Welcome to PatsFans.com

Pats and Colts -- The Fundamental Difference

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by teamplay, Oct 17, 2007.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. teamplay

    teamplay Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2004
    Messages:
    160
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    Two undefeated teams with incredible systems, yet there's a great contrast and irony between the Pats and the Colts that I haven't seen discussed.

    It seems clear to me that the Patriots off-season moves were to build themselves a Colts-caliber offense...but not an imitation!!

    There remains a fundamental difference: despite the Patriots makeover, the Pats remain a game plan team: slavish film study every week and customized O and D for each opponent. Dungy disdains both aspects of the Patriots approach. He wants his players to have a life away from football; excessive study time is a sign of misguided priorities to him. And he preaches one basic O and D, relying on speed, reflexes, and practice-makes-perfect to out-execute the opponent regardless of who they are and what they throw at Indy.

    BB's motto might be "Knowing your opponent + versatility = success"

    Dungy's motto might be "Knowing yourself + perfect execution = success"

    Who's right? I'm a connoisseur of the Patriots approach, but I respect the incredible consistency the Colts have achieved over the past few years too. Personally, I'm with the humble pie on all the Pats/Colts smack talk and I'll be fascinated to see how these two radically different approaches work out in the weeks and years ahead.

    Your thoughts?
  2. ALP

    ALP Rookie

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2007
    Messages:
    7,403
    Likes Received:
    9
    Ratings:
    +12 / 0 / -0

    well, i think its pretty easy...

    BB has the rings to show hes rit... Dungy has a lopsided team to show hes wrong...

    ill never go between a man and his morals, but BB's way makes much more sense...life throws at u differnt things, u can have one way to counter them all, but that one way may one day be unsufficient...as it was every year prior to last yr...

    Dungy is a motivator...BB is a football stategist
  3. teamplay

    teamplay Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2004
    Messages:
    160
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    good response!
  4. He Ban Me

    He Ban Me Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2007
    Messages:
    1,671
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    Maybe it is Dungy's approach, style and "basic" football strategy that has allowed them to "plug in" newcomers, and still be by and large successful. Our LB corp is like a revolving friggin door (and we have had some pretty decent ones). New starters at the corners, and plugging in an UDFA at DT, and so far, the D has improved. Just imagine what the D could do if WE had NE's key defensive players.
  5. danny88

    danny88 Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2007
    Messages:
    1,998
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    :
    You dont have them because you pay other players huge money. Just imagine if everyone had all the key elements they where missing. We would all be AMAZING:rolleyes:
  6. patsfaninpa

    patsfaninpa Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2004
    Messages:
    3,632
    Likes Received:
    12
    Ratings:
    +27 / 8 / -1

    Seriously, you're giving Dungy too much credit. It's Peyton Manning who runs that offense. It's their offense that won their Super Bowl. Any decent NFL coach could win with Manning at qb. Manning is the only qb in the NFL who I fear. And, he has shown why. We've had some success against him in the past. But, he's had success against us the last 2 years. Have to tip your hat to him. He's a great qb who also loves the game. Works at it. And, I'm sure he's putting in a lot of hours of film time that Dungy wasn't. If Dungy were so great a coach, why did TB win after he left? He was never even able to put an adequate offense together there. Let alone a good one.
  7. patsonmyback

    patsonmyback Rookie

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2007
    Messages:
    47
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    It is like this, the more you know about your opponent, in any walk of life, makes you more powerful. reason being, nothing your opponent does surprises you, and you are virtually prepared for everything. If your opponent can't surprise you, or hurt you, you should win 98% of the time.
  8. PromisedLand

    PromisedLand Virtual Internet Person

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    3,372
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    Good post, but I think BB's motto is:

    "Knowing yourself and your opponent + preparation = success"
  9. Bo0MeR

    Bo0MeR Banned

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2007
    Messages:
    282
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    Dungy has built this team around the concept that, he preaches a gameplan that he believes works and he absolutely sticks to it. Last year when the Jags put up 375 and the run D looked horrible, Dungy said that there were not any major changes that needed to be made, that the D only has to play the gameplan and tackle and it would work.

    He took so much heat for that, people wanted him gone, but that represents the coach he is as a whole. he truly believd that, and the team believed in him. he brings the calmness to the whole team. Thats what they say a great coach will eventually have a team that reflects him. The Colts have taken on his persona, always calm and focused on getting the job done. Anybody steps in and is ready to play and is expected to play at a high level at all times. Your a rookie playing in the SB? You step in and make a game clinhing pick, you're a 3rd string HB from CFL, you step in and rush for 120. You're a undrafted free agent rookie DT, you step into the starting lineup and fill in for Booger.

    But everyone on that squad 100% buys into his system and that represents how the team plays. They are arguably the best 2nd half team in the league as the Patriots know, they almost always come out and score on their first possesion of the 2nd half. Dungy is a great coach and will be in the HOF with Belichick
  10. patpatriot

    patpatriot Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2005
    Messages:
    807
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    Dungy is a great coach. Every bit the equal of Bellicheck . The invented the frigg'n Tampa 2 defense! But he couldn't win squat without a top QB.Guess what? Belle and Dungy the same guy. Belli showed nothing until he had first Sims and then Brady.

    Dungy's managed to Acquire and sustain a winning coaching staff and a FO that makes smart decisions just like the Pats.

    Their strategy is to let your offense wear itself out running 5 yard draws and 6 yard dump offs that eat uptime and result in FGs Then the score liketty split. Rinse and repeat and you are down 21 and out of your running game...game over.
  11. RayClay

    RayClay On the Roster

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2005
    Messages:
    17,924
    Likes Received:
    170
    Ratings:
    +367 / 6 / -8

    #75 Jersey

    Really simplistic and demeaning of the team that has the rings.

    Dungy and Pollian slapping together the defense the Broncs ran through like they were the sisters of the poor into a Super Bowl winner was one of the great coaching jobs I've seen.

    Certainly our 2001 coaching job is probably tops, but what does it serve us to act like the guys that won it all are idiots? I'm sure BB doesn't.
  12. PatsSteve1

    PatsSteve1 Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2004
    Messages:
    2,795
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    IMO, the difference this year between the two teams is on defense. The Colts have smaller players and rely on speed to the ball playing a somewhat simple defense, but playing it well. The Patriots are a bigger defense that relies on smart players that play more of a variety of defenses and using more diguise. Thsi isn't to say the Colts are dumb or some Patriots players aren't fast. But I think the offenses can both put up plenty of points and can both play whatever way it takes to get points.
  13. PatsSteve1

    PatsSteve1 Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 15, 2004
    Messages:
    2,795
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    With both teams 'how long it can last' depends on drafting and smart FA pickups and trades. You have to be able to replace what you lose and both teams have been doing that.
  14. Patriot_in_NY

    Patriot_in_NY Rookie

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2007
    Messages:
    8,525
    Likes Received:
    12
    Ratings:
    +13 / 0 / -0

    Sure, I think there are some fundemental differences but as one poster alluded to, a GREAT deal of the credit for the success lies at the feet of thier QB's.

    Brady and Manning are two of the best to have EVER played the position. Historicaly, when they play bad, thier team loses and when they play well, thier team wins. Exceptions, of course there are. But in generel, when it comes down to it, having those two under center has allow boths coaches to be BETTER THEN THEY WOULD BE OTHERWISE.
  15. He Ban Me

    He Ban Me Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2007
    Messages:
    1,671
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    We play great players great money. And yeah, douche bag, sounds pretty stupid to say "just imagine", but that's all we've heard from some pieholes here about Brady and his "lack" of receivers!
  16. danny88

    danny88 Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2007
    Messages:
    1,998
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    A lot of the pats defensive players where mid to late round pick up's and castoffs from other teams picked up in free agency. The stars reside on the defensive line. Even so not a single one of them has a contract as big as Dwight Freeney's:rolleyes: BB is a MUCH better defensive coach then Dungy. Plain and simple. Dungy is a defensive coach on a team that always has a average to sub par D year after year. Last year they where one of the 5 worst run defense's in NFL history correct? Thank Polian for the O. Dungy jus manages the talent. A nicee guy who getsfar to much credit for the talent given to him.

    If you wanted more defensive stars maybe you should not pay overrated guys like Dwight Freeney the biggest contract ever for a defensive player.
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2007
  17. He Ban Me

    He Ban Me Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2007
    Messages:
    1,671
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    That's has been my point all along. If you want start receivers than go get them, but stop *****ing about the "lack" of talent at that spot. Where Indy has a core of offensive players, it would seem NE has a core of defensive players. Vrabel, Bruschi, Seymore, Colvin, Harrison. Indy tends to keep them on offense. PM, Edge, Harrison and Wayne. How many RB's have you guys been through?

    I think you have to give Dungy some credit for building something in Tampa. And I think you underestimate the difficulty in rotating defensive players year after year.

    If BB was so magical, how's come he hasn't figured us out recently? Manning probably baiting your D and cameramen into thinking he's running play X, then they go and run play "Y" :eek:

    Stupid argument. Who's better? Who knows? Who knows how much of NE success can be attributed to underhanded tactics, and how much was actually earned?:rolleyes:
  18. danny88

    danny88 Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2007
    Messages:
    1,998
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    Typical posty by he ban me. Aviod the obvious fact Dungy is a sub par coach and claim the past cheated. Cheating? how about changing rules, piping in crowd noise, turning up the heat and Mudd stealing signals. Heard he was one of the best!
  19. richpats

    richpats Banned

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2005
    Messages:
    3,499
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    Enjoy your last weeks of thumping your chest with that statement.
  20. He Ban Me

    He Ban Me Banned

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2007
    Messages:
    1,671
    Likes Received:
    0
    Ratings:
    +0 / 0 / -0

    lol! You guys may not like Dungy, but sub-par coach? That's just stupid. I always thought that weather and the like was a bit over rated. Elements? Deal with it. I didn't see any cool zones over on the Colts' sideline last Jan. Noise? We are some loud mothers f*ckers, aren't we? Rules? I am certain that BB would be the best ever if he had no rules to follow, sorta like the Mad Max of the FB world. Mudd? I have never seen him with a camera. BTW, did you think it was funny when CBS showed your nose picker in Dallas, and he lifts up his binoculars??
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page

unset ($sidebar_block_show); ?>