Patriots Lack Continuity on Defense

[MrNathanDrake]

The longest running player on Defense is Vince Wilfork, followed by Jerod Mayo (who is still young and learning).


The one thing that bothered me about cutting Sanders and Meriweather was the continuity and experience we lost with them.

It seems we're constantly in a state of "rebuilding" the defense. Its kind of baffling, because the Defense looked decent last year and seemed we were on the right path to being a top defense.

Now we're back to rebuilding with 2 career back ups in Sergio Brown and Barrett starting at Safety.


When you look back at the Patriots SuperBowl years our defense had CHEMISTRY and CONFIDENCE in each other because they had played together for a long time. The defensive core was built and played together for a long time. (McGinest, Law, Bruschi, Milloy, Seymour, Warren).


just venting. Anyone else annoyed by this constant state of rebuilding the Defense?

 

[Observer]

I don't think we will ever know the reason for firing both Sanders and Meriweather; I can't even come up with a rationale. Maybe Sanders was old but what was wrong with Meriweather? Baffling.

 

[Brady_to_Moss]

but what was wrong with Meriweather? Baffling.

Really? It's not that baffling with all the bone head plays he would make after he make one okay play

 

[Observer]

Really? It's not that baffling with all the bone head plays he would make after he make one okay play

And Barrett and Brown are great?

 

[Sciz]

And Barrett and Brown are great?

Belichick saw something he preferred. Heck, it may have been nothing other than that they were similarly as reliable as Meriweather now, but still have potential to improve in that regard, while Meriweather never did.

 

[ALP]

I never thought about this before but you are right, a defense needs to play like a unit and this one cannot yet...hopefully the chemistry is there by the end of the season...the offense will hold us till then

 

[Brady_to_Moss]

And Barrett and Brown are great?

I said they were great?

BB saw something in these guys. The room for improvement. Meriweather was never improving..always stayed the same

 

[Hael]

Sanders has been terrible in Atlanta, I think he's done. Meriweather has gotten a few tackles in Chi, but they use him differently.

Really Chung and Meriweather basically have the same strengths. Run Defense! Except that Brandon makes boneheaded plays, and Chung is a little steadier.

Having both of them there was redundant, and I think its clear that Brown is a lot better at man coverage (after helping to shut down Gates) so you can see the rationale of the move.

In fact, the moves will probably make more and more sense as the season progresses and the safeties get some experience.

I'm more worried about our pass rush. Did you know that Wilhite is starting and playing excellent ball for Denver? Well the point is corners can look really good, or really bad and its basicaly a split second difference to spot the difference. That half a second is on our pass rush to get there, and other than the Miami game, they've stunk.

I don't even entirely blame the personel. BB has to blitz more, and if he's only going to rush 3 or 4, then why is he using non pass rushers like Wilfork, and Ninkovich in those situations? Meanwhile Carter gets double teamed (usually LT + RB), and they only use Anderson once in a blue moon (and he does well when hes in there).

Eg they don't have the right players in there to actually get to the QB!!

 

[ausbacker]

Sergio Brown looks to have some potential at the NFL level. The read and react interception he made on Rivers was a top notch football play.

Josh Barrett is plain awful right now.

 

[Observer]

I said they were great?

BB saw something in these guys. The room for improvement. Meriweather was never improving..always stayed the same

Then put him on if he surpassed Meriweather.

 

[DonBlackmon55]

Sanders has been terrible in Atlanta, I think he's done. Meriweather has gotten a few tackles in Chi, but they use him differently.

Really Chung and Meriweather basically have the same strengths. Run Defense! Except that Brandon makes boneheaded plays, and Chung is a little steadier.

Having both of them there was redundant, and I think its clear that Brown is a lot better at man coverage (after helping to shut down Gates) so you can see the rationale of the move.

In fact, the moves will probably make more and more sense as the season progresses and the safeties get some experience.

I'm more worried about our pass rush. Did you know that Wilhite is starting and playing excellent ball for Denver? Well the point is corners can look really good, or really bad and its basicaly a split second difference to spot the difference. That half a second is on our pass rush to get there, and other than the Miami game, they've stunk.

I don't even entirely blame the personel. BB has to blitz more, and if he's only going to rush 3 or 4, then why is he using non pass rushers like Wilfork, and Ninkovich in those situations? Meanwhile Carter gets double teamed (usually LT + RB), and they only use Anderson once in a blue moon (and he does well when hes in there).

Eg they don't have the right players in there to actually get to the QB!!

ninkovich, cunningham, spikes, wright, ellis, carter, anderson

there's your 4-3 pass rushing team...1 is waiver wire LB, 2 other LB are 2nd year and injured and could easily by busts, 1 DE has concussion, 1 DE was dumped by worst D in NFL, 1 DE could not stick on Texans or Bears 4-3 D last year.

other than that the DT position is fine, you know Wilfork and Fat Moody Al

 

[Sciz]

ninkovich, cunningham, spikes, wright, ellis, carter, anderson

there's your 4-3 pass rushing team...1 is waiver wire LB, 2 other LB are 2nd year and injured and could easily by busts, 1 DE has concussion, 1 DE was dumped by worst D in NFL, 1 DE could not stick on Texans or Bears 4-3 D last year.

other than that the DT position is fine, you know Wilfork and Fat Moody Al

When you consider Spikes a pass rusher, it shows that you know very little about how football works.

 

[Hael]

Andre Carter is actually pretty good, i've seen him command several double teams, but he's also old and so you see him on and off a bit.

Anderson has also (in limited action) gotten to the QB.

Wilfork is slow, Ellis is slow. Wilfork doesn't look at home in a 4-3 and I think Ellis is almost done. Wright's concussion hurts.

The biggest issue imo, is they're using the wrong people. On clear pass plays, they had Wilfork, Carter, Ellis and Ninkovich rushing. Other than Carter, thats just not a pass rushing D, its more of a run blocking setup. If they had Haynesworth in there, at least Wilfork and him would clog up the middle and allow single coverage for the edge rushers, but when he's not, its just too easy to stop it.

Ideally you would have Wilfork/Pryor (his loss hurts too), Haynesworth, Carter, Anderson and Cunningham in those clear pass situations. Tough up the middle push, combined with some speed on the edges.

Anyway, i'm a little tired of watching the read and react setup get burned repeatedly

 

[TheComeback]

And Barrett and Brown are great?

They've both shown potential in their careers. Brown has already made a few nice plays, but I'm not getting into that whole debate again.

While everyone's panicking about the safeties, Belichick is willing to let them develop.

As far as rationale, it's pretty obvious to me. Meriweather didn't progress to the level his talent should have dictated, and he was a poor tackler. Sanders wasn't worth $3 million a year, and that's been verified by the market.

Pretty easy to figure out.

And LOL @ the guy who said Meriweather was a good run support safety. He was a speed demon who had great range in the deep part of the field and big-hitting ability, but he was never, ever a good run support safety. And this is coming from someone who defended Meriweather pretty strongly.

 

[NEP4Life]

We won't be able to fully evaluate the safety position until the 8-game mark, at least.

However, whether Meriweather did or did not progress is irrelevant. What "the market" thinks of Sanders is irrelevant.

What is relevant is whether Sanders and/or Meriweather, over a full season, would have been an upgrade to what the Patriots currently have at safety.

 

[Observer]

You know who else showed potential? Butler, for one. A bird in the hand...

 

[TheComeback]

We won't be able to fully evaluate the safety position until the 8-game mark, at least.

Correct

However, whether Meriweather did or did not progress is irrelevant. What "the market" thinks of Sanders is irrelevant.

No, these points are definitely relevant. That's why they aren't on the team.

Meriweather's lack of progress speaks about his work ethic.

Sanders' market value is a direct evaluation of his talent level.

What is relevant is whether Sanders and/or Meriweather, over a full season, would have been an upgrade to what the Patriots currently have at safety.

As I've pointed out multiple times already, even with McCourty playing at a Pro Bowl level last year, we were the third worst pass defense in the league.

Explain to me why I should believe that returning one of the starting safeties from that unit, one who evidently has a poor work ethic, and his backup would change anything about how this defense has performed so far this year.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

Sergio Brown looks to have some potential at the NFL level. The read and react interception he made on Rivers was a top notch football play.

Josh Barrett is plain awful right now.

When you are grasping for one special play 2 games ago you really are reaching for hope on the absolute worse Safety group in Patriots history.

Seriously this group of safeties is the laughing stock of the league,all but chung would normally be scraping practice squads or out of work.

...And Chung has not been exactly dominant when he actually plays

 

[Joker]

And Chung has not been exactly dominant when he actually plays

Chung's stats through the two games he's played..

14 tackles...13 of them solo

1 sack

those numbers are ABOVE his career average

in contrast,his counterpart on the Jets,Jim Leonard, you know, the defense you constantly make comparisons to and lust after as you slam the Patriots day after day, week after week??? through THREE games..

5 solo tackles..2 assists..7 total

you need another board to vomit on...search google for "The End Is Near!!!" message board and infect that place with your brand of continuous negativity.

 

[patsfan-1982]

We won't be able to fully evaluate the safety position until the 8-game mark, at least.

However, whether Meriweather did or did not progress is irrelevant. What "the market" thinks of Sanders is irrelevant.

What is relevant is whether Sanders and/or Meriweather, over a full season, would have been an upgrade to what the Patriots currently have at safety.

the one thing Meriweather bring to the table was puting fear in to WR's going over the middle we have seen it with Devin McCourty this year the WR's are not really betting him over the top cause he's coverage is good but were they are beating him is they are geting inside on him and going over the middle of the field because there is no fear of geting hit by the safeties,

thats why the players voted him into the pro bowl 2 years in a row because he was the only thing the outher team had to fear when playing a team with no pass rush