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Opposites attract

Discussion in 'Political Discussion' started by Patters, Apr 29, 2012.

  1. Patters

    Patters Moderator Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    In this forum, the reality is that almost never has a conservative complained about a conservative or a liberal about a liberal or a libertarian about a libertarian. At least 99% of the complaints concern a person with one point of view complaining about the person whose views they strongly disagree with. Right there, the complainant loses a degree of credibility.

    The fact is almost everyone who participates in this forum is looking for someone to argue with. It's rare that a poster gets into a conversation with a like-minded person. So, to those of you who think that PF13 and I should do more to punish those who violate rules, my guess is that the people you want us to punish are more often than not the people you spend the most time debating. Opposites attract.

    This will never be a forum of like-minded individuals. That's not the point. The point is that it's a place where people with very different views of the world can communicate. This is not a forum for those who hold grudges or for those who feel that getting a person banned is the same as winning an argument. This is a forum for discussion and debate. This is not a forum for politesse and the thin skinned. It's a forum for those who enjoy engaging in a bare knuckle verbal fight.

    While there are rules to prevent a complete breakdown, in general this forum has always been run in a laissez faire way. The only reason this forum has moderators is because some of the language and comments got so out of hand that several people actually left patsfans.com altogether, and Ian was either going to close the forum or appoint moderators. As moderators, our goal is to try to protect patsfans, not your individual and divergent sensibilities, and to the best of our ability that is what PF13 and I do.
  2. DarrylS

    DarrylS PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    The basic flaw of the moderation of this board, is that for some reason it has been believed that there should be a right vs. left moderator... instead of an intelligent moderator, someone who can univerally apply agreed upon rules and does not inflame posts that are by their very nature inflammatory.

    Until something like this happens the contentiousness, divisiveness and pettiness will continue...

    It is time for a change..
  3. PatsWSB47

    PatsWSB47 Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    To be honest if the rules were strictly enforced we'd all be gone.
  4. Nikolai

    Nikolai Football Atheist PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #54 Jersey

    I find the dichotomous moderation concept to be a bit flawed, but overall it seems to me that Patters and PF13 tend to be pretty fair and consistent.

    Flame on.
  5. cupofjoe1962

    cupofjoe1962 Rookie

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    Look's like you have been eliminated as a potential future mod candidate.
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2012
  6. DarrylS

    DarrylS PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Never aspired to such, but advocate for a change in the way things are done on this board..
  7. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign Rookie

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    For what the Poltical board is all about, I think the moderators have done an outstanding job.

    Most of the "Pettiness" is the complaining. Get rid of the complaining and this board won't be so petty. In politics, one must have a thick skin. This place should not be for the meek or sensitive.
  8. sdaniels7114

    sdaniels7114 Rookie

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    If you don't act until someone complains and then you spring into action, you are training people to complain.

    You can't say that this place is not for those who hold grudges and then turn around and hand out bans when the grudge holders come running to you.
  9. sdaniels7114

    sdaniels7114 Rookie

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    This is exactly what I'm talking about. I picked PR's ideas apart one too many times and so he ran to 13 and just about, but not quite, got me banned.

    How do I know this? Because PR told me so in a PM.

    If 13 doesn't respond then maybe PR doesn't fill his PM box up quite so much.


    Oh and PR about your comment about getting rid of the complainers? You know what they say about physicians healing themselves...
  10. DarrylS

    DarrylS PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Moderation has as much to do with setting the tone, as it has to do with dealing with issues that could be avoided if an appropriate tone was set.

    There is a lot of reaction, but not a whole lot of proactive behavior...
  11. Mrs.PatsFanInVa

    Mrs.PatsFanInVa PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #12 Jersey

    How much "credibility" can a person lose when, if they are complaining about some ad-hom remark, they can link you right back to the ad-hom remark?

    Do I lose "credibility" if I complain about Wolfpack calling me "stupid" but I do not complain about Darryl calling me "stupid," when, in fact, Darryl has never called me "stupid?"

    The fact is, Patters, that of course people are going to complain about those who hold opposing views - simply because they are the ones who are most likely to call them names and make blanket accusations about "the other side."

    As for "credibility" issues - I find it incredible that a moderator routinely calls other people liars and yet that same moderator routinely pings other posters who call someone else a liar and that seems to be just fine. (And yes, those posters who the moderator most often calls "liar" are generally of an opposing political viewpoint.)

    There are many people here, of opposing viewpoints, who do not engage in name calling and whiny-baby-picture-posting when involved in a discussion with one another.

    It's not like it can't be done. It can be and it often is.

    I see no reason it cannot be like that across the board if, and here's the big IF, the moderators take action on everyone and anyone who violates that ad-hom line and IF the moderators themselves stop engaging in the same sort of childish behaviour.
  12. PatsFanInEaglesLand

    PatsFanInEaglesLand Rookie

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    #37 Jersey

    I think it would help if we would make a rule that you have to have minimum participation in other football related sub-forums on this board.

    This is patsfans, not wifeofapatsfan or oldmaninnewenglandwithgoogle
  13. PatsFanInEaglesLand

    PatsFanInEaglesLand Rookie

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    #37 Jersey

    EDIT: Never mind.
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2012
  14. Harry Boy

    Harry Boy Look Up, It's Amazing PatsFans.com Supporter

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    LOON FORUM

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    "thank you, i love you"
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    "i hate sarah"
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    "i love obama"
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    Last edited: Apr 30, 2012
  15. PatsWSB47

    PatsWSB47 Rookie

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    #12 Jersey

    Of course that's right when one is on the receiving end of the attack. The way I read Patters was that he believes that complaints about lying for example come from people on the other side even when the charge isn't against them. If Wolfpack is participating in a thread where he sees another conservative spreading an obvious lie then he'll likely look the other way at least publicly. I think both sides are guilty of that. I'm not trying to single out lying, but name calling, racist charges, throwing hitler around, etc. If I only complain about the other side and look the other way when my side is acting the same way then my credibility...no my actual complaints may be credible but the outrage for the offense rings a little bit hollow.

    I'm not trying to attack anyone, just trying to keep it real.

    I do agree that the moderators should set the tone better, but it's on all of us to keep things more civil.
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2012
  16. shmessy

    shmessy Maude Staff Member PatsFans.com Supporter

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    #75 Jersey

    NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    There is no desire to have some of this forum's characters on this website's main forum.

    Let's face it - - this forum is the Island of Lost Toys for Patsfans.com.

    Ian has this for one reason and one reason only - - to keep all political detritus off the main forum.

    It is the same reasoning why you don't put max-security prisons, porn shops or biological weapons labs in neighborhoods.
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2012
  17. Drewski

    Drewski Rookie

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    No Jersey Selected

    Bahahahahaha.....love the analogy Shmessy.
  18. PatriotsReign

    PatriotsReign Rookie

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    Let us all know what ideas you "picked apart" in your imagination.

    But I do recall you changing a post of mine you quoted....So is this the pm sequence you're referring to?

    Now I LIKE the fact I'm in your head as "one of them"...where you're irrelevant to me.

    What was it I said about meek and sensitive people? :D
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2012
  19. PatsFanInEaglesLand

    PatsFanInEaglesLand Rookie

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    #37 Jersey

    Oh ok, I get what you're saying.

    I just find it silly to be on here, when you're either not a fan of this team or football in general.

    I actually think some of those that I disagree with most here on the political forum, I find that I agree with them almost 100% on actual Patriots topics. You, Jack Bauer, Darryl and Vap's.

    This shouldn't get personal, we are all here in commonality. THE PATRIOTS.
  20. DarrylS

    DarrylS PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Except in Canada the only country that I have ever visited with a cathedral on one corner and a sex shop across the street... not a bad idea.

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