Welcome to PatsFans.com

Ok, so we have some problems. Will personnel moves really help?

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by JSn, Oct 13, 2008.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. JSn

    JSn Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2008
    Messages:
    7,449
    Likes Received:
    32
    Ratings:
    +33 / 0 / -0

    What do you guys think? Will emergency additions at any positions do much to help us at this point, or do we just need coaching and such to step up and get creative?

    I think it'd be great if we could get better in the secondary and it'd be lovely is Cassel would be more decisive and at a faster pace.

    Thing is, the D got NO pressure tonight and NO sacks. Is it a scheming problem or personnel? I think it's both and the secondary will always look better with pressure on the QB all game long.

    I also think the offensive play calling was... offensive. We're trying to run and short-pass our way to a comeback and it's not gonna happen that way.

    So for everyone looking for some magical trade or signing to happen... maybe there are some coaching issues that need to be sorted out that can make our current team look a lot better?

    The offensive game was so brutal. If we can put up 30+ points regularly, we're still contenders. If not, we're out. I think it's that simple and I kinda think scheming is the biggest knock on last night's game.
     
    Last edited: Oct 13, 2008
  2. BlitzFritz

    BlitzFritz Third String But Playing on Special Teams

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2006
    Messages:
    734
    Likes Received:
    4
    Ratings:
    +4 / 0 / -0

    YES

    - i would take out cassel and put in o'connell. i am dead serious. o'connell cannot be worse that cassel, and even tho he will struggle, his potential is greater. jeez
    - we need help on the o-line -- stephen neal returning, i dont know. kaszur is hurt pretty bad i am guessing
    - our secondary is no surprise weak. deltha oneil is ok but hes not that fast, and we signed him the last week ffs. i think you have to put in wheatley soon and let him develop.

    as far as trades, i dont see it happening. if poss, a qb or a cb.

    its bleak, we look extremely shaky to make the playoffs
     
  3. NJPatsfan26

    NJPatsfan26 In the Starting Line-Up

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2008
    Messages:
    2,533
    Likes Received:
    7
    Ratings:
    +17 / 0 / -0

    NO..

    Personnel moves this late into a season would not be helpful.

    We as a team need to step up and show the rest of the NFL that we are still contenders.

    Whether that means stepping up on scheming from the coaches, or being able to put up more than 30 points in a game, it needs to be done.

    I agree that after we loss TFB for the season, most if not all of the plays and plans that BB and co had, needed to be changed and revamped.

    So, JSn, I think your right. We need the coaching issues that we have seen to be corrected first.
     
  4. fumbrunner

    fumbrunner In the Starting Line-Up

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2006
    Messages:
    2,000
    Likes Received:
    8
    Ratings:
    +16 / 0 / -0

    scheming was part of the issue but Cassel stinks, period. The offense did nothing to help the defense. As for the D, not sure why the DBs were giving up those long receptions. Oneil has been good this year but was awful last night.

    I hope people stop comparing Cassel to Brady circa 2001. Brady didnt have great numbers, but did enough to win, every game. Cassel, well its understandable why he hasnt started since high school. What a waste having him on the roster for so long.
     
  5. MoLewisrocks

    MoLewisrocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2005
    Messages:
    19,949
    Likes Received:
    29
    Ratings:
    +29 / 0 / -0

    I'm sorry and hate to burst a bubble but few prognosticators expected this team to routinely put up 30+ points with Brady this season. Teams adjusted down the stretch. The blueprint won't work for everyone but it will work to some extent for teams with the personnel to give it a go. SD wasn't supposed to be one of those absent Merriman but they were getting pressure up the middle last night - because the exploitable flaws are a lot deeper than most folks and perhaps even the team wanted to admit.

    That said 12-4 would have been what I'd have expected for a Brady led team. If this team gets to double digit wins I would be satisfied regardless of where that leaves them. A two game dropoff absent a HOF QB...how could you quibble, they don't call 'em HOF'ers for nothing. The real underlying issues require the kind of additions you can't get in October in the NFL. The team can still improve absent them via coaching and development and teambuilding, and will need to just to get to double digit wins.

    I think the offensive game plan was fine last night - take what they give you and SD was weak underneath without Merriman. Problem was execution. Particularly at or approachihg the red zone. As it most often is when wins don't result. Defense was a little different as our game plan (stopping the run and containing the RB's and TE's underneath and let Rivers try to beat you on third and long absent Chambers) didn't mesh with SD's plans (aggressive pass first and deep passing offense on first and second downs).
     
  6. PromisedLand

    PromisedLand Virtual Internet Person

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    3,372
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    I think it is too early to start playing for next year, which is what you are doing by putting in young guys to help their development and evaluate their potential, but if Cassel and company haven't improved significantly over the next 4 or 5 week (and we are under 0.500) then I will agree with you.
     
  7. DefenseRules

    DefenseRules Pro Bowl Player

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2005
    Messages:
    10,266
    Likes Received:
    67
    Ratings:
    +238 / 7 / -1

    #12 Jersey

    Can we change Coordinators? I refuse to believe that our personnel is this bad. I am starting to look at our two Coordinators. Mcdaniel's ability to adjust is atrocious, and his playcalling isn't very good either. As for Deen Peas, his defense is quietly having an abysmal season. Go check the statistical breakdown of this defense. It's not pretty. Did our defensive line even touch Rivers once yesterday? Did they even hurry him? I can't believe that our players are this bad. I blame the coaching.
     
  8. MoLewisrocks

    MoLewisrocks PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2005
    Messages:
    19,949
    Likes Received:
    29
    Ratings:
    +29 / 0 / -0

    If you want to blame the coaching in this system then you're blaming Bill - he develops that game plan. His call was to stop the run and the RB and TE yardage which was really not working for SD through 5 games. Norv changed their entire approach this week to an agressive deep passing on first and second downs as opposed to running into long yardage on 3rd downs one...

    The offensive game plan and play calls were fine for the most part, the execution was abyssmal starting with the usual suspects and no one had a particularly great night. Bill's fingerprints remain on the offense as well. He's a conservative HC by nature, only deviating in 2007 because of the match made in heaven he had with Brady and Moss. But that failed him when it mattered most so... With a young QB he is back to conservative, ball control, ball security, take what you're given offense. Hard to run that with an inconsistent OL and RB by committee dependent on health. Veterans need to step up with consistency given the circumstances and they simply are not.
     
  9. Ghost of Ben Dreith

    Ghost of Ben Dreith Third String But Playing on Special Teams

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2006
    Messages:
    978
    Likes Received:
    1
    Ratings:
    +1 / 0 / -0

    I don't see how personnel changes would help at this point. The talent is there, I just start to wonder if its willing to pay the price (hello Seymore...).

    As far as the secondary, O'Neal had good coverage on 2 of the long completions. He was right there, but 5'11" against a 6'5" will produce those results often.

    I think the bigger cuplrit in the secondary's toasting is the lack of pressure on the QB. It has been an issue since late last year and continues this year.
     
  10. DefenseRules

    DefenseRules Pro Bowl Player

    Joined:
    Aug 22, 2005
    Messages:
    10,266
    Likes Received:
    67
    Ratings:
    +238 / 7 / -1

    #12 Jersey

    I agree with you and yes I'm blaming BB for some of this. He hired both coordinators. Yes, our veterans are under performing, but I still think that the scheme is an issue, ESPECIALLY ON DEFENSE. Where is the Pass Rush? Our secondary needs some help.
     
  11. PATSYLICIOUS

    PATSYLICIOUS Pro Bowl Player

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2007
    Messages:
    11,097
    Likes Received:
    27
    Ratings:
    +97 / 0 / -1

    #12 Jersey

    Moves I would like to see:
    Sign Law
    Sign Seau
    Replace McDaniels. With anybody/anything. Put headsets on a coffee mug and let it sit on the sidelines for all I care. Anything that doesn't include passing 3 times from the 1 yard line with a backup QB.
    New punter. Again, anybody/anything. Line drive punt to one of the most dangerous returners in the league, after SD was charged a penalty and we had a chance to make up for a poorly covered punt. At least he finally got 1 inside the 20 hey 1 outta 50 aint bad.
    I would say get help on the OL but I have no idea what's out there if anything is.
     
  12. mgteich

    mgteich PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2004
    Messages:
    21,027
    Likes Received:
    146
    Ratings:
    +391 / 33 / -5

    OFFENSIVE LINE AND TIGHT END
    Neal and Levoir/Ross will likely replace Yates and Kaczur. I'd rather add a blocking TE, but I guess we have nothing better than our two out there, and Hochstein on short yardage. We need one of the TE's to reliable chip and help out the OT's. Unfortunately, this OL (as all others) need a QB who feels the pocket and take an appropriate step when need. Cassel will learn on the job, but it might take a few more games.

    QUARTERBACK
    I think that it is too late for the next few games, although I still believe that someone should be picked up in case Cassel is injured. If we are still in the playoff hunt, and we are, then we should maximize our chances of getting there. The front office didn't want Gutierrez on the 53 to start the season. He isn't of much use now.

    FRONT SEVEN
    I would bring in an ILB in case of injury or even someone to include in the rotation against the run. Yes there is one available who knows our system.

    DEFENSIVE BACKS
    I think that we are what we are. There are two days to consider trades. A trade could help, but one seems unlikely. The DB's are banged up. If we need help, we'll bring up Spann or Richardson. I think that Law would help, but I am in no position to judge. He may have nothing left in the tank. I trust Belichick's judgment on this. Maybe there is a Poteat type out there that could be brought in, probably not.
    =================================================
    BOTTOM LINE

    The bottom line is that Belichick will continue to make normal tweaks to the roster. We'll know more by weekend with regard to trades (the deadline will pass) and perhaps with regard to health. We will also be anxiously awaiting Neal to be the saviour of the OL. This won't happen, because the problem is not Yates.

    And just possibly, the loss of the SB and the loss of Brady is more than this team can take this year.
     
  13. Rob0729

    Rob0729 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2006
    Messages:
    31,026
    Likes Received:
    566
    Ratings:
    +1,708 / 16 / -5

    You do realize teams have been scoring on the Chargers and quickly all season with the short passing game. Going into this game, the Charger's defense biggest weakness has been the short passing game. I thought the gameplan was solid, the execution was bad.
     
  14. Rob0729

    Rob0729 PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2006
    Messages:
    31,026
    Likes Received:
    566
    Ratings:
    +1,708 / 16 / -5

    So you think it would have been a better idea to run up the middle four times with Jamal Williams totally owning Koppen all game? If they replaced Koppen last night, I might have agreed with you. But I personally was tired of watching Koppen getting knocked on his arse.
     
  15. MrBigglesWorth

    MrBigglesWorth Veteran Starter w/Big Long Term Deal

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2006
    Messages:
    8,338
    Likes Received:
    16
    Ratings:
    +16 / 0 / -0

    I don't expect 30 points. you won't see that many times.

    I expect more than 3 pts in a half.

    and I think we need to expect a pressure defense as they need to create turnovers. I think we need to see Crable. and more blitzing.

    our great d-line hasn't really pressured. who knows why if it's scheme. if most of them are getting doubled.

    the d can't give up over 20 pts a game.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page

unset ($sidebar_block_show); ?>