OT: Colts lure Kerry Collins out of retirement...

[Joker]

I think you may have something there, Aussie...

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Clark, Wayne, Garcon and Addai are all very good players who can succeed without Manning playing. The Colts added 2 decent young linemen to their rotation. That's better than what they had in 2010.

You're hating on the Colts because they're the Colts.

No, I'm not. Addai was a FA this season coming off an 8 game season and he got no interest before re-signing with the Colts for relatively short money for a reason. Brown hasn't shown much in two seasons. Castonozo and Ijalana may become decent young linemen, although Polian's recent OL selection track record should give pause... Right now they are raw rookies who may start at LT and RT only because the Colts don't really have any better options...although a jag is currently ahead of Ijalana in the rotation... What the Colts had in 2010 wasn't very good WITH Manning healthy and playing a full season coming off a full off season of training together and developing continuity and timing. Three first time starters and a 10 year veteran RT playing out of position at guard doesn't give Saturday or whoever he's snapping to the warm and fuzzies...

 

[supafly]

No, I'm not. Addai was a FA this season coming off an 8 game season and he got no interest before re-signing with the Colts for relatively short money for a reason. Brown hasn't shown much in two seasons. Castonozo and Ijalana may become decent young linemen, although Polian's recent OL selection track record should give pause... Right now they are raw rookies who may start at LT and RT only because the Colts don't really have any better options...although a jag is currently ahead of Ijalana in the rotation... What the Colts had in 2010 wasn't very good WITH Manning healthy and playing a full season coming off a full off season of training together and developing continuity and timing. Three first time starters and a 10 year veteran RT playing out of position at guard doesn't give Saturday or whoever he's snapping to the warm and fuzzies...

All good points Mo, and I certainly hope that you're right. It's just somewhat hard for me personally, to write them off or expect them to have a lousy season. IMO, as long as Manning is there they have the best chance at winning the division.

To me, 10-6 is a realistic expectation, and does indeed symbolize the downturn of the team. I just don't have much faith in their divisional competition, that's all.

I just think that with Manning's quick release and WR/TE core, the offensive line woes won't be as significant as some think. Just one poster's opinion though, and I hope I am way off.

 

[ausbacker]

I think you may have something there, Aussie...

The connection being Gary Cole's disposition toward playing drunken characters in Hollywood. Maybe he's not in a "role" after all .

 

[ausbacker]

No, I'm not. Addai was a FA this season coming off an 8 game season and he got no interest before re-signing with the Colts for relatively short money for a reason. Brown hasn't shown much in two seasons. Castonozo and Ijalana may become decent young linemen, although Polian's recent OL selection track record should give pause... Right now they are raw rookies who may start at LT and RT only because the Colts don't really have any better options...although a jag is currently ahead of Ijalana in the rotation... What the Colts had in 2010 wasn't very good WITH Manning healthy and playing a full season coming off a full off season of training together and developing continuity and timing. Three first time starters and a 10 year veteran RT playing out of position at guard doesn't give Saturday or whoever he's snapping to the warm and fuzzies...

It doesn't, you're quite right but you're also discounting the potential that they could be OK. I happen to think the latter and am certainly not going to shed a tear for the job Polian has done with Indy's list, but I sure as hell am not writing them off because of it.

Kerry Collins gives them a chance to stay competitive in games, Curtis Painter is 0-16.

 

[Gumby]

The Colts have a pretty tough opening slate of games...

@Hou
Cle
Pit
@TB
KC

Save for maybe Cleveland, all those teams would be tough even with Manning at full health, let alone recovering or even off the field. Lots of good running teams versus a deeply flawed run defense. They lost @Hou last year, barely eked one out vs KC... might get ugly pretty quick if Manning's not up to snuff. Could lose 3 or 4 of those, never mind games @NO, @Bal, @NE, and vs Atl. Plus, they often split with Jac.

I'm expecting a tough season.

Agreed. If Manning is out first 5 weeks - I see 1-4.

Kerry Collins gives them a chance to stay competitive in games, Curtis Painter is 0-16.

Partially agree. Collins gives them an IMPROVED chance to stay competitive.

But dont see Painter necessarily taking them to 0-16.

A couple things I haven't seen mentioned is
1. Reggie Waynes comments: these are great - :bricks: He is defending painter and NOT looking forward to catching Collins passes.

We don't even know him, we ain't vanilla, man, we ain't no simple offense. So for him to can come in here and be the starter, I don't see it. I think that's a step back. ...."Who says Kerry's going to be the starter?" Wayne said. "Just because we bring him in doesn't mean he's the starter. He's got to learn too, right? Unless they gave him a playbook months ago, he's got to learn to.

"I don't care who you are, I mean I'm not going to let anyone just come in here and just push someone (like Painter) aside like you're that dog now, you know what I mean?" Wayne added.

2. painter's comments - he seems to have already gotten the corporate memo from Polian.

Either that or he is totally on planet MOON. He just totally stabbed PM in the back a bit with this (IMO). I mean for years we have been told how complex the offense the dolts run is and that it could ONLY be run by the I-M-GenIus OC on the field. Now painter says 'oh all the NFL offenses are the same.'

"He's a veteran guy, been around a while, I'm sure the terminology across the league isn't too different," Painter said. "I expect he'll come in and pick it up quite well."

3. My other question WHAT BECOMES OF THEIR 3/4d QBs? They have Orlovsky and Norton on their roster. How many spots can you hold on the final roster for QBs??? Doesn't that start to eat into your depth as well as the discussion about their poor drafting /development. Now that you pick up collins is another team gonna scoop up one of their developmental QBs. Again - another potential hit on their long-term succession plan/depth.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Agreed. If Manning is out first 5 weeks - I see 1-4.


Partially agree. Collins gives them an IMPROVED chance to stay competitive.

But dont see Painter necessarily taking them to 0-16.

A couple things I haven't seen mentioned is
1. Reggie Waynes comments: these are great - :bricks: He is defending painter and NOT looking forward to catching Collins passes.



2. painter's comments - he seems to have already gotten the corporate memo from Polian.

Either that or he is totally on planet MOON. He just totally stabbed PM in the back a bit with this (IMO). I mean for years we have been told how complex the offense the dolts run is and that it could ONLY be run by the I-M-GenIus OC on the field. Now painter says 'oh all the NFL offenses are the same.'


3. My other question WHAT BECOMES OF THEIR 3/4d QBs? They have Orlovsky and Norton on their roster. How many spots can you hold on the final roster for QBs??? Doesn't that start to eat into your depth as well as the discussion about their poor drafting /development. Now that you pick up collins is another team gonna scoop up one of their developmental QBs. Again - another potential hit on their long-term succession plan/depth.

I wouldn't worry too much about them losing any potential developmental QB's...Polian has yet to draft one outside of the first...

As for Wayne, what a knucklehead... They do run a simple offense. What makes it click and would make it difficult for any veteran backup to assimilate into is it being predicated on precision timing and the ability of the QB to diagnose defenses pre snap and run it seemlessly out of a no huddle...not to mention the ability to intimidate the hell out of defenses with all his often meaningless theatrics at the LOS...

As for their competition, I gave up on counting on them a long time ago... But absent Manning this Colts team as presently constructed would be lucky to win 5-6 games in any division - although when it comes to luck they have been known to have the proverbial horseshoe up their collective asses... With Manning back week 1 they are more likely to win 10-11 games. But if he's out for the first 2-3 and ends up coming back rusty I don't see them getting there... And the situation is ripe for Manning to be injured further if they aren't both careful and lucky.

Manning supposedly did a cap friendly deal - if you can call a 5 year $18M AAV that - with the caveat that Polian use the savings to upgrade his surrounding cast. Most of that savings is now going to his 11th hour backup. The rest went to extending a couple of existing players who have not been more than league average starters the last couple of seasons...

 

[sportsreport360]

I am glad to see Kerry Collins help the Colts out this season. This is the type of offense if he is asked to fill in he will do a nice job of spreading the ball out to different receivers. With expectations of him so low, I think he will surprise some people with the amount of ability he still has left.

 

[Clonamery]

I am glad to see Kerry Collins help the Colts out this season. This is the type of offense if he is asked to fill in he will do a nice job of spreading the ball out to different receivers. With expectations of him so low, I think he will surprise some people with the amount of ability he still has left.

Um, can the Colts run the ball? Can the OL keep him upright? If both of those answers are "yes" then okay he might work out.

 

[captain stone]

Did I not mention the Colts defense would be the problem, not Kerry Collins (assuming he plays to a similar level he has for his career)? There's too much offensive power with a suppose upgraded offensive line for the Colts offense to fail.

I'm sure Manning will be fine.

An OL of Saturday, Castonzo, Pollack, Ijalana (has he been starting their 2 pre-season games?)
& whoever could indeed be good, but it may take them time to really gel, like about 4 games.
By that time, and if PayaTon remains hors de combat, I still see them at 1-3, though I do acknowledge your example of PitsDirt from last year. The Stealers, however, were prob. better equipped, because of their stout defense & running game, to withstand the loss of their starting rapist (allegedly) QB better than the Clots & their indoor/Tampa-2/playing-with-a-lead defense & threadbare running game.

 

[patsinthesnow]

The Colts should be bad anyway when Peyton returns, I mean, this team has serious holes.

The offensive line is weak everywhere except C, as well as counting on a rookie to start on the line.

The RB core/running game will suck as usual, unless the rookie shows something.

The DTs are bad as usual.

The LB core is pretty bad, Angerer-Brackett-Wheeler.

The Colts didn't resign their #1 CB, they are left with a #1 CB being a 3rd year player coming off a season ending injury, the #2/#3 CBs are JAGs.

Ochocinco/Powers, Welker/Lacey, Branch/Tryon. Good luck with that.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Colt fans over on Coltfreaks are more polarized than if Irsay traded for Tebow...

This link posted in one of their threads has some interesting tidbits. I think Wayne is coming unglued in part because he's been unhappy with his deal for a couple of seasons and now it's his contract year... And because he plays for an organization where the tail wags the dog, although it's usually the Manning tail doing the wagging. He better hope Kerry is suddenly so motivated he can compress months of conditioning, film work, practice into 18 days... Or Peyton can compress it into even less... BTW injury guru Will Carroll has expressed concern over the timing on Manning's recovery.

Collins has a career 55.8 completion percentage and has thrown for 40,441 yards, 206 touchdowns and 195 interceptions. As the starter, Collins has led his team to the playoffs four times, including a Super Bowl appearance with the Giants in the 2000 season.

“Who says Kerry’s going to be the starter?” Wayne said. “Just because we bring him in doesn’t mean he’s the starter. He’s got to learn too, right? Unless they gave him a playbook months ago, he’s got to learn to.

“I don’t care who you are, I mean I’m not going to let anyone just come in here and just push someone (like Painter) aside like you’re that dog now, you know what I mean?” Wayne added.

Still, two huge questions remain.

How quickly can the 16-year veteran get up to speed in the Colts offense, which has traditionally relied on calls at the line of scrimmage? And did Collins rediscover his passion for the game in the past seven weeks?

“I have decided that while my desire to compete on Sundays is still and always will be there, my willingness to commit to the preparation necessary to play another season has waned to a level that I feel is no longer adequate to meet the demands of the position,” Collins said in announcing his retirement July 7.

Two weeks later, Collins said he had even considered retiring at the end of last season.

Colts agree to terms with ex-Giants QB Kerry Collins | SILive.com

 

[Rob0729]

The Colts are paying Collins $4 million to be a back up. Sounds like they expect Manning to miss some games. You typically don't pay a back up QB that much unless you really need a guy who can start a handful of games or possibly even more.

 

[NinjaZX6R]

Does anyone know why Manning decided to do the surgery in May instead of doing it in Feb?

 

[patchick]

Does anyone know why Manning decided to do the surgery in May instead of doing it in Feb?

AFAIK it's as simply as "you avoid scalpels to your spine unless/until you determine it's absolutely, positively necessary." I can't fault him for that.

OTOH, I can get a chuckle out of this article from May, chuckling over how the Patriots wasted a draft pick on Ryan Mallett while the Colts wisely understood that there's no point thinking about backup quarterbacks at this point:

Indy.com | Post: Bob Kravitz: There's no need to rush to replace Manning | Indianapolis, Indiana

 

[Clonamery]

AFAIK it's as simply as "you avoid scalpels to your spine unless/until you determine it's absolutely, positively necessary." I can't fault him for that.

OTOH, I can get a chuckle out of this article from May, chuckling over how the Patriots wasted a draft pick on Ryan Mallett while the Colts wisely understood that there's no point thinking about backup quarterbacks at this point:

Indy.com | Post: Bob Kravitz: There's no need to rush to replace Manning | Indianapolis, Indiana

It just goes to show you that you shouldn't talk about (BB) what you don't understand.

 

[NinjaZX6R]

AFAIK it's as simply as "you avoid scalpels to your spine unless/until you determine it's absolutely, positively necessary." I can't fault him for that.

OTOH, I can get a chuckle out of this article from May, chuckling over how the Patriots wasted a draft pick on Ryan Mallett while the Colts wisely understood that there's no point thinking about backup quarterbacks at this point:

Indy.com | Post: Bob Kravitz: There's no need to rush to replace Manning | Indianapolis, Indiana

Lol yeah. I remember Big Blue douche from Stampede Blue making fun of the fact that the Pats wasted a 3rd rounder on Mallet. Who is laughing now douche!

 

[patchick]

It just goes to show you that you shouldn't talk about (BB) what you don't understand.

The silliest part is the suggestion that the Pats invested their whole draft in Mallett:

That’s why, instead of drafting a Ryan Mallett, who may never take a snap as a member of the New England Patriots, the Colts surrounded Manning with two more offensive linemen; a defensive lineman; a bowling-ball third-and-short running back, and another defensive back.

Umm, yoo-hoo Mr. Kravitz, you know that Mallett was the FIFTH player they drafted, right? (Actually, he probably didn't realize that's possible. Because under Polian, the Colts have never -- yes, never -- drafted more than 2 players in the first 2 rounds.)

 

[Clonamery]

The silliest part is the suggestion that the Pats invested their whole draft in Mallett:



Umm, yoo-hoo Mr. Kravitz, you know that Mallett was the FIFTH player they drafted, right? (Actually, he probably didn't realize that's possible. Because under Polian, the Colts have never -- yes, never -- drafted more than 2 players in the first 2 rounds.)

Kravitz: Colts backup plan at quarterback is lacking | The Indianapolis Star | indystar.com

Plus there's this line of thinking.

 

[BradyFTW!]

The silliest part is the suggestion that the Pats invested their whole draft in Mallett:



Umm, yoo-hoo Mr. Kravitz, you know that Mallett was the FIFTH player they drafted, right? (Actually, he probably didn't realize that's possible. Because under Polian, the Colts have never -- yes, never -- drafted more than 2 players in the first 2 rounds.)

I always find it funny when someone perceives backups to be useless unless the starter gets injured. Even if Brady doesn't miss a game for the next 5 years, there will still have been value in having a capable backup during that time. Why? Because nobody could see the future and know that he wouldn't get hurt at the time. Football is a violent sport- the likelihood of any player on the field, including your QB, getting injured is high enough that not planning for it is just negligent.

Which makes Polian's mistake even more glaring, because Manning didn't get injured on the field. He didn't go from healthy to hurt instantly, and they were left scrambling because they lacked foresight. Even without foresight, this easily could have been addressed. Well over a month ago, it was known that Manning's rehab was going slowly and that he would miss a lot of (if not all of) training camp. There is absolutely no possible justification for not going out and getting a quarterback at that point, except for salary cap constraints combined with delusional faith in your QB's ability to will himself to heal.

The fact that someone who fails to understand such basic logic is paid to offer his opinion is kind of sad.