Patriots are becoming too arrogant

[RayClay]

Basically there are two subgroups under "we".

People paid by the Pats

and

Fans

So I think people should distinguish.

We are getting bored with this discussion.:blahblah:

 

[DaBruinz]

Basically there are two subgroups under "we".

People paid by the Pats

and

Fans

So I think people should distinguish.

In other words, you feel the need to impose your anal thinking on everyone else because you can't comprehend the difference when people say WE on a message board.

Got it.

 

[Brownfan80]

In other words, you feel the need to impose your anal thinking on everyone else because you can't comprehend the difference when people say WE on a message board.

Got it.

Not to mention the fact that our money is what the people that get paid by the Pats are paid WITH. Man, this is one of the silliest and most circular arguments of all time. You're right, Biggles is just being anal. We don't all have to be anal with him.

That said, man I hope WE win on Sunday. YEAAHHHHH.

 

[PatsSteve1]

How does every thread start on 1 subject and end up with one from left field?- Fans have been saying 'we' to mean thier favorite team for 100 years. I don't think it has anything to do with money. It has more to do with association.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

Formula:

- Many players on rookie deals, acquired through draft. Teeny tiny price tag.

- Some journeyman veterans on deals of various lengths, acquired through free agency. Smallish price tag.

- Some star veterans of various luminosities who have proven themselves after being picked from someone else's scrap heap, psych ward, etc., or having come up through the draft, who LIKE winning and are proven winners. Medium price tag.

- Two indispensibles to date. Want to be the third? Take your chances and roll the dice.

It's time to just accept this approach. We don't go after the big names a lot... I have not been holding my breath regarding Moss, for instance. But what does happen is our SMALL names become BIG names by playing for the Pats, and then are given big money. We're still talking about the SMALL names from a couple years back.

The Pats' calculation thus far is that the receiver position, in the Pats' offense, is best served from an overall value perspective, by players of medium caliber. These aren't bums, mind you -- the Gabriels, Caldwells, and Gaffneys of the world have all had some production in their previous systems. But put down the Fantasy Football magazine, and forget about Chad Johnson, Randy Moss, and Terrell Owens (especially Terrell Owens) coming to Foxboro. Now don't get me wrong... if they decide to MAKE one of these moves, of course I'll be jumping up and down. It just seems off their model.

Although I will say this, that when they have the amount of cap flexibility they have this season, they may always decide it's "time" to tweak the model (a la Corey... though he still came cheap as I recall.)

Competing formulas are all over the map, most notably the 'Skins formula, buy superstars at over market value and still lose. Like other posters here, I prefer ours.

Did anybody mention to you we've got not just the back of the future, but a likely o-line fixture to clear his path, for at least the next four years -- plus a pretty good as-yet untried WR prospect -- through the last draft? Anybody mention the Pats are 4-1, which is, by the way, well over .500 (which may be all they would need to win the AFCE?)

Every year it's the same thing. This team can put up more points. That team is tougher in D. Oh yeah, the old Pats, that patched together rowboat of a team, ho hum.

Until February.

Journeymen. Castoffs. Value free agents. Counting on the occasional rookie.

Winning Super Bowls.

Learn it, live it, love it.

PFnV

 

[Bostonian1962]

I call 'fan on fan' arrogance here!!

We're all part of the New England Patriots. We're the 12th man. We're absolutely vital to the franchise. They wouldn't trade us for 15 1st round picks! We can say 'we' if we want to, we buy the right through advertising dollars, Jersey sales, Game tickets, etc etc etc.

I cheer when the Pats are happy, I cry when they cry (Denver last season).

'We' are all Patriots.

Lighten up!

Absolutely right! It is "WE". WE live and die for this team. WE pay their salaries. WE support them in person and from afar. I love when fans say "we", and show a deep passion for their respective team(s).

As for this arrogent issue, no offense Jacky Roberts, but you are so far off on this one. It's O.K. though, I've been hearing this from the likes of Ron Borges for a long time.

Think about it. When the Pats made the decision to let certain players get better money with new teams, what did the players do w/ the new teams?

Woody? Milloy? Ted Washington? Givens? Patten? McGinist? All the rest? If I'm right about this, only Ty Law made a Pro Bowl, and most said he didn't even deserve that. So making sound decisions for your team does not automatically equal arrongance. Why are their still people out there that don't get it?

 

[Jacky Roberts]

1) Branch chose not to re-sign with the Patriots. No wonder you are posting garbage. You don't have a clue as to what reality is.

2) They couldn't franchise Vinatieri due to the change in the CBA that said that a you couldn't franchise the same player 3 times. If you did, the 3rd time he'd be frachised as the current position with the highest salary. In other words, you'd have been paying QB money for Vinatieri.

3) How was signing Caldwell a bad move? The guy has done nothing but catch passes for 1st downs since he got here. Not to mention acting as a decoy on numerous plays to open up the field for Watson.

Jacky, you have serious issues with dealing in reality.

I was unaware of the change to the CBA regarding Franchising (my bad). They had opportunities to sign Branch prior to this offseason, but passed. I think Caldwell is a bust, to be honest.

The reality is this team isn't good enough to win a Lombardi. I want them too, but I can't see how they beat a team like Denver to be honest.

 

[Brownfan80]

I was unaware of the change to the CBA regarding Franchising (my bad). They had opportunities to sign Branch prior to this offseason, but passed. I think Caldwell is a bust, to be honest.

The reality is this team isn't good enough to win a Lombardi. I want them too, but I can't see how they beat a team like Denver to be honest.

I suppose you said the same in 2001? That SB team was far less talented than this current team on offense.

People can choose whatever they wish, but I'm choosing to believe until the season actually ends in something other than a SB victory.

 

[mgcolby]

I was unaware of the change to the CBA regarding Franchising (my bad). They had opportunities to sign Branch prior to this offseason, but passed. I think Caldwell is a bust, to be honest.

The reality is this team isn't good enough to win a Lombardi. I want them too, but I can't see how they beat a team like Denver to be honest.

Did you read my post on page 6 of this thread? This team is the same in 16 positions that started in our last SB and better in 5 of those 6 positions (Gabriel is better than Givens) the only place we are truly weaker is at the #1 WR spot and that is based off of 5 games, there is plenty of time for improvement. So to say that this team isn't good enough to win a Lomabardi is not accurate.

 

[Jacky Roberts]

I suppose you said the same in 2001? That SB team was far less talented than this current team on offense.

People can choose whatever they wish, but I'm choosing to believe until the season actually ends in something other than a SB victory.

I begin every season thinking they are going to go 16-0. When they lose a game, it pisses me off to no end. The Denver game killed me because they were flat out beat in every aspect of the game and also "outmuscled" which rarely happens.

I was really, really hoping the Pats would get someone to spread the field so a team lke Denver can't just put 8 in the box and suffocate the Pats the way they did last month.

Regarding the 2001 SB, that was great, but you can't expect that stuff to happen. All the stars lined up perfectly (the tuck rule, Bledsoe coming out of the 'pen, etc). That's once in a lifetime stuff.

 

[Jacky Roberts]

Did you read my post on page 6 of this thread? This team is the same in 16 positions that started in our last SB and better in 5 of those 6 positions (Gabriel is better than Givens) the only place we are truly weaker is at the #1 WR spot and that is based off of 5 games, there is plenty of time for improvement. So to say that this team isn't good enough to win a Lomabardi is not accurate.

I really hope you're right. I'll say they are better at RB and better on the DL. I can't agree on the wideout situation. Their WR's are slow and haven't shown me as of yet they are willing to take a hit to make a catch like Branch had done. I dont think this team is good enough to win it all right now. Things can definitely change, but for them to stand pat at the trade deadline just irks me.

 

[mgcolby]

I really hope you're right. I'll say they are better at RB and better on the DL. I can't agree on the wideout situation. Their WR's are slow and haven't shown me as of yet they are willing to take a hit to make a catch like Branch had done. I dont think this team is good enough to win it all right now. Things can definitely change, but for them to stand pat at the trade deadline just irks me.

When did Brach go out of his way to take a hit to make a catch? Branch is like Harrison, he will catch the ball and drop instantly if he is in traffic, to avoid the hit. He missed a lot of games during his four years here.

Did Caldwell not take a huge shot and come back in the game to catch a first down in heavy traffic? He also continued running after the catch. I can't agree with that statement at all.

They are better on the O-line, D-Line, TE, DB and RB. I would say they are even possibly better at starting LB but not so sure about depth. WR is a work in progress and overall there is more natural talent at WR than what we had in 2004.

Every team in the League has a weakness. Denver seems to have our number but their offense is struggling. Indy and Cincy have horrible run Defense's. Baltimore doesn't have an offense, San Diego is good but they have a first year starter at QB and we are not sure what Pittsburgh is yet, they could be just as good as last year.

If WR is our biggest problem we will be damn good.

 

[Jacky Roberts]

When did Brach go out of his way to take a hit to make a catch? Branch is like Harrison, he will catch the ball and drop instantly if he is in traffic, to avoid the hit. He missed a lot of games during his four years here.

Did Caldwell not take a huge shot and come back in the game to catch a first down in heavy traffic? He also continued running after the catch. I can't agree with that statement at all.

They are better on the O-line, D-Line, TE, DB and RB. I would say they are even possibly better at starting LB but not so sure about depth. WR is a work in progress and overall there is more natural talent at WR than what we had in 2004.

Every team in the League has a weakness. Denver seems to have our number but their offense is struggling. Indy and Cincy have horrible run Defense's. Baltimore doesn't have an offense, San Diego is good but they have a first year starter at QB and we are not sure what Pittsburgh is yet, they could be just as good as last year.

If WR is our biggest problem we will be damn good.

I specifically remember a couple of catches Branch made against Philadelphia in SB 39 that were tough catches across the middle where he got belted. I will say the only team I think this team cannot beat is Denver, the rest are flawed.

 

[shmessy]

I specifically remember a couple of catches Branch made against Philadelphia in SB 39 that were tough catches across the middle where he got belted. I will say the only team I think this team cannot beat is Denver, the rest are flawed.

.......but they will definitely NOT win the Super Bowl this year? What happens if someone else beats Denver in the palyoffs before we get to them?

You stated on a few occasions in this thread that the Pats will not win the Super Bowl this year. I have no idea what will happen, but your words have an air of certainty. Am I missing something?

 

[Oswlek]

.......but they will definitely NOT win the Super Bowl this year? What happens if someone else beats Denver in the palyoffs before we get to them?

You stated on a few occasions in this thread that the Pats will not win the Super Bowl this year. I have no idea what will happen, but your words have an air of certainty. Am I missing something?

This is a classic win-win. The field is far more likely to win the SB than any team, no matter the team you choose. So you are likely to be right.

But even if you are wrong, you win because your favorite team won the SB!

Criticizing a team is fine, but stances like that one that Jacky is taking is more or less a protection mechanism. Either that or it really is trolling, but he has denied that.

 

[Jacky Roberts]

.......but they will definitely NOT win the Super Bowl this year? What happens if someone else beats Denver in the palyoffs before we get to them?

You stated on a few occasions in this thread that the Pats will not win the Super Bowl this year. I have no idea what will happen, but your words have an air of certainty. Am I missing something?

There is something missing this year. Maybe its the Branch hangover or the Denver situation, but I just can't see us winning it unless Denver gets upset.

 

[DaBruinz]

I was unaware of the change to the CBA regarding Franchising (my bad). They had opportunities to sign Branch prior to this offseason, but passed. I think Caldwell is a bust, to be honest.

Again, you don't know reality. The Patriots made several attempts to re-sign Branch and he turned them down each time, refusing to negotiate.

The reality is this team isn't good enough to win a Lombardi. I want them too, but I can't see how they beat a team like Denver to be honest.

You have no idea whether this team is good enough to win the Lombardi. There are still 10 game left that will shape this team. As for beating Denver, damn, Denver is one of the most over-rated teams in the league. They could have beaten Denver at home if they had executed the plays they ran.

OH, as for you calling Caldwell a bust, that's laughable. As laughable as you being called Boston's Ambassador to French Cuisine.

 

[Jacky Roberts]

Again, you don't know reality. The Patriots made several attempts to re-sign Branch and he turned them down each time, refusing to negotiate.



You have no idea whether this team is good enough to win the Lombardi. There are still 10 game left that will shape this team. As for beating Denver, damn, Denver is one of the most over-rated teams in the league. They could have beaten Denver at home if they had executed the plays they ran.

OH, as for you calling Caldwell a bust, that's laughable. As laughable as you being called Boston's Ambassador to French Cuisine.

Caldwell is a bust, sorry, he is. Who is this city's ambassador to French Cuisine, then? You're clearly the type of guy who doesn't know that "French Fries" aren't french food, but I digress.

 

[Kingasaurus]

As for beating Denver, damn, Denver is one of the most over-rated teams in the league. They could have beaten Denver at home if they had executed the plays they ran.
.

We appear to have a problem beating Denver no matter how good the team is. It seems to be a matchup issue because other good teams seem to have no trouble beating the Broncos - especially the Colts. It's worth noting that the three times we won the SB, we never had to face Denver in the playoffs and the one time we barely beat them in the regular season, they had Danny Kanell at QB and we needed an intentional safety to pull it out.

Football is weird. The Steelers and Colts have a lot of trouble beating us, yet neither team has difficulty beating Denver like we do.

We seem to call Denver overrated every time they beat us, but they have beaten us regularly for 40 years.

 

[DaBruinz]

Caldwell is a bust, sorry, he is. Who is this city's ambassador to French Cuisine, then? You're clearly the type of guy who doesn't know that "French Fries" aren't french food, but I digress.

How is Caldwell a bust? You know what? Nevern mind. Don't bother answering because you've been proven wrong in this thread every time you've opened your trap.

As for the "type of guy" I am, you don't have a clue on that either since I know that French Fries aren't a french food.

The only ARROGANCE being shown here is by YOU, Jacky Roberts. But that has been your way since you decided to start posting here on Patsfans.com.