Patriots brought in guard Davin Joseph May 6; was 1st-round pick by Tampa Bay in '06

[Ring 6]

Oh, don't get me wrong, I'd rather have Connelly as well---but one has to look at that salary cap hit of 4m dollars and wonder.

We've certainly seen plenty of other examples where that didn't fly with Belichick. We'll have to see how it ends up sticking, but I'm still seeing Connelly as a potential cut if he doesn't agree to a pay reduction, especially if a new player or two are added via the draft, or even the late stages of FA such as Joseph.

What difference does the cap hit make if we have the room?

 

[supafly]

What difference does the cap hit make if we have the room?

I'm shocked that you would ask such a question, Andy. That's like saying "what difference does the price of something matter, if you have enough money in your pocket to buy it?"

I may have 50 bucks in my pocket, but that doesn't mean that I'm going to feel comfortable paying that much for a gallon of milk just because I have enough to cover it.

I haven't known Belichick to overpay too often at many positions or specific players when he doesn't see the value there, and there's nothing wrong with questioning the value of a 4m dollar cap hit with Dan Connelly, whose play has not lived up to that kind of cap hit.

 

[supafly]

With that kind of thinking, why have we cut ANY players in the past when there's been cap room available?

Bill Belichick does not normally throw in the towel just because we "could" in theory, afford to pay them.

Money can be used more appropriately, or saved and carried over for other expenses. After all, we have several important players whose contracts will expire at the end of the year who could use extensions.

 

[patman52]

Of course the cap hit matters, But i don't think he will cut him regardless of the 3mill savings unless a center is drafted.

 

[BTTA]

Just out of curiosity, what is the thinking where his 3m dollar salary is worse than his 4m dollar cap hit? They both seem pretty equal to me in the sense that the value isn't there.

One category we have a limit on, along with the other 31 teams.

There is a limit on salary outflow as well.

 

[Ring 6]

I'm shocked that you would ask such a question, Andy. That's like saying "what difference does the price of something matter, if you have enough money in your pocket to buy it?"

Horrible analogy. The money I have in my pocket can be used for many things. Leaving cap money on the table cannot. What would you do with that extra money that would make the 2014 Patriots a better team?
You are proposing that we cut our starting RG because we sign a broken down formerly good player with a high liklihood of injury with no viable backup, as well as being the best C on our roster if he isn't playing G over cap money we wont use.

I may have 50 bucks in my pocket, but that doesn't mean that I'm going to feel comfortable paying that much for a gallon of milk just because I have enough to cover it.

Again terrible analogy unless you really need milk and there is nothing else available to spend the money on before it expires.

I haven't known Belichick to overpay too often

at many positions or specific players when he doesn't see the value there, and there's nothing wrong with questioning the value of a 4m dollar cap hit with Dan Connelly, whose play has not lived up to that kind of cap hit.

I have seen Belichick overpay compared to someone elses opinion of value often. It would seem to me that BB values Connolly and I have no doubt even in the bizarro scenario where you bring in a guy who played much worse than him last year and hand him his position BB would value having a reliable backup over cap money he won't use.
If this were before FA and we were talking about the alternatives that cap money could be spent on it would be a different story, but to cut a guy who is your starter in order to replace him with a worse and injury prone guy just to underspend the cap is ridiculous.

 

[Ring 6]

With that kind of thinking, why have we cut ANY players in the past when there's been cap room available?

You are way to smart to take the approach that cutting a player is justified because we once cut a different player.

Bill Belichick does not normally throw in the towel just because we "could" in theory, afford to pay them.

What does that even mean? How is keeping a starter throwing in the towel?
You are asking him to release a valuable player in order to save money he can't use elsewhere because there is no one to sign.

Money can be used more appropriately, or saved and carried over for other expenses. After all, we have several important players whose contracts will expire at the end of the year who could use extensions.

There is no FA to spend that money on.
Are you really championing the idea that we should cut starters and weaken the team in order to carry money forward to the future? Aren't we trying to win a SB?

Are you saying having 3 mill next year and being stuck with Wendell at C by cutting the guy who is better than him, while handing his job to a player who was worse last year and extremely injury prone with no viable backup behind either of them is the best way to put a team together to win a SB?

 

[supafly]

I have seen Belichick overpay compared to someone elses opinion of value often. It would seem to me that BB values Connolly and I have no doubt even in the bizarro scenario where you bring in a guy who played much worse than him last year and hand him his position BB would value having a reliable backup over cap money he won't use.
If this were before FA and we were talking about the alternatives that cap money could be spent on it would be a different story, but to cut a guy who is your starter in order to replace him with a worse and injury prone guy just to underspend the cap is ridiculous.

For what it's worth, I never once proposed that Connelly should be considered on the block because of anything related to Davin Joseph...not once. As a matter of fact, I don't really have much of an opinion on Joseph, b/c I don't really know enough about him. What I agree with is the exploration and possibility of improvement.

I stated that Bill Belichick doesn't keep players at relatively higher salary cap hits who don't warrant doing so. In the past 2 years Connelly has been an obvious weakness. To me that automatically places him in the category of consideration, especially at a cap hit of 4m dollars. You know damn well that the position needs improvement. You are just being argumentative, possibly because you think I'm high on D.Joseph. I am not. I believe that there is plenty of time through the draft + other players being brought in to explore the possibility, nothing more.

As you point out, perhaps BB feels differently--such as any and all of our threads and discussions on this forum, but bringing in some additional competition along with a draft pick may make Connelly disposable, which is all I was saying.

 

[supafly]

Are you saying having 3 mill next year and being stuck with Wendell at C by cutting the guy who is better than him, while handing his job to a player who was worse last year and extremely injury prone with no viable backup behind either of them is the best way to put a team together to win a SB?

We saw plenty of cuts occur in the past when we had plenty of cap room, which is why I don't understand your reasoning in the least, unless you misread my post, or mistook my stance.

You asked why a player's cap hit mattered when we currently have the room to keep him? That seems to be awfully odd to me, coming from such an established poster. Obviously, Belichick makes lots of cuts when we have cap room. The 2 situations don't always go hand in hand. If BB feels as though a better move can be made for the team, he'll always make it.






I'm not getting the confusion with thinking that a player who hasn't lived up to his higher 4m dollar cap hit this year should be considered for a reduction or cut, when his play doesn't appear to warrant that kind of payday? As we've both said now, it's certainly possible that Bill Belichick sees things differently. For all I know, he may see Connelly as a major steal at a 4m dollar hit. We're just giving opinions, as usual. We'll have to see how it plays out.

 

[supafly]

There is a limit on salary outflow as well.

I still don't see how that takes priority over the cap hit, which is what mgteich stated when he claimed that the issue was "the 3m dollar salary, and not the 4m dollar cap hit." They seem to be on pretty equal grounds to me.

You're right in pointing out that my suggestion of the cap hit taking priority wasn't correct either, so thanks for that.