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Overall talent assessment

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by betterthanthealternative, Dec 13, 2006.

  1. betterthanthealternative

    betterthanthealternative Rookie

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    I think we tend to have rose colored glasses, overly influenced by past success. Here's how I see it as we stand now; meant to provoke responses:

    Scale: Top 5, Above Average, Average, Below Average, Poor

    Offense
    QB - Top 5
    RBs - Average (look at what many other teams have before jumping on this; Dillon is Above Average but fading and Maroney has shown an initial flash but is till unproven now that teams have adjusted to him.)
    OL - Average (Just Above Average pass blocking, Average run blocking at best)
    TE - Above Average
    WR - Below Average

    Defense
    DL - Top 5
    LB - Above Average but aging rapidly; Average next year w/out new blood
    DB - Below Average (I don't count Harrison in this because he's played very little this year and last; Samuel is good but not as good as the interceptions seem to indicate.)

    ST
    Kick coverage - Above Average
    Kick returns - Above Average
    PK - Average (lots of potential here)
    Punting - Average

    Coaching
    Top 5 - but if the offense continues to struggle, drops to Above Average
  2. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    OK, I'll play : (Good is better than Above Average, Bad is worse than Below Average)

    QB - Your Top 5 sounds good.
    RB - Good.
    WR - Bad.
    TE - Good.
    OL - Above Average.

    DL - Very Good.
    LB - Average.
    DB - Average.

    PK - Average.
    P - Very Bad (are you kidding with Average) ???
  3. patsox23

    patsox23 Rookie

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    The Patriots punter, Josh Miller, was terrific until the injury started to affect his performance. Going forward (next year), I expect him to regain his stature.

    Ken Walter has been fine. I know you guys want to kill him from past years, but he's had some good kicks and some bad. There is no greater kneejerk reaction than Pats fans wanting to pile on Ken Walter for miscues, small and great.

    I know you asked us to pause before piling on, but the RB thing is an easy shot. I disagree with you. They are above average. We've seen enough of Maroney to know he's special. He's got some things to learn, but he's a star. They just need to use him like one.
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2006
  4. JR4

    JR4 In the Starting Line-up PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Interesting. Have you got another team that
    ranks - good on all units? How would you rank Colts or Ravens?
  5. BelichickFan

    BelichickFan B.O. = Fugazi PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #24 Jersey

    I ignored Miller as he's out for the year.

    Walter is horrible, give me a break. I'll admit he was unlucky that his good punt downed on the 3 was called back. But he punted from inside the 50 twice and the Dolphins started beyond their 20 both times. Walter BLOWS.

    4-10-MIA 47 (11:12) 15-K.Walter punts 37 yards to MIA 10, Center-66-L.Paxton. 83-W.Welker to MIA 21 for 11 yards (23-W.Andrews).
    He punts from their 47 and it is such a horrible line drive that they return it 11 yards ? :eek:

    4-12-NE 27 (14:47) 15-K.Walter punts 47 yards to MIA 26, Center-66-L.Paxton. 83-W.Welker to MIA 40 for 14 yards (58-P.Woods).
    Nothing good or bad about this one. Long punt but returnable.

    4-11-NE 46 (7:20) 15-K.Walter punts 51 yards to MIA 3, Center-66-L.Paxton, downed by NE-23-W.Andrews.
    PENALTY on NE-35-P.Pass, Illegal Formation, 5 yards, enforced at NE 46 - No Play.

    Great punt, Pass screwed us over here.

    4-16-NE 41 (7:08) 15-K.Walter punts 41 yards to MIA 18, Center-66-L.Paxton, fair catch by 83-W.Welker.
    Solid punt, about what you'd expect.

    4-7-MIA 42 (2:01) 15-K.Walter punts 19 yards to MIA 23, Center-66-L.Paxton, fair catch by 83-W.Welker.
    What the hell was that ? Absolutely disgusting.

    4-11-NE 19 (9:39) 15-K.Walter punts 32 yards to MIA 49, Center-66-L.Paxton. 83-W.Welker to NE 43 for 8 yards (23-W.Andrews).
    From our own 19 he booms a 32 yarder. And it's not a fair catch either. Nice :mad:

    4-1-NE 13 (5:51) 15-K.Walter punts 33 yards to NE 46, Center-66-L.Paxton. 83-W.Welker to NE 43 for 3 yards
    And from our 13 he bails us out again with a monster 33 yarder.

    4-10-MIA 42 (12:34) 15-K.Walter punts 30 yards to MIA 12, Center-66-L.Paxton, fair catch by 83-W.Welker.
    An actual NFL average solid punt here.

    That's it. 1 great punt that was called back. 3 average punts. 4 bad to horrible ones.
  6. cstjohn17

    cstjohn17 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #54 Jersey

    Good stuff, I did a similar exercise for the 2007 off season in the Draft forum, http://208.109.107.176/new-england-patriots/messageboard/showpost.php?p=260390&postcount=1

    The big question, no matter how you rank them is this a good enough team to win a SB? I say Yes but they will have to play much better football to even win a single post season game. As a team they seem to hover between average to above average.

    Looking at the team right now I agree with most of your ratings. I would make the following updates:
    • LB - Average - It seems like they are slowing down a bit, pressure is inconsistent and blitzes and they have trouble matching up against RBs in the passing game.
    • DB - Average - I would raise this, overall it has been a big improvement from the Duane Starks era. Ranked 14 of 31 in pass yards, last year we were 30 or 31.
    • ST Coverage - Average - I think we are overrated in this area. Every year I hear how much attention is paid to STs and how important it is to the team. But the last couple of years we have been below average statistically. I would not cry if the Larry Izzo era ended after this year. Compared to a team like Buffalo our coverage looks awful.
    • Coaching - Average - The have done a good job to keep things going even with the injuries. The penalties, fumbles, etc. point to a lack of preparation.




  7. Jimke

    Jimke Rookie

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    QB Good Brady the best but Cassel unknown
    RB Above average Dillon power back and Maroney speed back
    WR Bad Best WR 35 years old
    TE Above average Would be good except drop too many balls
    OL Average Guards and center above average; tackles below average


    DL Good Don't know how you rate top 5
    LB Average Loss of Seau hurts
    DB Below Average Without Samuel cornerbacks bad; with Harrison
    and Wilson safetys average

    P Below Average With Miller average
    K Average Gostowski will be fine

    Pats are still a decent team. 2007 free agency may be very important.
    If they lose Graham and Samuel and fail to sign a few GOOD free agents,
    they may be looking up at Miami and the Jets in the standings.
  8. Battaglia

    Battaglia Rookie

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    The Pats D-line is easily top 5 in the league maybe top 3.
  9. JackBauer

    JackBauer On the Roster

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    If by fine you meant godawful, we agree.
  10. JackBauer

    JackBauer On the Roster

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    Our best WR is Reche Caldwell.

    And like the previous poster said, the DL is easily top 5.
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2006
  11. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Agree except that I would place
    RB - Above average
    OL - Above Average

    Until the last three weeks, posters were calling our OL the best since Hannah played, and ditto for our running game. That was an overstatement. Average is an understatment.

    With regard to coaching/FO, we have the best. However, our OC is below average. That is more than made up for by the rest of the coaching staff and by Scott and the rest of the FO.

  12. JoeSixPat

    JoeSixPat Rookie

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    And our second best WR is a TE - and he's questionable with leg injury... that's bad

    The fact that Watson's been a defacto WR and that there aren't any other real WR threats also limits the effectiveness of the TE game. Graham's injury hasn't helped any too - not his fault but just reality.

    So unfortunately I'd have to put TE into the below average category - not because Watson's not done yeoman's work -its just that Watson can't be a WR and TE and expect to do both well without something suffering.

    Having a solid #2 WR and freeing up Watson from constant double teams would go a long way towards helping this team - but unless Gaffney or Jackson really steps up that's not going to happen this season.
  13. AzPatsFan

    AzPatsFan On the Roster

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    You don't end up in the top ten in the League on both Offense and Defense with those grades. Nor create a 9-4 record.

    So either the grades are wrong, or the evidence provided by a record is wrong. Pardon me, but I'll take the evidence of the record and the established stats.

    What we have here is overreaction due to the general depression of a weekly loss; that's all.

    I predicted a 12-4 record in the preseason, and I don't see it not being a pretty good forecast.

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