]

Some of you must be drinking the kool-aid with the added alcohol ingredients.
If you think Welker has even a chance of being a solid #2 WR that will take care of our WR needs, I respectfully think.....you're nuts.

This guy's value is a slot receiver and ST's returner. He will not grab 80-90 catches a season....not even on dump offs. And if he is our #2, we are in trouble. I prefer Gaffney to Welker as a WR anyway.

I am as excited as anybody that the Pats are making moves and have their front office game face on....but let's not make this, if it happens, the WR upgrade that puts us over the top. I think Beoli is thinking more ST's. Especially since they won't be putting Moroney out their on kickoff returns next season....at least I hope not.

 

[DaBruinz]

Because Troy Brown is leaning heavily towards retirement, Jabar Gaffney is a #4-5 (not a #2-3) receiver who can occasionally make the big play, and Chad Jackson is still unproven. Reche is fine, I like him alot. A couple big drops were killers but his play all year made up for that. Welker has sure hands, runs great routes, and has above average speed.

Good luck finding a 900-1000 yard guy in the draft. Or even free agency. The only legitimate one of those was Drew Bennett, and he's now a Ram. Maybe Kevin Curtis, but he's another guy who has been a #2-3 his whole career. Eric Moulds has definitely lost a step, but he's a possibility. Joe Horn is too old, Antonio Bryant too inconsistent.

WOW. You're characterization of Jabar Gaffney is so off its ridiculous. He's been solid, but not spectacular his entire career. That is hardly a #4/#5 receiver. Gaffney is a solid #2 receiver.

The only other guy I'd want the Pats to pursue is Derek Mason, if he is let go by the Ravens.

 

[zippo59]

Personally, I'd like the Pats to trade their 2nd and their 5th to Miami for Welker and Miam's 3rd.

I don't think the Patriots have a 5th.

 

[DaBruinz]

I don't think the Patriots have a 5th.

Damn. You're right. They don't have a 5th. I was thinking their 6th rounder.. which may not be enough. Might have to be the AZ 6th.

 

[holyredeemer]

I don't see how you can peg Gaffney as a 4-5 but then say Welker could be an impact receiver. Gaffney put up better receiving numbers than Welker on equally crappy if not crappier teams.

Gaffney's best stats are 55 receptions. He avg. 8.9 ypc that season.

Welker in just his second yr. had 67 rec. for 687 yds. avg. 10.3 yds.

In welkers second yr. he avg. over 15.0 yds a catch on 29 rec. Including 6 20+ yarders and 2 40+ yarders. The guy can get deep.

 

[Va_Pats_Fan]

ESPN now

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2786731

(sorry if I missed this in an earlier post)

 

[zippo59]

Gaffney had 55 catches his best year, and had to be used as a top target because of the crappiness of the rest of the receivers on the team, besides Andre Johnson. Welker played behind Chambers and Booker, as well as McMichael. Clearly he had to be pretty good at getting open if he was getting passes instead of those guys, who are all very good receivers.

Don't look at Welker's emergence as a sign of his ability as much as it is a sign that Chambers, Booker, and McMichael all pretty much sucked last year.

 

[primetime]

WOW. You're characterization of Jabar Gaffney is so off its ridiculous. He's been solid, but not spectacular his entire career. That is hardly a #4/#5 receiver. Gaffney is a solid #2 receiver.

No, he's not. On a team with legitimate receivers, he's a good #4, maybe a #3 if you stretch it. He was let go by a team with receiving problems in the Eagles. He was let go by a team with receiving problems in the Texans. His best season was 55 catches on a team with one legitimate pass catcher besides him (okay, and maybe Corey Bradford). He caught 11 balls last year. He is not a solid #2. He had a couple good catches, and then one great catch in the playoffs, and all of a sudden he's the answer? Give me a break.

zippo59, the only reason you see Welker as Tim Dwight is because they're both white. The two of them are nothing alike. Dwight was a speed receiver. Welker is more of a sure hands, possession receiver in the Troy Brown mold.

 

[NEPat]

The thing is, receiver is such a need right now, and I am nervous about the draft. We know it takes a little while to get comfortable in this Pats system, and nothing is a sure bet. After the Chad Jackson stuff and picking up guys mid season, I am all for the Pats getting some solid receivers right now.

I like Welker a lot, and I know a second rounder is a high price. But who else looks to be a good bet out there right now?