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Pat Tillman - a hero's death

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by rabthepat, Jul 28, 2007.

  1. rabthepat

    rabthepat Rookie

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  2. Pats726

    Pats726 Rookie

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    Totally ickening that the truth has been covered up...evidence destroyed like his uniform, dairy, notes...and not to be political but Bush claiming execuive privilege with regard to it. Pretty sad.
  3. Mike the Brit

    Mike the Brit Minuteman Target PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I agree, a very depressing story -- but it doesn't make Pat Tillman any less admirable.
  4. PonyExpress

    PonyExpress Rookie

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    The context of this story is removed in order to manipulate public opinion. Friendly fire is common in combat. In Vietnam up to 40% of casualties resulted from friendly fire. The idea that an elite soldier died due to confusion on the battlefield is not unusual. I have seen such deaths even in training. Eyewitnesses, including the man next to Tillman, have continually maintained the event was accidental. That some in the Spec Ops chain of command tried to conceal that fact to save themselves from embarrassment was foolish. But the ensuing furor is part of an orchestrated campaign more insidious than the "cover-up" itself. What has happened here is the following:
    1) The Party of Defeat (the Democrats) has based their entire election strategy on the defeat of the US military in Iraq.
    2) Contrary to all their hopes, the "surge" in Iraq is succeeding.
    3) General Petraeus, in charge of the Surge, will issue a report to Congress in September outlining the successes of his plan and the turnaround on the ground.
    4) The Party of Defeat sees that, to its dismay, the public has a 69% approval rating of the military, and a 14% approval rating of the Democrat Congress. Thus Petraeus, if nothing changes, will have unassailable credibility in the eyes of the public when he makes his optimistic report. Optimism is very damaging to the Party of Defeat.
    5) The Dems are employing a slash and burn tactic in response, i.e. attempting to dicredit the military itself and the General's stature before he has a chance to speak.
    6) The "Tillman" story, like several other developing critiques of the military in the managed "media" are part of a timed campaign to manipulate public opinion.
    If you don't realize that the Dems are trying to orchestrate the defeat of our nation and our military right before our eyes, Wake Up! These traitors will stop at nothing to secure the defeat for their own political gains. It's time to take off the blinders and realize we have a group of radical socialists trying to hijack our nation, who cheer each day for the death of our soldiers, who gleefully hope for suicide bombings, whose dark ambitions embrace the murder of our soldiers with thinly veiled delight. They only pretend to care about Pat Tillman, because they want to use him as a cynical tool to smear our military and facilitate its defeat. Wake up!!!
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2007
  5. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

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    The story references someone saying Tillman had 3 bullets in his head fired from 10 yds away. If he had been shot and took 3 m-16 rounds from that range, his head would be gone.

    Clearly there was a coverup of the facts around the friendly fire and people have been disciplined, as they should have, What has happened that would be new in the last few years. Pony Express may have a good theory as to why now.

    This thread should be in the political forum BTW.
  6. stcjones

    stcjones Rookie

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    So are you implying, or in your opinion, do you think he was shot DELIBERATELY by his OWN men? I tend to think he was.....not sure how the hell it could get to that,......but THREE bullets in the forehead in that close proximity? I agree with you........with a random friendly fire issue.....where bullets are sprayed out there more.....wouldn't seem to have that kind of accuracy...weird, sad deal.......
  7. patsfan13

    patsfan13 Hall of Fame Poster PatsFans.com Supporter

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    The article posted implies that TIilman was murdered by emebers of his unit. Saying they were 'his men' implies he was in command of the unit IIRC that was not the case.

    I don't know if the article contains any truth. I did point out what I think is a major piece of BS that he could have been shot from 10 yds away and taken 3 rounds to the head from a m-16 and still have a head. shonds like BS.
  8. Pats726

    Pats726 Rookie

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    The people who have hijacked our nation are the so-called Bushies who are closer to Nazis than anything else..they are the real traitors.
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2007
  9. shmessy

    shmessy Maude Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey
    Question:

    Could you please share your vision of what "victory" would be in Iraq?
  10. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

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  11. scout

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    Gee Pony Express, thanks for clearing that up. After I read the article, I thought there was some sort of cover-up. What the heck is Pat Tillman's mom talking about the nation being decieved. She has no right. So, lets forego the hearings and take the general at his words. You know, the ones he can't remember.
  12. wistahpatsfan

    wistahpatsfan Rookie

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    He can't because there is no one who can. You can only expect the "freedom and democracy" or "Our enemies will follow us home" types of a response. You will never get the war pigs to define victory for you. It's just a word that identifies the black and white of positions on this occupation. They will also leapfrog over the moral justification of our presence there by saying stupid things like, "we're here already so we have to finish "the job", while completely ignoring the other options.
  13. wistahpatsfan

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    Good points, Boy. I wonder how many Iraqis want the bad things about America (especially Madonna concerts!:bricks: ). I know they want to make money and come to America and meet our women and listen to British classic rock and American hip-hop. They want a McMansion on a cul-de-sac, a lake house, and a third car. They want the freedom to tell a cleric to go fu-k himself with that religion crap. Problem is, they live in the Middle East. No amount of wishing will help them...just a plane ticket out.
  14. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

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    After Saddam was gone and then when the Ungrateful Smelly Stinking Donkey F-cking Pigs started killing the young Americans who got rid of the Leader who was cutting off their heads and their legs then even I started to say "get the hell out of there and let those lousy animals slaughter each other" those vermin aren't worth helping, why help somebody that hates you and wants to kill you.

    If it gets to bad let Lovely France and the Crooks in the UN handle it, let Israel handle Iran, Israel won't slobber over them like the Crazy Americans do Israel will NUKE them into kingdom come.

    F-ck the middle east it is a land of smelly stinking savages who want you and your children dead.
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  15. wistahpatsfan

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  16. PATSNUTme

    PATSNUTme Paranoid Homer Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Let's get one thing clear, Pat Tillman was a hero.

    If he was killed by friendly fire, why is that so shocking to people? If there was a "cover up" that is not good even if it was intended to spare the family further pain.

    If he was deliberately killed by anyone, then a full investigation should be done and the one(s) responsible should be tried under the UCMJ and given the maximum penalty if found guilty.

    Why is this a political issue? I doubt that any cover up was initiated by someone holding a political office at a high level.
  17. scout

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    The problem I have with your post begins with the word initiated. For that reason, this is a political issue.
  18. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    It would not be a political issue except for the fact that the administration first exploited his death for political reasons and then there appears to be a coverup ontop of a coverup. It seems reasonably to think that senior people in the administration, horribly embarrassed by the truth, tried to suppress it.
  19. QuiGon

    QuiGon Banned

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    Thank you for describing every single wartime administration in the history of the Republic.

    It always cracks me up... the childlike naivete of people who think that this sort of practice was invented by the Bush administration... because no other administration would ever do such a thing... certainly not any democrat or anything like that... :rolleyes:
  20. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    All I said is it's a political issue because the administration made it political and there appears to be a cover up. Propaganda obviously is a wartime fact, but it can be a double edged sword. Putting reading comprehension above your own bias will help you to avoid such mistakes in the future.
  21. QuiGon

    QuiGon Banned

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    This from the single most partisan, most biased member of this board... :rofl:

    Like I was saying... It always cracks me up... the childlike naivete of people who think that this sort of practice was invented by the Bush administration... because no other administration would ever do such a thing... certainly not any democrat or anything like that... :rolleyes:
  22. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

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    The "Coverup" is as American as apple pie and the "F" word.

    Presidents do it (Nixon/Clinton) the Kennedy's have made an Art Form of it, the Kennedy's teach their kids how to do it before they can walk.

    The problem here is, The Hated Bush is President.
    :bricks:
  23. old 55

    old 55 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    We are paying our own assassins.

    Bush is an OIL MAN at heart. We are in the middle east due to our total dependency on OIL. Iraq is about the oil supply and providing defense contracts to Haliburton, a company so "patriotic" that they moved their HDQ overseas beyond the reach of political oversight from Congress. Saudi Arabia and Pakistan are training terrorists against us, yet they are our officially our "allies."

    In the meantime, the so called financially responsible Republicans are funding this war by running up a debt of over a half a trillion dollars - bypassing the normal budget oversight by classifying it "emergency" funding.
    How is the war funding "emergency" funds when we have been there four + years and Bush resists any pressure to turn over Iraq to the Iraq government and bring our troops home? Clearly he plans on continuing the war until after he leaves office.
  24. PATSNUTme

    PATSNUTme Paranoid Homer Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    How did they make it poitical? The media made the big deal about his leaving football to join the army.

    I don't know if anyone in the admistration mentioned it, I can't remember. If they did, that's normal for any administration Dem or Rep to do that. Tillman was not your average guy.

    I don't know if Tillman was a Dem or Rep and I don't care. He was a hero and that is all that matters.
  25. shmessy

    shmessy Maude Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I'm still waiting for the definition of "victory" in Iraq from Pony Express.

    It's a very important concept, given how many times the administration has painted the domestic debate over "who wants to win and who wants to lose". Pony Express, himself used the term "Party of Defeat" several times in his post.

    It would , therefore, be helpful if he/they could define for the public exactly what "victory" would entail in Iraq.

    I mean this not disrespectfully, but earnestly. I'd like to understand exactly what the long-range vision is in the Iraq situation for the United States.
  26. PressCoverage

    PressCoverage Banned

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    LOL... what an utter pile of crap... albeit, a prototypical radical right rant, one that would make John Moody and the spinmeisters at Fox and Weakly Standard proud... no sweat off their back; not their kids or nephews... and prolonged war equals profound profit...

    for all your divisive blather, the common sense party is still not hearing a convincing argument (from you, or anyone) about why the Army refused to look into the wounds further, at the behest of medical examiners... or why Boy King somehow needs to claim executive priviledge regarding the matter...

    anyhow.... who knew Tillman was a Noam Chomsky reader and quoter? who knew he was against the Iraq War? here's a fellow Iraq vet writing on the Bushies' curious stance...

    It is inevitable, then, that unless the President comes clean, rumors about Tillman’s death will take hold. By stonewalling, there is no way to stop people from wondering, “Was the man the White House used to promote the war ordered to be killed because he was becoming increasingly critical of the war in Iraq?” It was well known that Tillman was critical of the decision to go to war, and had often read and quoted Noam Chomsky. I don’t personally believe such a conspiracy to be the case, but until the President comes clean, rumors like that will continue to grow. Every officer knows that if a soldier in their command is killed they must write the family and tell them the truth, for exactly that reason. Why can’t the man who sent Pat Tillman to war, and used his death for political gain, have the courage to tell a family what happened to their son?

    Ultimately, besides causing unfair pain to the Tillman family, the President is perilously close to doing severe damage to the military with his bullheadedness. If America looks at the Tillman case and concludes that the military cannot be trusted to tell the truth and take care of its own, and that the White House is an enabler of that behavior, public confidence in our fine military will wane.
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2007

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