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OK, how would you try and stop the Pats?

Discussion in 'PatsFans.com - Patriots Fan Forum' started by BradyManny, Nov 21, 2007.

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  1. BradyManny

    BradyManny Rookie

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    Madden sounded off recently on how he would try to stop the Pats (btw, is it just me, or is Madden getting back to being a good commentator as opposed to a caricature of himself?) - basically, and I think I've heard this elsewhere, the idea is "get a good rush with 4 and put the rest in coverage", and he adds that he'd be ultra-aggressive on offense.

    Brilliant Gregg Easterbrook thinks man coverage is the solution to stopping Moss (and then in turn the Pats).

    What say you? How would you try and stop this offense? Honestly, I have no idea. No matter what a D does, the Pats have a way to counter it. The only hope is having a defense fast enough to execute a sound game plan to somewhat slow the team down (Colts), and there are only a few teams that can do that.
  2. BradyManny

    BradyManny Rookie

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    Also, for those that say running the ball is a weakness of ours, let me point out that we are 5th in rushing yards per game, 6th in rushing TDs, & 10th in YPC. Not bad for a "weakness".
  3. danny88

    danny88 Banned

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    Most of those stats are garbage time running stats. Or when we are up by a large margin. It should concern you. This team has not ran the ball as the main offensive focus at all. Which is fine. We should stick with what is working.

    When the weather gets bad we will see how it goes.
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2007
  4. JoeSixPat

    JoeSixPat Rookie

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    Word has it that Al Davis is engaging in some ethically questionable cloning technology that would bring back Red Grange from the dead as well as other football greats.

    It's slightly premature to know for sure, but I'd say this approach has as good a shot as any of succeeding, though Davis reportedly won't have his players fully grown until the 2008.

    So for 2007, there's really no stopping the Pats.
  5. Tunescribe

    Tunescribe PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    On defense: The only solution is man coverage and pressuring Brady. Period. Problem is, no one can match up. Colts and Cowboys have come closest to making it work so far.

    On offense: Strong running game and passing attack that picks on the linebackers. Colts and Cowboys again ... maybe Steelers.
  6. BradyManny

    BradyManny Rookie

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    As discussed elsewhere, there truly is no garbage time for this team. The "60 minute men" are playing hard all game, and thus I'm not going to discount things that happen when the game is out of hand.
  7. Satchboogie3

    Satchboogie3 Rookie

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    Best way to stop the Pats? Either break the cap rule and try to get lots of tallent, or don't show up and just forfeit the game.
  8. BWareofDWare

    BWareofDWare Rookie

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    The best way to stop any team is by being able to rush 4 and get pressure with it. When you think about it, that means you've got 4 guys on defense beating 5 offensive lineman, and them plus the quarterback means 7 guys on defense covering 5 receiving options. You'll pretty much beat any team if you can do this, the only problem is it's a lot easier said than done, especially with the Pats offensive line.
  9. BradyManny

    BradyManny Rookie

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    Yeah, except I don't even think the Cowboys were that close. And the Colts did a damn good job, but even then, they were only that close b/c of great play-making. Two otherwise successful drives were stopped by great plays by them, and poor plays by the Pats (the two INTs). You can't discount them, but you also can't discount the fact that the Pats were driving well both times.
  10. AndyJohnson

    AndyJohnson PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    How are they garbage time stats? Do you have a breakdown, or are you guessing at that?
    What is our yards per rush in the first half vs the 2nd? Behind or ahead by 14 or less vs ahead by 14+?

    This team has not TRIED TO run the ball as the main offensive focus. That is not a negative. We have run the ball very effectively. We are on the way to being the highest scoring offense ever. To say we should be concerned about the 5th ranked running game, because you want us to be, with nothing to back it up, is lame.
  11. hambone1818

    hambone1818 Rookie

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    18 guys on the field? I don't know...I really don't think they can be 'stopped'. Certainly a team might be able to slow this offense down, but outright stopping them just ain't gonna happen.

    If it were me, I'd go conservative and try to just slow the offense down rather than stop it. Play a prevent-type defense the entire game, let them beat you with Maroney, and Welker and Watson across the middle. At least that way you're keeping some points off the board by just not allowing the offense as many possessions. Then maybe, just maybe, you get a pick or fumble recovery.

    This strategy, of course, assumes that the team employing it also has a very good offense. It'd have to be a tit-for-tat game, and you'd be hoping for that one big break (turnover, return TD) that puts you over the top.

    The problem I have with Madden's idea is that Brady is even more deadly under pressure. The numbers this season show that when defenses blitz he absolutely demolishes them, because he has such great vision and pocket presence that he unloads before you have a chance and then your secondary is left shortmanned against some very, very good receivers.
  12. mosi

    mosi Rookie

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    I would let the Pats run the ball. Rush 3 and have 8 defensive backs on the field.

    Make the Pats run to ball to beat you.

    On offense, spread the field and make the Pats run after you. Go no huddle and make the Pats front 7 run all over the field.
  13. Pass_The_Rum

    Pass_The_Rum Rookie

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    First off, I'd prefer Jacksonville or Pittsburgh as my Pats-fighting team. Someone physical and tough.

    Preach 60 minutes to your team and defer the kick if you win. Let the Patriots have it first.

    Defensively, I'd go with a 3-3-5 nickel package as my base defense. Blitz one to bring a 4 man rush. 5 in zone coverage and 2 going man-to-man to double up on Moss and either Welker or Stallworth depending on down-and-distance.

    On offense I eat the clock right from the start, if possible. Be very, very dull, go for it on 4th and shorts from the start, but otherwise be fairly vanilla offensively in the first half. Try a trick play to open the second half, then get more aggressive. The idea here is to play the game 'backwards' - kill the clock in the first half to make it as short as possible and then run your 'real' offense after halftime in order to minimize Belicheck's ability to make adjustments.

    I don't think it stands much chance, either, but I think it might do some good.
  14. bakes781

    bakes781 Rookie

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    I believe it was Ditka who suggested having the more physical safeties press the receivers & leave the cover corners back to play deep in coverage. This makes sense to me. But then I suppose you're leaving yourself vulnerable to long gains in the running game. Dare the Pats to run the ball I guess.
  15. AndyJohnson

    AndyJohnson PatsFans.com Veteran PatsFans.com Supporter

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    I would disguise everything. I'd take advantage of Bradys intelligence by showing a coverage that he will read properly but not play that coverage after the snap.
    I would have a 'spy'. Not the spy to stop QB scrambles, but a designated DB on every play who begins coverage on oen receiver but breaks off, and undercuts another one. I'd be willing to give up the big play to get the big play.
    I would rush from different places, with each of my 11 guys at different times.
    I would overload my front 7 with 4-5 guys on one side of the ball all blitzing so there was no way to pick it up.
    I'd hope for some good bounces.
  16. danny88

    danny88 Banned

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    Lame huh? Ok Einstein. Tell me what the pats do if faulk is hurt , maroney is banged up and its snowing like a bastard vs the colts?

    If you dont think we have a slight concern with the run game you are to much of a homer to see why anyway. The pats running game is one injury away from being ultra thin. Maroney has proven to be inconsistant and injury prone this year. If faulk goes down there are issues.
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2007
  17. richpats

    richpats Banned

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    You'd need a team that excels "in all 3 phases" has Belichick would say. The offense and defense would have to keep us off-balance, able to make big plays (deep ball, force turnovers) and their special teams would have to be AMAZING on returns (because we're good on coverage) and suffocating in coverage on our returns.

    A healthy Colts squad would matchup the best, but their special teams coverage stinks and it shows. Things being as they are injury-wise, the Colts aren't much of a threat....especially in Foxboro ;)

    Jacksonville? Pittsburgh? Please. These teams haven't changed much over the years and we've beaten them with far less talented teams.

    Dallas is as close as you can get to a challenge and will likely be our opponent in the Super Bowl.

    The major advantage NE has over these teams is the "60-minute" mentality. The Colts challenged us for 51, Dallas for about 37. If a team can take NE for a full 60, then they've got a shot.
  18. JR4

    JR4 In the Starting Line-up PatsFans.com Supporter

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    If a team has a good secondary with depth then
    maybe 6 dbs on field all the time. Try to force the PATs
    to run it. Dbs will have be quick enough to give run support
    as needed. Didn't Colts do this to some extent?
    Got to have good pass rushers as well.

    If I could design a team to counter PATs it would be characterized by:
    1. Execellent Secondary with depth.
    2. Outstanding pass rushers.
    3. Great Blitzing team.
    4. A solid Dline that can't be muscled easily.
    5. Great run game to keep drives going
    6. Good enough pass game to keep PATs from stuffing the box.
    7. A great Defensive Coordinator

    Actually the Colts if healthy would be a close fit.
    Add a little quality depth to their secondary and improve
    the interior of their Dline and they would be close if Manning
    gets his receivers back.

    Without the right players and coaching I dont think a team can stop the PATs.
    The best Scheme in the world can't do it without the right players.

    Even Belichick couldn't stop the PATs without the right players.
    If there is a Defense that could consistently stop the PATs it would one of
    the best defenses ever.
  19. bakes781

    bakes781 Rookie

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    Yeah the Colts play very deep, but with their speed they can afford to.
  20. PatsWickedPissah

    PatsWickedPissah PatsFans.com Supporter PatsFans.com Supporter

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    Why not do what Brady said the Colts did that caused the Patriots offense lots of problems?

    The Colts had a good pash rush. They committed to the rush. The other aspect of their D that caused Brady problems was that they played his wideouts close coming off the LOS, probably using OLBs as well. That strategy made the quick pass option less viable. As long as the pass rush was intense and the short passing attack somewhat covered, the plan works well. Once the passruch drops off, Brady has easy (for him) downfield targets.

    One crit I have of Josh McD is that specificly in the Dallas game he did not start off using the big fat Brady as extra protection for the tall skinny Brady. At Dallas Tom Brady got hammered untill they beefed up the pass protection. I think but I'm not sure that he also didn't use Kyle Brady much at first in the Colts game as well. One less wideout should not be a problem given the wideouts we do have and Tom Brady at QB. (This comment does not mean never run the 17 wide formation that Brady executes so well.)
    Last edited: Nov 21, 2007
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