Sign the Beast VIII: Patriots interested in WR Brian Hartline

[patsinthesnow]

So...Brian Hartline

 

[Bruins29]

One of the all time great Patriots was cut because it saved $8M. Cutting Amendola would save a fraction of that. You keep throwing around the term sunk cost, but I don't think you know what it means.

He is very gun hoe about it.

 

[UK_Pat37]

This is when people forget we have 90 roster spots to fill. If you can get Hartline, who has shown decent production at certain stages of his career, on the cheap and competing for a spot in a 90 man roster...you do it!

Everything's dependant on price. That's what it always comes down to. I personally don't think he'd take a big enough discount to play with Tom Brady therefore I don't see it happening; but if it did, why the hell would you complain? We have 90 roster spots. It's hardly be a waste.

Plus more than half this board slagged off the LaFell signing and wrongly slated his attributes because he was in what was a terrible offence. I said at the time it was one of the signings I was most excited about and he proved me right.

So I never get at this stage of the season why, even if we got him at a great rice, you'd slag the move off.

There's no logic to it.

 

[OhExaulted1]

All the worry about losing Vereen is overblown. The same people that are panicking now were panicking when Woodhead left. As much as I like Vereen, and think he would be worth a couple million per year, he's not the kind of guy that you pay $5M per year for. Just like Woodhead wasn't, which is why the Pats let him walk too and replaced him with Vereen in the first place. The Pats have repeatedly shown that they can find these guys when they need them without paying FA premiums. If James White isn't the guy, then the FA market and draft class are pretty deep at exactly this type of RB.

My point really is DA had 27 grabs. Vereen had 52. The need seems more to be RB than WR. Hartline isn't coming here and getting a 1,000 yards. We have 3 guys that do that already.

As for kickoff returns, that isn't really on my radar, to put it bluntly. The Pats put Blount back there in 2013. They'll find someone on the roster who's capable of returning kicks, regardless of whether or not Amendola's on the team.

It's never on anyones radar until disaster strikes.

As for the last couple paragraphs of your post, I'm not really sure who you're arguing with. I'm pretty sure that nobody in history has mentioned Brian Hartline and Randy Moss in the same sentence until you did. And I don't think anyone thinks signing a tall WR will replace McCourty and Wilfork. The closest thing that anyone's given to a Hartline endorsement is "if he comes cheap, he could be a nice addition to the offense".

I guess I'm just hoping that maybe some of that will resonate with the "we need more WR weapons" crowd when the top 6 receivers on the team accounted for 97% of the receptions and the only one not currently under contract comes out of the backfield.

 

[ashley]

Definitely a little surprised that Hartline is the receiver that we seem to be interested in. Not sure how much of an upgrade he would be over Amendola, unless we can save a lot of money. If he can turn out like another wide receiver we got from Miami, then nobody will be complaining. lol

 

[Ivan]

No, you make up ******** and create strawmen and claim people said things that nobody did so that you can continue your jihad in every thread

That's exactly what he is doing. No one on this board is raving about Amendola and everyone agrees he needs to restructure to stay, Brady 6 however needs a straw man so he can continue to rant and rave about a player he has been obsessed with since he arrived here. He has now invoked Amendola in about 6-7 new threads about a variety of topics , and rather than just start an anti Amendola thread he feels he has to go into threads about Wilfork, Hartline, veteran cuts... Etc and wage his so called "jihad." Against Amendola. It simply never stops.

 

[BradyFTW!]

My point really is DA had 27 grabs. Vereen had 52. The need seems more to be RB than WR. Hartline isn't coming here and getting a 1,000 yards. We have 3 guys that do that already.

Depth is never a bad thing, especially coming off of a 19 game season. If you don't think it's going to come from Dobson, then it has to come from somewhere. We got really lucky with injuries in 2014, but I have nothing against being prepared in the event that we don't stay so lucky in 2015. And besides, these are the same arguments that people had against signing LaFell last year.

As far as RB being a bigger need, I agree there, but it's not an either/or. My guess would be that they plan on addressing the hole that Vereen leaves behind either with a draft pick, someone already on the roster, or a much cheaper FA of the Roy Helu-type variety. You definitely need a guy with skill, and he won't be as good in year 1 as Vereen was last year, but there are guys with that type of skill set out there to be had. Personally, if the Pats have doubts about White, I wouldn't mind seeing them spend a 3rd on someone like Jeremy Langford if he drops a bit. He has great hands, and can learn the rest.

It's never on anyones radar until disaster strikes.

Define disaster. Unless the Pats find themselves fielding a 90-man roster where none of their backups can reliably receive a kickoff, there is no disaster to speak of. The Pats have spent the last few years showing that they're fine with throwing all sorts of people back there and that it's no big deal. I'm not sure why the takeaway from that would be that it's a really big deal.

I guess I'm just hoping that maybe some of that will resonate with the "we need more WR weapons" crowd when the top 6 receivers on the team accounted for 97% of the receptions and the only one not currently under contract comes out of the backfield.

I don't think anyone here is arguing for adding more weapons at the expense of maintaining a really good D, but FWIW if anyone is arguing for that then I agree with you.

 

[Bruins29]

That's exactly what he is doing. No one on this board is raving about Amendola and everyone agrees he needs to restructure to stay, Brady 6 however needs a straw man so he can continue to rant and rave about a player he has been obsessed with since he arrived here. He has now invoked Amendola in about 6-7 new threads about a variety of topics , and rather than just start an anti Amendola thread he feels he has to go into threads about Wilfork, Hartline, veteran cuts... Etc and wage his so called "jihad." Against Amendola. It simply never stops.

Yep!! You would think after all the ******** we had to go though with this the beginning of the season and then DA comes though when it matters most and wins us a big game on his own, clutch SB catch, some crow would have been eaten.

 

[Triumph]

Landry ended up replacing him as WR2 (and Wallace as WR1) midway through the season.

Landry had 5 receptions or more in every game from week 9-17. Hartline was phased out of his possession WR role.

Landry had a 75% catch rate. TE Clay also blew up with a 69% catch rate.

1 season ago Hartline had a 1000+ season. Typical NE signing.

 

[50-yard-line]

The Pats reprogram the offense every year. The other teams have all offseason to breakdown film with a fine tooth comb and figure out tendencies. In 2002, Marty Schottenhiemer figured out that Brady was less effective if you got him to move off his spot.

The 2015 NE offense be different than the 2014 NE offense.

I can see Wright and Almendola gone. Maybe even Vereen and new faces with different skill sets running a NE offensive scheme with a different twist.

Why in the world would you cut Tim Wright? Great catch rate, solid red zone threat and cost-controlled rookie contract. Makes no sense.

 

[hwc]

We should all just relax. There's no real indication that the Patriots are even talking to Hartline. He's in Houston, trying to drive up interest with the Texans and the Browns. His agent is throwing names out there. I really really don't think that jumping on a free agent WR today or tomorrow is at the very top of Bill Belichick's to-do list before the start of the league year on Tuesday.

The Pats are in pretty decent shape when it comes to receivers.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Reportedly he is willing to take less to play with the pats
https://twitter.com/MaryKayCabot/status/573589195324833793

That is smart business. How many receivers would still be in the NFL right now had they played with an elite QB instead of a garbage one? From a financial perspective, it is a risky proposition long-term to catch passes from a poor quarterback and even more risky to play for a poor organization.

 

[meatface]

That is smart business. How many receivers would still be in the NFL right now had they played with an elite QB instead of a garbage one? From a financial perspective, it is a risky proposition long-term to catch passes from a poor quarterback and even more risky to play for a poor organization.

It works well for both parties, would Andy Dalton still be a starter without AJ Green? Also Beckham and Cruz are going to extend Eli's career.
I do think its tough though for players to turn down money now for the potential to make more, especially when its based on factors that they don't have a lot of control over. I mean what if Hartline turns down more money from the Browns and then doesn't have a good year with Brady?

 

[meatface]

Definitely a little surprised that Hartline is the receiver that we seem to be interested in. Not sure how much of an upgrade he would be over Amendola, unless we can save a lot of money. If he can turn out like another wide receiver we got from Miami, then nobody will be complaining. lol

Cutting Amendola only saves a little over a million and I doubt that they are going to be bringing in Hartline for that.

 

[OhExaulted1]

With every off-season comes the shiny-object WR syndrome. At least most here are reasonbly grounded knowing this is not some huge need. I'd rather see a later RD draft pick that slips, red-shirt IR him if health stands up with the rest of the core. Hartline sounded nice a year or two ago, but I'd rather see the money spent elsewhere. Depth is never a bad thing but this season especially the cap is tight.

Whoever said the Dolphins swallowed a 4.2 dead-hit to wash their hands of him is a telling sign.

 

[New England Pride]

Why the hell do you respond to Brady6? other posters are getting tired of every thread being hijacked into a Amendola sucks thread. Just let him howl at the moon on this topic.

I might be in the minority, but I'm not tired of it at all. I find it wildly entertaining. Breaks up the lull of the offseason. I don't think people are pimping Amendola these days as @Brady6 claims, but I do find it interesting that people give him a free pass on atrocious production. He did play well in 2 of 3 playoff games and he should be recognized for helping our team hang a banner, but that shouldn't be a factor in the teams decision moving forward.

I'm still not completely sold on his rapport with Brady. I remember a critical 3rd and 9 late in the third quarter of the super bowl where him and Brady clearly weren't on the same page and Tom had this look on his face like "I wanna tear you a new one but this is the last game of the year and I have bigger fish to fry."

 

[mayoclinic]

Definitely a little surprised that Hartline is the receiver that we seem to be interested in. Not sure how much of an upgrade he would be over Amendola, unless we can save a lot of money. If he can turn out like another wide receiver we got from Miami, then nobody will be complaining. lol

Brian Hartline had a couple of very good years for Miami. He has decent hands, runs decent routes, and has the short-term quickness and maneuverability that the Pats tend to covet in WRs (1.50 10-split, 6.65 3c). He's younger than Amendola by a year, taller 6'2", and faster. If he's available cheaper, it's an intriguing move with the potential to be an upgrade.

I may start a separate thread on this, but I think that the vast majority of players in the NFL aren't separated by much in terms of talent and ability. Guys who fit well on a particular team and produce tend to get over-compensated by the market. Pierre Garcon is a good example. Fine player, but not a rare talent. He got overpaid. Hartline was probably overpaid 2 years ago (as was Amendola - Hartline was very coveted on this board 2 years ago, BTW); now he may be underpaid, while someone like Cecil Shorts may get overpaid. What you want to avoid at all costs is overpaying for a player who is at most marginally better than someone you can get on the cheap. So you kick the tires and see who is available within your price range who might be a good fit.

As UK_Pat37 noted above, everything's dependent on price. The Pats rolled the dice on Amendola, and he hasn't played up to his contract. If Hartline is available at low cost, it may be worth seeing if he ends up being a better fit and more productive. It worked well with Brandon LaFell last year. If not, it won't be the end of the world.

 

[Jlaff]

I always thought Hartline was a bit of a fantasy football darling for that 2-3 game stretch he had a few years ago (one was a 200yd game I believe) and nothing more. But recent back to back 1000yd seasons is nothing to scoff at.

But isn't he terrible at finding the endzone?

 

[JMC00]

Whoever said the Dolphins swallowed a 4.2 dead-hit to wash their hands of him is a telling sign.

Ya. It's that they can't move Mike Wallace and with the emergence of Jarvis Landry didn't want to pay $7.3m for their #3 WR and they figure they can use that $3m elsewhere.

 

[Schmo]

On paper, he's an upgrade. His production got watered down when Wallace crashed down the doors, but I think he does provide more of a deep threat.

If Miami Welker can turn into New England Welker, then I want Hartline. Especially on a small salary after a 'down year.' Think a similar situation to Jojo.

The only way we're getting a better receiver for cheaper is (rolling the dice) through the draft, and a move like this will let us concentrate on our OL and DL.