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Overlooked Matchup - Pats Running vs. Giants LBs

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by Metaphors, Jan 25, 2012.

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  1. Metaphors

    Metaphors In the Starting Line-Up

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    I've heard all week about how the Giants defense matches up well against the Pats offense. I'm not sure I agree based on the game in November (Pats shot themselves in the foot on multiple drives), but I can see where they are coming from. The Giants effectively play a 4-2-5 base with 3 safeties getting a majority of snaps. Having all those DBs on the field (add Amukamara on obvious passing downs) allows them to spread safeties around to clutter up passing lanes in the middle of the field.

    However, this scheme is more out of necessity than design. The Giants have struggled with LB play all year long. Boley is a constant but he isn't a big guy. They have tried Herzlich in the middle until he got hurt. Greg Jones has slipped to the point where they brought Chase Blackburn back after not signing him out of camp (where he remained unemployed until after Thanksgiving). Kiwanuka is listed as a LB but he plays more like a DE.

    This gives the Pats an opportunity to run the ball effectively when the Giants go light (6 players 230 lbs and under). With 2 TEs (add Solder if Hernandez is at RB), the Pats would have the bulk to open holes and get to the 2nd level against DBs rather than LBs.

    The Giants only counter to this is to bring up safeties into the box...which should allow play-action to freeze them long enough to give the TEs and Welker the ability to get open quickly or drive the seam and attack downfield.

    Add this all up and the Pats offense stays on schedule and Brady stays clean and in control. That does assume the following:

    1) Avoid negative plays. Can't have penalties that take the run option off the table.

    2) Keep the game close. Falling behind by multiple scores transforms the game into a track meet where the lighter Giant defenders and multitude of rush ends are comfortable.

    3) Absolutely no turnovers. This gameplan depends on drive efficiency so you can't lose entire drives to turnovers.

    4) Win special teams. Rather have 60-70 yard drives than 80-90 yard ones. When they get into scoring position, must come away with points.

    The Pats uncharacteristically failed on all these points in November. If they ace them next Sunday, the Pats should be able to control this game with strong runs and play-action passes. While it is a rematch of 2007, it should feel more like 2003-2004.
     
  2. letekro

    letekro In the Starting Line-Up

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    Yup. Ridley please.
     
  3. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    The Giants are 23rd in the league in yards allowed per rush, just one spot above us - our low ranking can be mitigated by 1) Spikes and Chung being back and 2) NYG have the lowest yards per carry offensively in the league; plus they won't be able to resist throwing on our secondary. That was a long way of saying I agree, we should be able to run on them and BJGE is looking like he's over his toe issue.
     
  4. Coach42

    Coach42 Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    #87 Jersey

    I think the Pats ground game/offensive line play has be underrated all year. When they have committed to the run good things happen. I think we can run on this Giants team regardless of their personnel. I thought BJGE looked great last week and would love to run him into the ground.
     
  5. Gumby

    Gumby 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

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    #11 Jersey

    Yes, but is Ridley over his 'BB doesn't activate guys who drop the rock' issue?
     
  6. State

    State In the Starting Line-Up

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    #70 Jersey

    We are in much better position counteracting an all-out Giants pass rush with a competent ground game. I'll never forget the last SB watching Maroney getting arm tackled by diving LBers for the Giants.

    The Lawfirm and Ridley are much better. And Solder is a freak specimen.
     
  7. AzPatsFan

    AzPatsFan Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

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    The Giants undersized 4 DE rush line is susceptible to a steady diet of BJGE, and Riddley with an occasional sprinkling of Woodhead, for spice. If the Giants beef up to stop the run then they can't pass rush, with their larger but immobile reserves. Meanwhile we exploit their undersized D-line and and poor an/or undersized LBs, and light triple Safety defense with a power run game.

    I would like to run at them with a steady diet of Light, Mankins, Connolly, Waters and Volmer; with Gronk and Solder as the TEs, and Hernandez as the H-back. BJGE and Riddley could have a 100 yards each. Except when Gronk Hernadez or Welker take a wide open pass.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2012
  8. ausbacker

    ausbacker Brady > Manning. PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #51 Jersey

    A good way to help slow down and aggressive pass rush is to employ screens and dump offs with quick throws. The Giants linemen can't get to Brady if the ball has already left his hand.

    I'll be interested to see if the Patriots employ either of these during the game.
     
  9. Ice_Ice_Brady

    Ice_Ice_Brady In the Starting Line-Up

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    It seems like they've tried that and always choke. They can't complete a simple screen, so they abandon the correct strategy. The Giants defense has a way of making teams employ the obviously bad schemes.

    I'd like to see some misdirection as well. How about a WW or AH reverse early on, or better yet- A FLEA FLICKER!!!!
     
  10. RelocatedPatFan

    RelocatedPatFan In the Starting Line-Up

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    If they can dump the ball to BJGE, I think we might take them by surprise for a few plays and help set up the play action. We arely seem to get him the ball (I know there are obvious reasons for that), but being able to use him in that role could definitely throw the defense a wrinkle. Peopel expect Woodhead/Faulk in that formation to potentially get a pass.
     
  11. ausbacker

    ausbacker Brady > Manning. PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #51 Jersey

    The Patriots aren't going to radically change the way they play offense for the Superbowl and I sure as hell hope they don't. The issue is the Patriots need to nullify the Giants pass rush with misdirection and some well executed plays maximising match ups.

    I said it some time ago but Hernandez in the run game could prove worthy of an Ace in the Hole type of mentality. His acceleration for a guy his size is most impressive.

    Good points.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2012
  12. Spiral

    Spiral PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    How often have you seen teams run the ball effectively in the playoffs, then just stop running and start throwing again? Happens a lot. I think a lot of offensive coordinators (hi Charlie and Skippy) are always trying to outthink the room, trying to show how brilliant they are.

    Jason Tuck: 268 lbs.
    Osi: 255 lbs.
    Tollefson: 266 lbs.
    JPP: 278 lbs.

    Bring Vollmer (or Cannon) in at RT, put Solder next to him at TE (or next to Light), and jam the ball down their throats.

    This may require an interesting decision for Belichick on gameday: Faulk or Ridley.
     
  13. NEP4Life

    NEP4Life Third String But Playing on Special Teams

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    Honestly I dig the idea of having the SB be the Pats' highest run percentage game of the season. Pound the rock, and pick spots for passes -- old-school Dynasty-era football.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2012
  14. Satchboogie3

    Satchboogie3 In the Starting Line-Up

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    Absolutely. Just please, PLEASE don't use Slater as a primary target....
     
  15. JR4

    JR4 In the Starting Line-up PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I can't believe PATs gurus would not see this opportunity. If they try to make this a pass first game plan they will probably loose.
    If they can get 35+ minutes TOP they win.
    Make EM a bench warmer. They have the size to do it. Will they?
    Woody and Law Firm should have key roles in a win. They need to have
    some special 3rd and long pass plays to keep drives alive.

    I've said this in other threads, Giants have been allowing 5.0 yds/carry in
    the post season. PATs should make it part of their game plan to
    as you say "jam the ball down their throats."
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2012
  16. DonBlackmon55

    DonBlackmon55 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

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    Ball Control and smash it down their throat to keep it out of Goober and Cruz/Nicks hands and keep our DL fresh to rush deep in the game(if needed). Gints D has shown this year they cannot stop the run. The Saints rammed it down the Gints to soften that D and that setup the pass.

    With our Big OL and TE size we should be able to control the ball and score. Employ game plan as we did against the Jets in 30-21 win...BJGE 27, Ridley 7...We ran 35 times for 152 yards and controlled the clock for 34 mins. Brady still threw for 320+ yards
     
  17. Patdown93

    Patdown93 Practice Squad Player

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    Perhaps BB should dust off the gameplan against the Colts in the 2004/2005 Divisional Playoff? 39 rushing attempts. Kept Peyton off the field and won 20 - 3.

    I would not be surprised to see BB pull out all the stops. AH in the backfield running the ball. A healthy dose of Law Firm and a trick play. Have we used that fake FG TD since 2003? BB admitted that the staffs he's worked on have used it quite a bit.
     
  18. fumbrunner

    fumbrunner 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

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    I would love that, but its not gonna happen. the pats haven't committed to the run all year, and i doubt they'll change that.
     
  19. TheComeback

    TheComeback 2nd Team Getting Their First Start

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    Those kinds of plays are a given. But the OP is right. The run will be key for this game. In '07, we got stuffed on every play. We did a much better job in November, and should commit to it a bit more in the Super Bowl.

    Green-Ellis had an excellent day this week, and according to Bedard, Connolly handled Ngata one-on-one. If we can run on the Ravens like that, we should be able to do it against NY. It's definitely a different front and completely different style of defense, though, so nothing is a given.

    Still hate that matchup of Eli and Co. vs our secondary. Have to get the pass rush going.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2012
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